BADOLBILZ
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Posts posted by BADOLBILZ
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Actually, Wayne Fontes was QUITE capable. Sure, E-SPIN made a mockery of everything he did, but people looked at his teams as if they had just one player. He had quite a stretch of 10+ win squads and playoff runs- if you remember his Monday night game against the Cowboys- remember the turnovers forced- they were always well prepared in that regard. Lets remember he coached in the NFC in an era dominated by Dallas, NY, Washington, Chicago and San Francisco anddid quite well. Problem is that he coached in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Dick Jauron is not as good a coach as Fontes was, but he has been with two bad franchises. He had one winning season in Chicago, then lost his job to Lovie Smith- Smith significantly upgraded personnel when he got there- Thomas Jones is much better than Anthony Thomas and QB isn't even debatable. The Offensive and defensive lines have been in shambles in Buffalo for nearly a decade, which have hindered him, Williams and Mularkey and didn't help Levy or Phillips either.
Would firing Jauron be a ridiculous move? No, I can't say that it would be. Is it a smart move? I don't see how another coach could have gotten more out of the team than he has, so I'm not so sure it is smart, unless we have Cowher or Schottenheimer lined up, which won't happen.
I think the smart move is to get a good personnel staff headed by a GM.....something we haven't had in awhile. I would even take Tom Donahoe back.
The Bills should have warmed Fontes over and brought him in at midseason. He sucked, but no team feared losing their big softee coach like those Lions teams did. They always showed up in the second half of the year to salvage his job.
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Wow, talk about "bad fom", BADO, that may be your most pointless post, ever. There was absolutely NO gloating involved. Excuse me for noticing a small positive that hasn't been discussed much, amidst all the negativity. The bolded part of your post was the REAL issue of the thread, and I was wondering if these folks had come around.
For the record, I was plenty negative, and angry, in other (more appropriate) threads, today. This wasn't about "today".
Seriously, I find your response rather offensive and immature.
As for who the Bills "should have picked" I always find that to be a folly, for the most part. If the guy they chose, is delivering what they thought he could deliver, then I consider that a successful pick. Most teams could have done better, in retrospect, on one of their picks (and many, or most, on their first round pick) if they had the first year's results in advance.
I agree that the Bills have done well with their 1st picks. Others here, will disagree, of course.
You find it pointless because you obviously don't get it. The Bills success in the first round of the draft has been hollow, and the McKelvin pick is true to form.
Of course we love how he's playing. I mean, if it weren't for McKelvin it is even possible the Bills don't win a single game in the second half of this season. His play blew open the KC game.
But the cumulative effect of drafting first round CB's to replace first round CB's, and first round RB's to replace first round RB's and even drafting a first round QB to replace a QB you traded a first round pick for DOES NOT WORK.
All the while our O-Line is composed on not one consistently productive player that the team drafted and the D-line has one above average player, a 30 something Marcus Stroud who also was not drafted by the team. And yeah, having Schobel would be great, but even he was drafted 8 years ago.
You can find folly in who the Bills should have picked, but the Bills should regret their *successful* draft history this decade.
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Todays loss was not due to the OL....Just like the wimpy play calling in prior games, the OC doesn't know when to go for the kill and when to play safe....You have to have game sense to do that....The bills D has not given a single 1st down in the 4th qtr and had just stopped the Jets offense midfield....What play do you make with your BACKUP QB....Losman is no Trent Edwards......Losman, Schonert and Jauron lost this game for us.
This team usually loses 9-10 times per season. Over the long haul, that's line play.
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Now that it's official that Jauron will not have a winning season, I'm wondering where his career stacks up since the AFL/NFL merger. It's pretty safe to say that the record will again be losing, making Jauron 7 for 8 PLUS an 0-3 interim stint. I know Norv Turner is stiff compettition, but has any coach been given so many chances and only put up 1 winning season? 3 more years of Jauron may create an insurmountable record of futility.
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We have three more years to vote him into the cellar. Feel better?
As bad as Jauron is, if they were otherwise run like a winning organization, at least the next coach could step in with a full cupboard of talent in 3 years. That always used to be the upside of a prolonged period of losing. Instead of stacking talent the Bills spend their premium picks replacing players they should have kept in the first place. Prediction: 3 years from now McGee will be gone due to age and injury, Whitner will have hit free agency and departed and the Bills will be back at the trough in round 1. Foresight: Should re-sign Greer.
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Pretty silly to start site and then come on this board asking for input.
Why?
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I think Leodis is the real deal. Considering he only has a few CB starts under his belt, I like his progress, a LOT. His return game is strong as hell, too.
Now, I know that there are people (hi Bill) who don't like DBs picked in the first round, and would be happier with a bust lineman. But, that aside, the crap this guy was taking after his first start was not deserved. He is a star in the making, IMO.
