SuperKillerRobots
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I really wanted this guy before the draft and was completely surprised that Jacksonville traded that much to move up for him. Now, I can't say that I'm very sorry we didn't take him. I can't stand when rookies holdout and he would only really help this year if he was in camp the entire time. Now he gets two rookie years (in JP time).
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I think the Bills this year will use Lynch and Jackson interchangably. The coaches probably feel that either on eof them can get the job done in either department, with the greater abilities one or the other has in certain areas being negligible when taking into account the need for a balanced and unpredictable attack. Maybe Jackson is better at catching out of the backfield, but I think the coaches realize that if they put him in there everytime they are going to throw a swing pass, the defense will catch on and stop it. It seems like the coaches want to keep their options open this year in regards to tendencies, since this was such an issue last year. I could watch the games with certian people who paid attention and they could call out the play before the snap (to qualify this, I don't know any one who makes any money or decisions in the football industry).
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After the catch he has a very quick first step....just look at any of his catches last year....
its the confidence he has in his hands, the ball gets to him and boom he is upfield....just watch....
You yapped all last season on how Fairchild should not try running him outside the box...yet he ran for 4.4 ypc off tackle...and we barely ran out of the spread formation.....If we run more out of the spread formation this season, which it looks like we will, expect that number to rise....
Marshawn has burst/accleration...The one thing he may lack is the ability to maintain his speed on long runs....and thats not a big deal....
you've had this opinion of him since before we drafted him....and you wont let it go....watch the tape...you cant say he lacks burst...Look at his first TD vs Denver(one of many examples) and tell me he lacks burst...cmon now...
Its hard to show burst and acceleration consistently, when your getting most your yards after contact....if we run out of the spread formation, that will def change, he will hit the 2nd level untouched, and his burst will be there....
you just need to open your eyes.....
To be able to power through some one, don't you have to have a burst? If he is strong, most likely he has some burst and acceration since those atributes are based more on your strength as opposed to conditioning. I think Marshawn has a burst and acceration, but you usually see himi go right into a defensive player instead of around them.
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I think this whole discussion is very complicated for all the reasons posters are giving on both sides. It is absolutely correct that win by avoiding holdouts, which takes a degree of anticipation on the part of the FO and a degree of compromise on the part of the player. Also, I agree with the idea of showing up to work when you have a contract that says you have to.
Peters has progressed at an almost unbelievable rate when you consider he was a TE five years ago and went undrafted. This growth of talent/ability has to be close to unprecedented - at least as far as I can remember (but I'm not that old).
It is obviously a no-brainer that Peters in underpaid and should get a substancial (at least double his current cap figure) amount of money in his next contract.
I also firmly believe that this whole holdout is due in part to Parker being a new agent for Peters and not having made any money off him, since he is still on his old deal. I believe that this is Parker's motivation to make such a stand on this holdout. Now regardless of what Parker's motivation is, the Bills need Peters to a certain extent to make good on their potential this year and since he is underpaid, they should just suck it up, make it seem like they didn't cave for the media and fans, and get him in to practice. Right? Maybe not...
I have two concerns about him at this point:
1. Peters was sidely recognized as one of the best LTs in the game last year, his first full one at the position. He was mainly touted for his physical ability, as we who have wwatched him for a while have known since he first came here. He was never known for his technique. In fact I can remember opposing defensive coaches (maybe Rex Ryan?) saying taht even though he only had one pass blocking move, he could stop anyone because he was so athletic. Does that sound like the characteristic of a guy who doesn't need another training camp under his belt? It sounds like he might have been susceptable to confusing rush schemes, had defensive coordinators had more tape on him.
2. Peters was doing great last year and seemed poised to take the next step. The surgery seemed like no big deal. I, not being a doctor, be that there is a 97% chance that he is fully recovered from it. The problem is that for $70, maybe $80, maybe $90 million long term I'd like more than a hand shake or gentleman's word. I want to see him on the field, practicing, and being the physical force he always was. To tie this in with point # 1, if Peters did lose a step from his surgery and is no longer the physical force he was, but is still good enough to play ball, is he elite? Do all the comments about how great he is fly out the window?
