Reed83HOF
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Posts posted by Reed83HOF
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Let's just enjoy this win, even though it was ugly and GB gave it to us...next week is not going to be pretty....I hope they can pull it off; if the Phins could beat the Bears...anything can happen...
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Hey 6 posts but I'll still back you!!
You hit on some obvious points. The big problem as i said during the game day thread is he is not getting better. He is staying stagnant at his ability to read NFL defenses (plus holding onto the ball too long) while the NFL defensive masterminds have gotten better at making him look like a 1st start rookie. That's why he looked pretty good early in the year and now looks worse than Gradkowski.
By the way, i realize Big Ben lost yesterday but his O-line was getting killed and he was scrambling around making plays all over the place for like 400+ yds. I don't need to see JP throw for 400 yds but i want to see him using his legs and brain to make stuff happen when things break down. He did nothing yesterday to make me feel any better about his ability. I'm still rooting for him.
I posted this right before the game yeaterday...kinda got buried on the topic post...
Basically Fairchild and co, want him to stay in the pocket to learn to read defenses...too a degree I understand this, but at some point with a crappy OL, he has to move around and make a play here or there...I like JP he says the right things, it seems like he actually tries, but he reminds me of RJ...
For awhile I thought he was playing ok; then he started staring down the WRs again...oh and btw..the ball to Evans was underthrown...he did a good job of getting it down there with a bunch of people around him....had Al Harris been closer, it very well could have been and int...
Didn't the Dolphins torch the Packers secondary? I know there OL is worse than ours...they had Benny as a starter
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This was on CB's Blog on the bills website...
J.P. QUESTION: I recently got a question from a fan in my askchris email box that I thought I'd post here on my blog, since I've been asked this quite a few times. Here's the question and my answer. Hope this helps to shed some light on things.
Hi Chris,
Do you think the coaching staff is suffocating JP in the pocket that seems to keep collapsing?Lets face it its just not his style.Maybe they should look back at college film and see what he is comfortable doing.Not that Im a expert but he has made some great passes on the run.Maybe he is over thinking stay in the pocket stay in the pocket as he gets plowed again and again.Does what comes natural mean anything?Thank you for keeping us informed you must love your job.
Vermont Fan
MY ANSWER
Vermont fan
I actually talked to Steve Fairchild about this very subject this week. He maintains the way to develop J.P. the fastest is to keep him in the pocket and force him to read defenses and only use his running ability as a last resort. I agree allowing a running QB to use his legs prematurely on a play stunts their growth in reading defenses because they don't hang in there long enough to watch things unfold.
I think that's why he is a slow reader right now, because his college coaches let him run around all over the place. As a result he saw less plays from the pocket and now is less experienced than players like Phillip Rivers who are forced to read defenses because they don't have the same mobility. Michael Vick only now is starting to read defenses effectively and he's in his fifth season.
I think Fairchild is committed to developing Losman's ability to read defenses knowing he's going to take his lumps. But I think he feels if J.P. is going to be successful at this level that he has to go through this process to understand and read defenses properly. If he doesn't he'll never get better and never be a consistent or effective QB.
LOSMAN RUNNING TODAY: Despite all this staying in the pocket talk. Today might be a day where he takes off to run a bit more. The reason why is the Packers play a lot of man-to-man defense, which typically offers a few more running lanes to quarterbacks. A month ago Donovan McNabb ran five times for 47 yards and two touchdowns against Green Bay. You might see J.P. take off a bit more today.
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Comments?
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First what does the past seven years have to do with anything? With this team? To answer your question, yes. I have watched the games and you should know that there were three that they lost 8 points or less. That to me, with some shake-ups and better play could be changed to three wins.
With that being said, they are on the EDGE of being a playoff team. They are learning, and they need to improve and they need to learn how to finish off a drive/opposing team.
2 to 3 more years... no way.
First of all...Using your 8 points or less guideline
2005
Sep 25 - Atlanta - L (16-24)
Nov 27 - Carolina - L (9-13)
Dec 4 - at Miami - L (23-24)
Jan 1 - at N.Y. Jets - L (26-30)
Here are 4 games from last season decided by 8 pts are less...edge of a playoff team thus far in 2006?
