Who was the other "in house" candidate? John Guy?

[BADOLBILZ]

Ralph tells me as much as he tells you, Mister 225 posts.

 

PTR

 

Then how do you know that Modrak was the other candidate and that Guy was just interviewed as a "Rooney Rule" fulfillment? Ralph said only one other in house guy was considered. Modrak + Guy = 2.

 

If you don't have something to say that even makes a bit of sense, why do you say anything? Answer: you like reading your posts and acting like a know it all. Truth is, if you actually believe the NONSENSE that you post(which seems impossible), you couldn't know much less.

[Nevergiveup]

I'll believe it when I see it. It's been 30 years since RW when with the big name HC.

 

 

Buddy is the perfect guy if you want a big name coach. He won't be interested in doing the coaches job. Just loading up the team with talent. Whether or not they get the big coach remains to be seen, but their pursuit of Gruden and Shanahan has to be viewed as a positive sign. First time they have ever gone after 2 coaches like that.

[BADOLBILZ]

I'll believe it when I see it. It's been 30 years since RW when with the big name HC.

 

Most of us are hoping that they do land a guy like Cowher, but even if they do it doesn't necessarily make the Nix hire a good one. Some people are assuming it's a combination deal. I'm like you, I'll believe it when I see it. And we've put up with enough bad football the past 10 years, we don't need to throw a parade.

 

It's AT BEST a "wait and hope" situation and should not be met with glee because in and of itself, the Nix hiring is more of the same. That's not absolutely bad, but it's the same path that has lead to a decade of failure on the field.

 

I'll say it again, Modrak was by all accounts an outstanding personnel man in Pittsburgh and Philly. He's been a failure as a half hearted de facto head of personnel(or whatever you want to call his role). Marv is a HOF coach. He was a tired old shadow of himself in the GM role. We didn't get those guys when they were good. We got the semi-retired, and unretired versions. Are we getting the same Buddy Nix that did such a good job in SD, or the geriatric post retirement version? Buddy Nix is a good football man. But so is Dan Reeves or Don Shula. Do I want them as new Bills HC? No. It's a young man's game and Buddy is going to have all he can do to keep up with the pack let alone turn this into a winning football team.

[GrudginglyPessimistic]

There is one time the Rooney Rule that worked.

 

I think that this view does not take into account that the Rooney rule is only a PART of what needs to be a comprehensive approach by the NFL if it is going to successfully beat back the gross and stupid discrimination which was wrought through NFL devotion to the good ol boy network of making HC decisions.

 

The Rooney Rule is actually fairly new to the NFL and we are talking about a pool of 32 jobs of which maybe 6 are open each year. Actually finding simply one success (particularly an outstanding one where not only is a minority HC hired but he leads his team to an SB win) is a great record of success in this short time.

 

If the NFL is going to depend solely upon a change like the Rooney rule to solve the problem of the NFL hurting itself by simply not hiring qualified candidates it will fail. Fortunately, the NFL also is instituting other efforts like the long running internship program for minority assistant coaches, requiring the Rooney Rule for interviews not only apply to high profile HC interviews but also to even higher level GM interviews and lower level co-ordinator interviews, the NFL is building the stock of minority candidates for HC positions by getting more athletes moved to the coaching ranks with internships as low level coaches and then seeing more of them get promoted up the ranks by requiring interviews.

 

Actually, in retrospect you had told me that the first success of a type of the Rooneys hiring a Tomlin did not occur until 10 years into the program I would have said that sounds about right. In real life I think in terms of accomplishments the Rooney Rule is ahead of the curve.

 

I think in part this is because there actually is a well-spring of qualified HC applicants of color like the Tony Dungys of the world whom for years the NFL had discriminated against these individuals by delaying them receiving deserved HC jobs for years until they got them. Even worse even when they broke through these men who happened to be of minority heritage were held to a far higher standard of success and got canned despite some pretty good accomplishments. Men such as Art Shell then were not given a second job while idiots like Rich Kotite were delivered second bites at the HC apple even though they failed massively in their first jobs while folks like Shell at least showed good success before he got canned.

 

I think the Rooney Rule has worked well with even this one demonstrable success happening so quickly because another example of the NFL taking it seriously was when they fined Matt Millen and Detroit heavily for flat out ignoring it because the good ol boy network had already picked retread Mariucci (who then failed and got canned) forthe job. This success let NFL owners know to take the Rooney Rule more seriously and the outcome was likely that seen in Pitts.

 

True. there may be cases like stick in the mud old guard like Mr. Ralph meet the letter of the rule by holding interviews with clear failures like Guy. It likely is only possible to enforce and fine in even more virulent cases like Detroit with Millen/Mariucci.

 

However, ironically, the Bills may be helping the Rooney Rule approach by demonstrating clearly that the Bills and Mr. Ralph's devotion to hiring good old Golden Boys like oldster Marv and potentially the geriatric Nix does not seem to be producing good results.

 

We will see.

[BADOLBILZ]

Buddy is the perfect guy if you want a big name coach. He won't be interested in doing the coaches job. Just loading up the team with talent. Whether or not they get the big coach remains to be seen, but their pursuit of Gruden and Shanahan has to be viewed as a positive sign. First time they have ever gone after 2 coaches like that.

 

Insert "might be" between "Buddy" and "is" and you have a legitimate, height of optimism post. Declaring a 70 year old, never been a GM without a past history of hiring coaches, etc.. a perfect fit is blind optimism. I know where you guys are coming from, I'm green with envy at the job Butler/AJ/Nix and other former Bills scouts have done in SD so I was thrilled to get Nix as an assistant last offseason. But you can be supportive of the franchise without lying to yourself about the managment. They don't deserve the benefit of the doubt and this is definitely one of those situations where they are asking for it. Any time every member of management has to preface their official word on a move with "I know the fans and media might be disappointed" they are basically asking for the benefit of the doubt.