This would be my primary concern: You have a beast of a man who is great because of his physical traits, wants a lot of money because of this, and we haven't seen him push off his feet and come out of a stance. I would bet it's real hard to quasi-crouch in those stances with a hernia problem.
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I think the best way for a football team to deal with a holdout is to prevent it. The way they prevented Schobel from holding out.
Can anyone come up with an example of a team that ever 'won' in a holdout dispute? - by winning I mean the player caves, comes in and plays a season with that team under his current contract, and is still on the team the next year.
Didn't Orlando Pace pull something like this awhile ago? n He held out for almost all of training camp and then played the regular season. After a year or two of that I think they signed him long term.
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they dont pretend to not be homers and jokes. thats why i like listening to them. they are not saying that they are the supreme experts and their word is gold. they make no bones about being fans of certain teams and having their opinions clouded as such.
its not about "who is right" thats why they dont need to take callers.
and it makes for better radio. i dont have to have some jackass opinion beaten into my head and then listen to a bunch of schmuck callers scream into their phones. what a headache.
theyre entertaining and light hearted. which, gasp, is probably how sports should be considered.
Brilliant!
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I think this is really typical of the Willis that we all know:
Offensive coordinator Cam Cameron is intalling a new offense that features the tailback, but McGahee is missing valuable repetitions after skipping the majority of offseason workouts.
"There are certain things you need to be on the field to see," McGahee said. "Right now, they're throwing the whole playbook at us and they want you to remember it all. What they did the first day, they might not bring it back up again until today, and I'm like, 'Man, I don't remember all this."'
(from SI.com yesterday)
So the guy skips all the OTAs, then has knee surgery before training camp, never gets any real reps in the new system, knows he needs to go over things on the field to get it, says he doesn't know all the plays, but still doesn't seem to feel he does anythign wrong. What a dumba$$.
The worst part about all of this is that the guy has talent and could still bo really good (I'm not sure sure about great anymore), but has no work ethic or desire. Weren't Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, and Jamal Lewis supposed to make him be a more mature player?
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I'd agree except on PS there's always the chance another team picks him up. Wright has fumbled 3 times in 42 career carries (this pre-season and last regular season) He has fumbled twice in 13 carries this PS.
Omon has fumbled once in 15 carries. We really need to see more of Omon to know if that's a problem for him or not and I hope he and Wright get a lot of work this week. I like the game smarts Omon has shown including blitz pick-ups and how he sacrificed yards to stay in bounds at the end of the game last week. Those things make a big difference to a RBs success but don't necessarily go on the stat sheet so keep an eye there while watching. Thus far, Omon has stepped up and stoned some LBs and has had a few nice cut blocks. He's a smaller guy so it's not like Sam Gash knocking someone out but he definietly reads the right guy and stops the blitzer which is all he needs to do.
Wright hasn't impressed me in general since last season and his fumbles don't help that at all so you could call me biased a little bit. To me he's always looked like a bit of a plodder and the burst has been lacking which could be excused if he were a punishing runner but he doesn't really seem to be that either and if he puts the ball down again he's gone IMO. Otherwise it's still a battle. I think Hall is at best a PS guy becuase he was undrafted and battling with two drfat choices. It's tough to knock out two draft picks unless you are playing Gayle Sayers good when you get an opportunity.
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We all know that the likely scenario is a last-second loss vs. Seattle and laying an egg at Jax for the 0-2 start resulting in mass uproar on TBD, complete with torches and pitchforks and calls for blood.
That was last year. One of the things that is important is getting a fast start on the season as opposed to trying to play catch up in November. I agree that Jax is a big test, but in the end that W-L record is going to be all that matters. We need to at least be 3-2 going into the bye. That would be a huge improvement over the past few years and would put us in the position to make a decent run.
I can't wait for the season to start, but more importantly I can't wait for the first time our offense has any big play and Stroud busts through the line to tackle a RB.