2004
Sept. 12 Jacksonville - L (10-13)
Sept. 19 at Oakland - L (10-13)
Oct. 10 at New York Jets - L (14-16)
Jan. 2 Pittsburgh - L (24-29
here are 4 more games and this was from the best team since 99
2003
| 10 | at Dallas Cowboys | L | 6-10 |
| 11 | Houston Texans | L | 10-12 |
| 12 | Indianapolis Colts | L | 14-17
| 15 | at Tennessee Titans | L | 26-28 |
4 more...
2002
| 1 | New York Jets | L | 31-37
| 3 | at Denver Broncos | L | 23-28
| 11 | at Kansas City Chiefs | L | 16-17 |
3 more...
2001
| 4 | New York Jets | L | 36-42 |
| 7 | at San Diego Chargers | L | 24-27 |
| 10 | Seattle Seahawks | L | 20-23 |
| 11 | Miami Dolphins | L | 27-34 |
| 14 | New England Patriots | L | 9-12 |
| 15 | at Atlanta Falcons | L | 30-33 |
I forgot how bad this season was...6 games
2000
| 5 | Indianapolis Colts | L | 16-18 |
| 6 | at Miami Dolphins | L | 13-22 | * 9 points...close enough
| 8 | at Minnesota Vikings | L | 27-31 |
| 16 | New England Patriots | L | 10-13 |
3 or 4 more
If you looked at 10 points are less...add another 2 games each season....
What the past 7 years has to do with this is that...oh we only lost by 8 points or less we are close to being a good team...this has been said by a countless number of people - myself included, for many years now....and we have the same result...we should've won this game, this game etc...what do we have to show for it? no playoffs since 99.
This team still has players from the last couple of years, there are what 42% of the players this year are new, guess what they were in 2001 too... we won 3 games that year, but by your philosphy seeing those 6 games were decided by 8 points or less, we were on the verge of the playoffs then too?
TD tried to do a few shakeups and keep some players, same results...good teams win the close games; we've had many close games the last 7 yrs and we haven't won them...this year included...as you stated 3 games so far...hopefully in 2-3 years...things will be corrected
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The key phrase in this post is "as long as they're showing effort"...
nothing irratates me more than seeing the players sulk, when the ball bounces the other way...the resolve and determination of this team at times is disappointing...
if they play hard and fight tooth and nial and still loose...thats more acceptable....but to let games slip away and then to play without emotion is inexcusable...
you play to win the game....did anyone see Larry Johnson do his Herm Edwards impersonation? That was hillarious...
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Well said....hopefully the players don't want to get booed off the field and put up another lackluster performance at home...
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This franchise hasn't been the same since the forward pass playoff game in 99....after that game, everything changed...the franchise no longer knew how to win or to persevere...which is what we were know for for over 10 years and hung our hats on...
while we do have some players(Not many -Evans, TKO, MCGahee, Lindell, Mormon) who are talented players (we mostly have role players); they are not leaders - they do not inpsire one another to win in the face of adversity...if you think Fletcher is a leader....refer back to his post game comments after the vikings game....he thought here we go again...we came so close and it comes down to this again? this time the clock saved them...this losing mentality is engrained in too many of the veteran players on our team...
each year you hear we need to be mentally tough, we are gonna play smash motuh football, we are going to do this we are going to do that...once the first sign of adversity appears...the team falls flat...it has been this way for the last 7 years...
Another reason why I say this team does lack talent, is that if it was one or two positions, then the discussions in the media and on this board would be only regarding those players....look at the board...the WRs, the OL, the DL, the CBs, the rookie safteys, the QB, the RBs- we should have kept Henry, A train should start...this list goes on and on...each of these is a symptom of a larger problem...the overall talent isn't where it should be...even RW said the talent level on the team is way below what he thought...it is...it is very tough to determine which players could be good if their supproting cast is different (Willis, JP, Evans)
If I am wrong, please help me understand why by providing some proof, I could be missing it or have just dwelled on the last few lossess way to much...but like Holcumbs Arm stated in one post...please provide some facts..and not just I disagree...why do you disagree...why are you right?
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Have you watched any games over the past 7 years? how about the last 7 games? even if we ended with a 5-2 record...this team is not that good...we are no where close to being on the edge of the playoffs...maybe after 1 more solid offseason we could say close...but the reality is this team still has a lot of needs...2-3 more solid years....check out today's bills daily article....that sums it all up...
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I was just trying to throw a different post out there...I am getting so sick of the we need this or that, or this person sucks we should be playing the bag boy from the local wegmans....