Bad form. This team was just eliminated from the playoffs for the 9th straight season and you are trying to gloat about McKelvin looking like he could become a good player. Dean, check the track record, the Bills have a very good track record with regard to getting good players with THEIR FIRST pick. In the 7 years prior to this, they've *technically* succeeded in getting a good player with that first pick 5 times. That's not bad. If McKelvin pans out that's 6 of 8.
Yes, some people jumped on McKelvin for not providing anything early in the season, but the real issue is that the team has had consistently poor line play and with the exception of that bust Mike Williams, they haven't used any of their other first picks on a lineman. Truthfully, if you want a draft do-over, the Bills should have taken Ryan Clady.
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This seasons collapse is not Jaurons fault. It's not the defenses fault. It's not the questionable play-calling. It's because of poor play at the QB position. Period. When TE played well we won,when TE or JP played poorly,we lost. Fix the QB position next year and we're in the playoffs.
No question that good quarterback play is the shortest distance between winning and losing. That's why they should address OL and TE first and foremost in the offseason.
However, the Bills fast start was because of GREAT quarterback play, not because the QB played "well". Edwards was awesome for that first month. Great QB play is not something you can count on every week though, unless of course you have Peyton Manning or Tom Brady. Otherwise, you have to win on some days when your QB is not that effective.
The Bills can't do that. They are poorly coached by a time tested loser. At his best Jauron is like Norv Turner, he can win for a short period, but he'll f*ck up a good thing even then. He does not instill a fear of failure in his players and as a result they accept less from themselves.
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1985? Was he a criminal then?
There was so much outrage against Unions yesterday but no one really cares about this. People, like you GG just want to deflect blame away from it.
IMO, two reasons. Rich people ripping off rich people is less outrageous to the average person and that's what this looks like on the surface. And this case is new and unexpected, versus the old news that many large unions were providing their membership with compensation that was undermining the growth of their respective industries. A lot of working people all over the country have long been jealous of the impressive, and sometimes inexplicable, compensation that many union workers have received for doing the same type or lesser skilled labor than they have done for much less. It's a have vs. have-not conflict at the working class level which interests a whole lot more people.
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I'm so pissed!!! I had 2 Bills tickets sitting on my dashboard in my car & some !@#$ broke my window and................ left 2 more!!!
One more reason to take the train to the Toronto game instead.
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THE laughing stock of the NFL you say? Talk about inferiority complex. You've heard of the Lions, yes? Or the Bangles? How bout the Raiders? The BROOOOOWNS, may be? But us? No. Do casual fans take us seriously? Not for the last 7 weeks they haven't. But to say that we're THE laughing stock, and have been for years is a bit much.
Yeah, the Lions, Bengals and Raiders are funnier, but the Bills are still pretty funny. Top 5 without any doubt. That image of Marv spraying the turd polish on Jauron from that "Bang" Cartoon was pretty damn funny.
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It's all about the QB play. Jauron=Belicheck without Brady....very similar records as head coaches.
A great QB hides so many deficiencies on your team. If Trent played the whole season like the 1st 6 games and the KC game we would not even be having this conversation.
Jauron and Belichick aren't any more comparable as head coaches than they were as defensive coordinators.
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God bless ya man, but you're trying to teach to a bunch of brick walls who have no idea what the hell they're talking about.
What is truly scary is that the media doesn't get this. I understand that truly having a CHOICE to defer is a new thing, but what football fan who has seen a few seasons worth of games hasn't lamented the fact that an opponent was putting a score on their team at the end of the half and THEN has the ball first in the second half too.
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I totally disagree. How many times are the Bills behind in a game, let the other team score at the end of the half, only to have the team get the ball again? You want the ball to start the 2nd half always. Remember SB 25? Remember how long it was before the Bills got the ball from the 2Q to the 3Q? Let you D set the pace early and defer.
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Exactly. What gets me is that people don't understand that teams don't score on their first posession simply because they get the ball first. I mean, seriously, do people think the defense is giving up long scoring drives just because they didn't get to stand on the sidelines and watch their offense first? The reason the defense gets scored upon early is because opposing offensive coordinators routinely get the best of Perry Fewell early. He reacts in subsequent posessions. Making the opponent take the ball SECOND is not going to change this problem, it's just going to give them an additional opportunity to potentially get that double posession.
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I agree.
However, I don't know what you mean ay an "extra possession"? There is no extra possession. The only possession that is guaranteed by kicking off in the 1st half is getting the ball first in the 2nd half, but I wouldn't refer to it as an "extra" possession.
In any event, it makes no sense to defer unless you've got the Steel Curtain defense out there or unless your defense it putting up more points than your offense. If that's not the case, then it is just plain stupid to defer. You are right -- it is not playing to win -- to pin the opponents backs to the wall early. It is playing with the expectation of failure. What a $%#&% loser Jauron is. The players can back him all they want, but it won't change the fans' opinion until they win football games.