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When do we get the article about how the women in Baltimore are ugly and how there is nothing to do in there
Or the article about Willis having 13 kids with 9 different "ugly Baltimore women".
Willis < OJ
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So, I was looking at our roster and setting up what I thought (so far) would be my ideal 53 man roster. I noticed that TE and CB are pretty tight.
Robert Royal (as mediocre as he has been) is one of the captains of this team. He obviously stays. Derek Schouman has shown promise in both games and practice. He also has climbed up the depth chart. He stays. Derek Fine is a 4th Round rookie who has looked good as well. You can't risk putting him on the practice squad, so he'll need to be on the active roster. Then you have Courtney Anderson. We just signed him as a UFA and have plans for him. You wouldn't think we'd cut him.
But with us shying away from the H-Back experiment and us having Darian Barnes taking up a roster spot at FB, keeping 4 TE's on the active roster seems unlikely to me. But who do you cut?
Ashton Youboty. I was a big fan of his coming out of college and he was all but written off by everyone as early as a month ago. It's unfortunate that personal issues caused such a stunt in his growth as a player. Last year, he was a glorified rookie. This year, would be his chance to shine. But we drafted McKelvin (as well as Corner) and signed Will James, all but sealing his fate.
But the guy has stepped up huge. He has looked impressive in camp and he put on a show during the last game. I would be very surprised if we cut or traded him. I don't think he's giving us a chance for that to be an option at this point. Especially when you consider that Jabari Greer is a UFA next season.
So you have T-McGee, MC Kelvin, Shake Youboty, Jabari Greer, and Reggie Corner. In my opinion, they all have to be on the roster. You generally don't keep more than 5 CB's on the active roster. Especially, if you're keeping 5 safeties (Whitner, Simpson, Scott, Wilson, Wendling all require spots on this team).
Kennard Cox is a glorified UDFA at where he was selected, in my opinion. If he impresses, he could get a practice squad spot at best. I don't consider him for an active roster spot. But then there's Will James as well at CB. It wouldn't make much sense for him to be cut right?
Tricky, tricky decisions at both positions i'd say.
Greer after 08 and then I think McGee after 09. I think it would be very hard for the Bills to get rid of Youboty in any way (trade or cut) if he shows development at all. They invested a 3rd rounder in him and they have two starting CBs coming up for UFA in the next two years. I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to keep Greer after 08 and then looked at who else they had and traded one of the older guys (i.e. McGee).
Now wheather they keep 6 or cut James, will be real interesting to watch because they definitely keep 5 safeties.
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We spend money on Butler because:
1. He is the best we got at RG.
Preston has had every chance to make this job his and simply has not cut it in anyone assessment (if you can make the case then I sure folks would love to hear it) and Whittle is the back-up in the LG slot and has the experience to make the jump to RG, but he is on the wrong side of 30 and it may be asking a lot to depend on as a back-up who will not get injured much less as a starter.
Folks can easily call for a replacement if they want, but these calls get reduced to mere whines and bleating without any suggestions of who folks see as a back-up.
To date such complaints have meaningless as they are alternative free or simply silly as the advocate impossible things like calling for an unobtainable player or railing about last year's draft which is done.
2. Rather than unproven as a commodity, Butler had a year with pretty good results last year. With him as a first time starter the OL saw fewer sacks recorded than ever before for the Bills and the running game though not a forced up the gut on short yardage did open up holes enough for Lynch to have a good rookie year.
Overall, Butler dropped to the second day of the draft not due to physical talent or skills but because of an episode on horrendous discipline and character on his part. Still all signs point to him being a quality guy besides this sordid episode and if he keeps his nose clean like he did last year he should be a phenomenal get for us.
Wasn't there a quote somewhere that he said he was still hurt from an injury in college his rookie year? He didn't really play at all that year, then came back from injury in the fourth pre-season and wont he right guard job. I thought that's why he dropped...
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I would bet that he's going to struggle, but a struggling Favre is still an upgrade for them this year.