[jester43]

Any time every member of management has to preface their official word on a move with "I know the fans and media might be disappointed" they are basically asking for the benefit of the doubt.

exactly...because they know damn well they didn't do what they told the fans they were going to do...which was to do an actual search for a GM. it's such horse ****.

[Sisyphean Bills]

The most optimistic view is that Nix was bull rushed into the GM office before the end of the season because the Bills management (Burns and Smithers) have some detailed plan and this was just the first phase. The optimist assumes it will just go like clockwork at this point: a solid head coach, great OC, great DC, an excellent SAC, ...

 

But, if you listen to the press conference, it belies this blind optimism. Nix, up until yesterday, wasn't part of the process of evaluating the organization. He wasn't part of the process of finding the next coach. He knows there was a list made by Russ and he's going to get started on things. In fact, the timing and "search" suggest more of a process by accident. About a week ago, Russ Wilson asks Buddy if he has any interest in becoming GM. After "a whirlwind" and some "building excitement", a surprised Nix accepts the GM-ship and is thrust out in front of the media.

 

After sitting on their thumbs and making no press conferences since Jauron was unpersoned, the Bills hastily announce their in-house "search" is concluded, the evaluation of the entire operation led to a couple of promotions, and before other franchises jump on the merry-go-round looking for front office execs, the Bills jump off. Hmm.

[Nevergiveup]

Insert "might be" between "Buddy" and "is" and you have a legitimate, height of optimism post. Declaring a 70 year old, never been a GM without a past history of hiring coaches, etc.. a perfect fit is blind optimism. I know where you guys are coming from, I'm green with envy at the job Butler/AJ/Nix and other former Bills scouts have done in SD so I was thrilled to get Nix as an assistant last offseason. But you can be supportive of the franchise without lying to yourself about the managment. They don't deserve the benefit of the doubt and this is definitely one of those situations where they are asking for it. Any time every member of management has to preface their official word on a move with "I know the fans and media might be disappointed" they are basically asking for the benefit of the doubt.

 

 

I don't disagree with you about being skeptical. Just stating that Gruden and Shanahan are alot more accomplished than any candidates that they have previously chased. It will be tough for the team to secure that type of coach, but if they do, I like the combination. I don't think I am lying to myself. If they have pursued coaches of this caliber before, let me know when that was. At least they are making the effort. Sorry for being too positive.

[BADOLBILZ]

exactly...because they know damn well they didn't do what they told the fans they were going to do...which was to do an actual search for a GM. it's such horse ****.

 

The PC was a squirming mess. I find it funny that JK and Thurman were involved considering all of the "twittering" going on about big things coming that will make the fans happy. Uh, this wasn't it and they admitted as much. They're both like "maybe Buddy knows Bill Cowher". OMG. And great point about Ralph acting like he's the sheriff coming in to clean up the town. He hired all these failures. The unbelievable part is the amount of people who lap it up and are refreshed merely by a bunch of lip service and deck shuffling. I think they could hired John Guy as the GM, spun it around a little, brought in Thurman and JK and a good portion of the fan base would be loving them some John Guy.

 

It's possible that they could get Cowher. It's possible that Nix and his staff could repeat the personnel success SD had this decade. But Ralph is right about one thing, it's going to take a lot of luck because they aren't going about this turnaround in a pro-active or logical manner.

[BADOLBILZ]

The most optimistic view is that Nix was bull rushed into the GM office before the end of the season because the Bills management (Burns and Smithers) have some detailed plan and this was just the first phase. The optimist assumes it will just go like clockwork at this point: a solid head coach, great OC, great DC, an excellent SAC, ...

 

But, if you listen to the press conference, it belies this blind optimism. Nix, up until yesterday, wasn't part of the process of evaluating the organization. He wasn't part of the process of finding the next coach. He knows there was a list made by Russ and he's going to get started on things. In fact, the timing and "search" suggest more of a process by accident. About a week ago, Russ Wilson asks Buddy if he has any interest in becoming GM. After "a whirlwind" and some "building excitement", a surprised Nix accepts the GM-ship and is thrust out in front of the media.

 

After sitting on their thumbs and making no press conferences since Jauron was unpersoned, the Bills hastily announce their in-house "search" is concluded, the evaluation of the entire operation led to a couple of promotions, and before other franchises jump on the merry-go-round looking for front office execs, the Bills jump off. Hmm.

 

Well said. Wish it weren't true, but on the surface this move REEEKS of the decade of fail. The whirlwind hiring of Levy went the same way, then the retirement of Levy and promotion of Brandon. Like you said, Nix wasn't part of the evaluation of potential HC's, and now he is supposed to hire one? Does Brandon have so little credibility that they decided to try bringing someone else in to get candidates even interested? Couldn't Nix have just helped find a coach and or GM candidate?......and if they found a good match the HC and GM could have been announced together, with the GM being Nix if the fit were right? It's perplexing, like most of the things the Bills do, which is to almost always not good.

[spartacus]

There were no other outside the organization candidates considered. We know this because none were interviewed and the NFL regular season hasn't yet concluded. It doesn't matter if they had a list. Nix said this was a whirlwind thing, which I'm guessing started within the past week and grew. They made their decision in the past 10 days, which leaves little time.

 

There is no question they had no intention of going outside the organization.

 

since the Bills felt no need to go outside the organization, why it take them this long to hire Buddy after firing Dick if he was so good??

 

wouldn't the smart move have been to hire Buddy and have him heavily involved in the HC search - which by his own admission he has not bee kept in the dark about.