Great point you make about the kick return game -- if you've got a weapon like that you use it and you use it EARLY. With any luck, they won't be kicking the ball much during the game, so let your kick returner get one to start the game.
Yeah, there is the potential for an extra posession. See Promo's post. Posession alternates EXCEPT from half to half where it is possible to have two consecutive posessions.
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Second thread on the same subject.
http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?s=&am...t&p=1248470
Ironic that Jauron dumped the few veteran leaders on the team when he got here and that after 3 years the team has no identity and no leadership.
One of the most often cited things present in this year's quick turnaround teams (Atlanta, Miami, Baltimore) is that there was a 180 degree change in accountability made and filtered on down.
Some specific examples:
Parcells and his staff told every player on the first day, "You are expendable. We will be looking to replace you with someone better at all times. You will do what we say or you will be gone." Joey Porter was one that said he was initially unhappy with this because he suddenly had to start practicing hard everyday even on fundamentals, paying attention in meetings, being on time. (End of the country club.)
Matt Ryan walked into his very first NFL huddle with the play turned to his veteran receiver and told him that he was throwing a bomb and that the receiver was going to run his a55 off and catch it or get his a55 kicked. Country club was over.
Harbaugh came into Baltimore and told his guys that they weren't playing patty cake anymore. Suit up and buckle your chin straps, we got a lot of work to do. Country club was over.
Well put. I can't understand why people don't get this. Parcells repeatedly turns trash into treasure because he demands success. He understands that when you treat the vast majority of players like they are special, you get poor performance. He tells them they aren't special. You are here only until you stop producing. The transformation starts with fear of failure and evolves into desire to achieve. The Bills players have no fear of failing Jauron.
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One more time: The team that scores first has a statistically significant advantage in winning. IF you feel your defense can get a 3 and out, or even has a reasonable chance to stop the other team, defering is reasonable. When you have our defense, defering is a losing strategy. I.E.: San Fran was ripe to get beat: west coast team flying east, poor record, nothing to play for. We had a chance to put 'em down early, get our crowd into the game, make it tough for 'em. Instead, we GIVE them the ball, they march it down our throats, gain enthusiasm, and never trailed in the game. So do we learn from that? No. We did it again against the Fins. Only this time, it took 2 possesions, as we held 'em, then they held us, got field position, and scored. Defering is not a no-brainer when your defense routinely gives up early scores, as ours frequently does. Having an "extra" possesion in the second half is less helpful than scoring early and gaining momentum, in my opinion.
I'd like to see proof that getting the ball first increases your chance of scoring first.
Until this season, winning the coin flip meant you virtually HAD to take the ball, because deferring meant you would give the opponent the first posession in each half. A coin flip over time is a 50/50 proposition. So, over time, the better team only gets the ball 50% of the time.
So while scoring first means you win the game over 60% of the time, what that really means is that the better team scores first over 60% of the time. The better team only gets the ball first half of the time. So getting the ball first is not a factor.
Most teams defer for one obvious reason. They don't want to get scored on in both the last posession of the first half and first posession of the second half AND they want to potentially score themselves if they get a double posession. Double posessions have the real potential to blow games open, just like a turnover. Teams who finish with a +1 turnover margin win more than 75% of the time.
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Coaching is the biggest issue. But I agree that there is too little talent on the team considering the wealth of high draft picks at the Bills disposal in the past 9 years.
The reason is obvious.
The reason for the dearth of talent has been letting quality players walk. I don't know how many times I've said this, but losing Lawyer Milloy, Willis McGahee, London Fletcher and Nate Clements meant the team had to use 3 first round picks and a 2nd round pick on replacements Donte Whitner, Marshawn Lynch, Paul Posluszny and Leodis McKelvin. The net result is NO TALENT GAIN to show for three years worth of premium picks. The only player out of that group who would have otherwise needed to be replaced in that span was Milloy. That is PRECISELY why this team has not made strides in terms of personnel.
Additionally, they had to deal a 3 and a 5 last offseason for Marcus Stroud. Because after 3 years of horrendous run defense, they finally made a move to repair the damage done Donahoe let Pat Williams walk. The same Pat Williams who has played at a Pro Bowl level for a 4 seasons since he left.
Think of all the OL/DL/LB/TE talent that was left on the table on draft day. Opportunity lost.
Meanwhile, the Bills are some $20M under the cap.
I do not understand the philosophy behind continually letting productive players walk when YOU DON'T HAVE ADEQUATE REPLACEMENTS ON THE ROSTER. It's absolutely idiotic.
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Actually, the Bills deferred and kicked off to SF:
Yeah, I was mixing up the SF and Cleveland games. They've melded together in my mind. Of course, in the Cleveland game the Bills immediately turned the ball over after receiving the opening kickoff.