My main reasons for thinking he'll struggle:
- first time in 16 years he'll have to really learn an offense
- not in football condition
- weaker supporting cast
- tougher conference
- exponentially greater media scrutiny/pressure
I think this hits the nail on the head. His is definitely a better otpion than Pennington, but how much better is the question? I have a hard time believing that he is going to pick up a new offense in a month. Even though he is a 16 year vet, he has prrobably only really studied a playbook for 5 years in the beginning of his career, though since then, I'm sure he still reviews it, but I doubt that he really studies it. He hasn't had to ggo to different teams and learn their plays or that many new coaches either.
I haven't heard a lot about the type of offense the Jets run, but I didn't think it was close to what Farve has been used to previously.
Also, he's not in a division with the Lions and Chicago anymore. Miami might be an easy out relatively speaking, but the Bills (and even the Jets in past years) would have been marginal playoff teams in the NFC, while toiling in mediocrity in the AFC. Whole new setup for him.
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I like the outer harbour idea only if it came along with improved infrastructure for getting there. I would think that the city and state would be enticed to making those improvements with the promise of a a privately funded waterfront stadium.
Without the infrastructure, I would say the Perry Projects because it would keep the stadium in the city and possibly allow for a more year round attraction (same as on the outer harbour). They could build the stadium and maybe a restuarant and Bills Hall of Fame - kinda like what the Packers do now, but with, and I hate to say it, less of a football focus. It may sound stupid, but I think if you were to make it a generally fun place to be for people who are not necessarily football fans, it would help to attract more people. Also, the staduim could be used for high school games and stuff like that.
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You first have to understand that there's never been a case like Peters, or at least not one that I can remember. He signed his last extension/renegotiation/restructure, whatever it was, before ever starting at LT. So whether you think he's right or wrong, you have to consider that.
This isn't just a typical case of superstar [insert name] drafted in round 2 not round one at a particular position then having become a top player at his position. Peters was a project that worked out, in spades!
He hardly played in '04 when he was signed as an undrafted free agent. He played RT in '05 but only began to start the second half of the season. Unless I'm mistaken, he signed his last deal after that season and with the team's loose plans to play him at LT the following season in '06, which he eventually did and excelled at it relatively speaking.
He and his agent have seen the kind of money we throw around at players that will eventually be only backup or rotational guys or marginal starters tops or for players that will contribute nothing and be cut two years after they get that money; guys like Butler, Spencer Johnson, Kyle Williams, Kelsay last year, Tripplett two years ago (seems like more) and when Peters was here to watch, Price, etc.
He and Parker watched the team hand Kelsay ~ $6/season in contract essentially forcing the team's hand in giving Schobel more even though he had just signed an extension/renegotiation/restructuring ~ a year before too.
So for anyone saying that he should play out his existing contract, why? Schobel didn't?
He and Parker are not stupid. They see what's happened and the retarded money we're throwing around at many players. Hell, our most expensive DT at the time Tripplett is already gone after a hero's welcome and the biggest contract that a DT of ours had seen until that time. Peerless Price took our front office to school and to the bank as well.
Peters plays a critical position, perhaps the most critical position on offense given our situation, and indisputably one of the top few key positions for any NFL team. Throw in the fact that every successful NFL team and eventual SB winner has a top LT, and Peters and his agent realize that this team is backed into a corner.
My perspective: You can't throw around the kind of money you're giving Kelsay, Williams, Johnson, Walker, and Dockery and expect a guy like Peters to be happy. There is precedent, at least with our team, that gives a player a "renewal" soon after having signed one. (Schobel off of Kelsay) Schobel's past his prime too, Peters is just entering his.
This is Brandon's first significant test as a GM. He's fighting a team habit of overpaying for talent (players already mentioned) while not taking care of the top players on the team. (Evans, Peters) His stamp will go on this team beginning now with how this ends up. I don't think it's a stretch to suggest that we're not going to improve much offensively without Peters playing. And granted, per rumors/suggestions, Peters may be entirely out of shape, not at full health, etc. We don't know. But this nonsense about "getting him in camp first" then renegotiating is just that, nonsense. Peters clearly doesn't believe that his show of good faith in that regard would be reciprocated. If that were what was holding this up, then this team would have something done with Evans now.
Parker has some other high profile clients and no doubt he's very comfortable with his position here. Either way, you have a team supposedly on the rise, paying all kinds of players that may never amount to anything for this team, then ignoring what is indisputably one of the three most critical elements to the 2008 success of the team.
We can argue whether or not that's smart, but it is what it is. The team's going to go a lot further with Peters than with Spencer Johnson and Kyle Williams if it's a one or the other thing, as merely one example.
Here's the rub, Peter's is not grossly undercompensated although he is undercompensated. But guys like Kelsay, Dockery, Walker, Johnson, Williams, maybe Mitchell, Butler, Josh Reed, and maybe a few others are overcompensated, mostly by a sizeable amount. Why? Poor management and our team having to overpay to lure talent. Again, Parker and Dockery see that.
Regardless, the Bills are now tinkering with seeing their season collapse over this. Anyone not thinking that Peters missing a bunch of games isn't going to impact the team's performance, win or lose, is naive. It doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. What matters is that Peters is in camp, in shape, and ready to go in a month. This team is already questionable in terms of whether a rookie WR can change how horrible it was on offense last year. Any gains made by Hardy or Johnson will be quickly eradicated by Peters' absence.
But the Bills set the tone for this with their inconsistent yet predictable crappy signings. Anyone that was being honest knew that Tripplett sucked long before he got here. But the rah-rah types here won't see that. Ditto for Price, Fowler, Gandy, Kelsay (whom they've already paid for by having to give an aging Schobel more), and even Robert Royal who with a $10M contract may not even start this year according to team reports and who has already been demoted.
The Bills are far from guilt free in this and Brandon has his hands full with this. If he continues to play hardball and it costs the Bills this year that will set the tone for his tenure here and already present an uphill battle for him to remain on. If he plays into Peters/Parkers hands then he won't be doing anything differently that we've done in the past with Schobel as a precedent. Everyone here was good with Schobel's situation even though Schobel was already on his back-9 by that point, yet the sentiment is different for Peters, a player entering his prime and meaning more to this team than Schobel. That's what I can't understand.
Some of you are going to launch into the typical childish "he's not a Bills fan," but at times I seriously question whether most of you are Bills fans or front office, GM, or coach fans first.
As to what Parker's doing, he's had success with this route with some high profile clients. The party that's playing with fire on this though is Brandon specifically and the Bills generally. He and the team have a lot more to lose than Peters' does. If Jauron doesn't post a winning season people are going to want him gone which will present a whole new set of issues for Brandon.
I have two thoughts on this post:
1. I think Peters, since he signed his last contract, has a new agent: Eugene Parker. I may be wrong on this, but I am pretty sure that agents only get paid for contracts they negotiate (whether it be yearly, based on pay or a one-time shot upon signing, I don't know). Therefore Peters' last agent made the 15% to 20% commision on his 2005 contract and Parker has made nothing. Could it be that Parker is playing hardball because he hasn't made any money on this client yet?
2. One of the most important things to do is to extend current players. To say that Kyle Williams, Chris Kelsey, Brad Butler, etc are over paid is misleading. The cap is no longer in the $80 million range! Witht he cap currently being about $116 million, the average roster player salary is over $2 million per. I understand that players, based on seniority or ability, do not get that much, but it does put the salaries in perspective. Wheather you like it or not, starting defensive ends get $6 million per year. Starting guards get about $3 million per. It seems like they tried to do this year with the offensive line what they did last year on the defensive line. They signed Kelsey to a big, new contract and Schobel was underpaid. They probably went to Schobel (a usual non-participant in offseason activities) and said, "Here's what Chris got. You are underpaid and we will give you a riase to bring you in line with other DEs in the league and on the team, but you have to show up to offseason activities to get the ball rolling. If you remember he actually showed up for a few weeks last offseason and got his contract in Training Camp. This year they extended Butler and were probably set to say, "Jason, you need a raise too, please show up and you can have it." To this point, it seems Peters nor his agent never said they weren't coming until they didn;t show up. Therefore, no new contract. It makes sense. They set this precedent last year.