But hey, don't get me wrong, I understand what you are saying about not knowing his team. But I'm not sure if he doesn't know them or just can't do anything about it.
I mean, when I think of not knowing his team, I think of Gregg Williams, the author of the "preposterous punt". I'll never forget that game against NE, when trailing by 20 to the Pats early in the second half, Williams chose to punt on 4th down from well inside the Pats 40. Worst decision to punt EVER. And, as Easterbrook would say, the football gods were not pleased. The punt went into the endzone, netting about 15 yards and the Pats then marched right down the field and scored yet again. I'll never forget the sinking feeling I had when I saw Moorman trot out to punt that ball. It was the same feeling I got when I found out the Bills were hiring Jauron.
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I'm just as pissed at Jauron as everyone here, decision making, play calling, game prep, ect... all terrible and we are playing like disgraces. But we could have been alot worst than 7-9 last year without his leadership (that we must have left behind last season). I think the players might have a negative reaction if we fire him, we did just give him an extension, and he does have a great defense mind. See if he's down for a demotion at the same pay rate even give him an assistant HC job title (which doesn't really mean much), and get someone in here that will light a fire under our A$$.
Jauron has a defensive background, but he's not a great defensive mind. A myth born by the fact that he was hired as a HC...so he must have been a great coordinator, right? He was nothing special as a coordinator. His defense kinda' suckedballs in Detroit and he wasn't even a candidate for any other HC job. Not even in Detroit!
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I was suprised by Marv's quick exit after two years in the GM role. Hindsight suggests it was not health. I wonder if he knew the boat was full of holes and decided he did not want to stay around and watch it sink.
Oh now we're throwing Marv under the bus! Good grief. I mean, is Marv the one badly coaching the team? Is he the one dropping the passes and missing the tackles? How was he to know that Jauron was a loser? Or that none of his first crop of free agents would be worth a damn. Or all the other dumbsh*t the organization did while he was generally managing it.
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Why is this discussion being made in a vacuum, as though Jauron is the only coach deciding to defer all the time? Week after week I watch games and without an exception that I can think of, the winning team defers. Like I said, it's just an inane criticism.
If you want to criticize Jauron, how about focusing on the things that competent coaches do that he doesn't?
I totally agree, which is why I started this thread. There are so many things that make Jauron a losing head coach, and attacking him for doing this actually dillutes the argument, IMO. I mean, let's talk about his horrendous track record, his poor choices of coordinators, his weak grasp of modern offensive football, his poor gameplanning, his questionable assessment of personnel and most glaring, his dreadful, slow blinking, gameday decision making.
I think part of the reason that things like his calm demeanor and choice to defer are issues is that a lot of folks were willing to overlook his track record. Some even defended him and compared him to great coaches who had losing starts. Now, it just feels better for them to think that the problem is just now being identified, rather than something that should have been expected the day he was hired. I mean guys, I care a lot less about his pale, deathly appearance than I do his 7 losing seasons in 8 tries.
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With regard to other teams, I get it, but he's gotta know his own team.
p.s. The Jets and Raiders both received first and scored opening drive FGs.
p.p.s. In the Browns game, the Browns deferred, and McKelvin returned it to near midfield -- excellent position.
Yeah, I think the bigger issue is why do the Bills give up a score on the opponents first drive so often? My take is that the Bills defense too often presents the opposing offense with exactly what they expect to see. Fewell observes how the opponent wants to attack his defense on that first drive, and then reacts in subsequent posessions. I hate that. I want my defensive coordinator to know what the opponent is trying to do and attack from snap one. However, there is no reason to think that receiving the ball first is going to prevent the opponent from scoring on THEIR first drive. See that long, methodical, well schemed drive by SF after the Bills squandered good field position after receiving that opening kickoff.
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Since 1950, teams that scored first with a TD have won 63% of the time. In 2006 -- a typical year -- the team that scored first (FG or TD) won 64% of the time. I like those odds. Sometimes it's best not to overthink things and simply focus on grabbing the earliest opportunity to take the lead.
I knowed that. But does getting the ball first actually increase the likelihood of scoring first? I tend to think that stat is as even as the coin flip which decides it. The reason being that it is irrespective of the quality of the team. Your stat basically tells us that the best team scores first about 2/3 of the time, which is not surprising at all.
The players love playing for Dick Jauron
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
That's true. I mean let's face it, these are wealthy young men. If the career thing isn't providing satisfaction, there is always that personal life to fall back on. I don't doubt for a minute that these players don't exactly hate the idea of having January off.
As I've said before, everyone wants to only have to work as hard as they want to. Even if they are naturally hard workers, it's different when fear of failure is involved. There is no edge to this team and that's courtesy of soft Dick.