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Crows gone. Very average NFL linebacker, that we as fans tend to always overrate our own guys. We signed mitch and drafted poz. Crow will not be here next year, unless he signs a very cap friendly contract (read under 1.5 million per).
$1.5 mm per year!? That's not enough for a backup linebacker on his second contract! I think Crow comes back at a little more than what Mitchell got. Other posters have said it: since the Bills; are no where near the cap and should be able to spend some money next year since all of this year's bonuses are off the books, they can afford to keep all the current pieces they want and add. The only way I see Crow not coming back is if they FO does not like him. There would be no other reason to not re-sign him.
Despite the fact that the team seems to have filled many holes in the past few off-seasons, they are not in a position where their draft picks are having trouble making the team, which would indicate a strong, vetern roster. If no one is lost after this season, the team will be in a position next year to take a luxury pick if the opportunity comes. Though a 1st round linebacker sounds good next year to replace Crow, I think it would be better spent on a DE, DT, TE, or OL. I would even be OK with taking a linebacker in next year's draft with Crow re-signed. Needless to say, I would really like to see a stacked defense for the next couple of years and I think the Bills are building in that direction.
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I like it for the most part, but I think they will keep the 4th round CB we drafted as well as Byron Scott for the defensive backfield. I also see them keeping Hamdan on the full roster this year. To make room for those 3, Omen and Bell go to the practice squad and either Steve Johnson or Jenkins goes to the practice squad. I also wouldn't be surprised to see Youboty get traded, but I think that will depend on how he does in camp and how many DB injuries we susptain.
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4, 5 including Barnes.
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LOL! For the guy talking about the court of public opinion, you sure are hypocritical. Again the Bills have no problem giving early extensions to Schobel and Butler, but with Evans and Peters it's taking time and both players are sitting out as a result.
Pay the men!
I'm pretty sure that Evans is sitting out due to shoulder surgery he had in the offseason. Also, the deals for Evans and Peters are much different from those for Schobel and Butler. First of all, Schobel was one of the oldest players on the team last year and a pretty good guy during his career here. He deserved a raise from what he was making (about $3-4 million at the time I think), but he didn''t have a lot of leverage, since he was not widely considered to be in the top 5 or maybe even top 10 at his position. The Bills gave him an extension that was probably more about not having to fill his spot and keeping him happy than it was about his talent level at the time. As a result the negotiations probably weren't that hard to do; I doubt that his agent was doing a lot fo counter-offerings. The same could be said of Butler as well. He had very little leverage in the negotiation of his new contract either. He has only been in the league for two years, he has two years left on his contract, and he is by no means an elite-level player. His agent probably wasn't making a lot of counter offers either.
As far as Peters and Evans, they are both in the upper echelon of players at their positions and do have a fair amount of leverage in their negotiations. Evans has one year left and all he really has to do to ensure that he gets a lot of money next offseason at the latest is play well, be a good teammate, and not get hurt. The Bills really do not have a lot of leverage here because his contract will run out and then they can either let him walk or franchise him; eventually, without a lucrative contract he will be able to walk. Peters has more and less leverage than Evans depending on how you look at it, but certainly more than Schobel or Butler had. He does have three years left on his contract, but he is also the best player on the team and probably one of the top three or five at his position. Him not playing the season opener will have a much more detrimental affect on the offense than Evans not playing in the opener. The Bills have the upper hand in the sense that they can make him sit until he decides to play for his contract, but at the same time they are not going to be able to do much without him on offense.
Basically, what I'm saying is that to try draw a comparison about the color of a player and how his contract is dealt with by the Bills is absurd. This is especially true when looking at the type of players each are and when/how they got their extensions.
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I thought it was interesting, but I don't think it really says a whole lot. It doesn't control for the fact that a bad team needs a lot of starters and it would be much easier to get players who you drafted into starting positions on a bad team than a good one (see Marv's first draft for the Bills - we started Terrance Pennington for half the year). The other part that isn't controlled is the fact that if the team goes through headcoaching/philisophical changes, they may need new personnel, which means new starters.
In the end, it says a lot mroe about the drafters who have been around a while on good teams that they are able to still draft players that can crack the line up on a good team. Bill POlian is a great example of this since they have been good for years now and basically have the same team, with the exception of the defensive side of the ball.
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Way too early to judge, but its hard to say you would rather have any LB from the last few classes over willis. The guy was an absolute beast as a rookie and should only get better, if he stays healthy he'll be a pro bowl fixture. But tenatively I'll say I'd rather have Lynch and Poz than willis and whoever we could've grabbed in the 2nd, because that's the realistic choice.
Amen.
I don't think we'd be as happy as we are with the entire roster if we had Willis and Michael Bush or anothe rone of those 2nd round backs.
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Great read. The writer is like a rich man's Anthony Bialy (from realfootball365). He uses the crazy analogies, but they are actually relative to the topic, funny, and sensical.
Aside from the comments and re-cap of the Super Bowl, he made some interesting hindsight points that I never really thought about before. He talked about how other teams did come close to beating the Patriots, but when they actually failed, their efforts seemed to be marginalized in the press. I remember thinking about how close the Ravens were while watching that game, but when I read the paper the next morning, it seemed like it was close, but nowhere near as lose as it really was.
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That would be the pertinent question for EVERY NFL team! I strongly doubt the QB has EVER existed that could throw a 15 yard out in a 30 mph cross-wind and NOT have it move in a way it shouldn't. The two strongest armed QBs I've ever seen personnally, James Harris and John Elway, were just as ineffective in high-wind conditions as any other QB. It's a lot harder to throw an out pattern in high winds, especially at the Ralph where they tend to swirl sideline to sideline, than it is any other route so they would try to compensate by throwing it even harder which just messed up the pass even more.
There are just gonna be some days where you know going in you're not going to be able to throw the ball as planned. There have been LOTs of games over the years like that at the Ralph (Rich).
GO BILLS!!!
OK, so maybe the 15 yard out in 30 mph winds at the Ralph was a bad example, but the point is that if you have a guy with a stronger arm, ther e is a better chance he will be able to put a little more zip on it to keep the spiral tight in the winds. The best example I can think of has to be Brett Farve. He played in those bad conditions in GB and seemed to do a very good job at keeping the spirals tight (not always the most accurate even inside though).
Also, I don't by any means think that Edwards has a poor arm. I thinkit's right to say his isn't as strong as JP's, but that doesn't mean much. I also beleive that, as another poster said about Brady, he will improve his deep throws by being in the NFL conditioning program and just getting a better feel for when to take shots. I get the feeling from watching Edwards play that he isn't a dumb-risk-taker. He'll do it when he has to, but isn't going to force it deep if it's not there.
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When you say 20 + yard pass are you talking about the ball being in the air for at least 20 yards or plays that gain 20 + yards, such as the ball was thrown 10 yards & the receiver ran for 12 yards after the catch? In any event, arm strength comes into play in the Ralph when the WINDS are blowing. I am not worried about Trent being able to throw the ball 20 or 30 yards in nice weather. What concerns me is his ability to throw the ball in BAD weather. Thus far he hasn't shown he can deliver when conditions are poor.
That's a great and often over-looked point in the debate about Edwards' arm strength. I think any QB in the NFL, at least those not named Pennington, can throw the ball 60 yards in the air in a dome while standing. The question is can they throw a spiral on a 15 yard out pattern in 30 mph winds and not have the ball float? This is the pretinent question for the Bills.
My Buffalo Bills 53 man roster.
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
I like it except I think Bryan Scott makes the team instead of Corto and I think Gaddis will be a PS guy, while Bell will make the team; but Ithink the Bell situation depends on the Peters situation.