What's obvious and why everyone does obsess and love this team is that it represents the community, that us fans are always so loyal and passionate....liking the bills was never an "in" thing; most fans are true fans and always stick with this team...I have been following this team for like 20 yrs...seeing I'm 30 in january..
oh and I do feel the need to mention this...
the cardinals? the only cardinals that have ever done anything in pro sports...just won the world series...
The lions; they haven't been good since what the 50's?
Baseball is different...it just is....
Hockey is a tough one for me...I love the broadways blues (NYR)...I do root for the Sabres too and would say they are my #2 team
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it has been a long time since this team had the talent & coaching needed to compete in this league...How many posts focus on the OL, the WRs, the RBs, the QBs, the DL, the DBs, the LBs...
The only unquestionable talent this team has is a kicker & a punter...
here is my QB rant...I am sick of the bench him or leave him in threads...we all keep looking for the next best QB...
Teams and fans were spoiled in the 80's and 90's with great QBs (Montana, Kelly, Marino, Elway, Farve, Moon, Young, Aikman, even Deadslow -early on, Cunningham) and average QBs (Boomer, Bernie, Simms, Deadslow-later on)
Franchise QBs are just not falling out of the sky like the used to...some of this has to do with the evolution of Defenses and most notably the RDE position that one of, if not the best, Defensive player of all time helped revolutionize (read Bruce Smith) - this made the LT position become one of the most important components of an Offense...it is hard to find a talented LT who has long arms - to block a quick DE, big size - to hold back smaller DE's and compete with big speed rushers, quick feet - to move back into coverage against the quick DEs & a brain to know when to jam a DE and when to fall back and let the speed rusher come to them (Gandy does not have this)....
After a period of time, space-eating huge DT's became the next part of the Defense evolution, you now needed exceptionally strong Gs and Cs who could move them off of the line of scrimage...
OLs have a huge responsibility in the development of a QB early on..How many times have we heard that the QB has to tools to be successful and they fizzle out? In the past it was easier for a QB to develop Defenses were not as complicated, the players weren't as specialized or as big as they are now; the OLs got left behind for a period of time and eventually they got better....how many franchise QB's exist now (McNabb, P Manning) Average (Brees, McNair, E. Manning)? (Vick can't throw-yet? so he isn't included..Do they play behind good OLs? If you are lucky enough to find one; they will keep your franchise successful as long as they are there...
If you still have a not so good OL, your QB will take a beating, a young QB who wants to do well and pushes himeself, will develop terrible habbits that will be very difficult to break later on their career even if the OL gets better (old habits are hard to break) - happy feet, quick misreads & rushed throws, holding the ball too long trying to just make a play, once the ball is snapped they are focusing on preparing to get hit instead of making the play...
RJ had the physical tools to be successful, he ultimately turned out awful partially do the the OL, he was beaten like a rag doll the GMs and coaches did not put him in a position to succeed early on; he didn't have to OL talent (or a brain)...JP (i am not a hater) but a lot of the arguments on this board make me think of RJ and that scares me...he should have the entire season to show what he can do and we should hold off evalutions until then; changing to Holcumb or Nall does nothing for us...depending on our draft position and the other teams ahead of us, we may not end up with a QB even if JP does terrible the second half
Our WRs cannot get open...read my past threads on this one, we do not play an elite D every week in which they can't get open (Yes I'm sure JP has missed some throws and wide open targets - sometimes he has the time to hit them & other times he doesn't - he's still young and this is to be expected)
Our RBs; RBs behind a great OL appear better than they are and RBs behind poor OLs are often better than they appear....Willis has the potential to do well with a good OL....
The be an offective Offense you need to have an OL that can counter quick, big, strong defenses...Good OL are very hard to come by...Everything on an Offense starts up front...Our TEs who we need to be able to pass to are counted on to block too much....most of our series are in a max protect set....
you can counter act poor OL play by moving the QB around - bootlegs, rollouts, etc; quick WR slants over the middle, quick passes to the backs in the flat - of Shelton can't catch...but Fairchild isn't doign this....
Has anyone noticed some similar playcalling this year compared to MM & Killdrive? Passing on short yardage situtations?? - oh yeah the OL still gets blown off the LOS....
Our D is a bit diffent story, we are going from one scheme to the complete opposite scheme, we just don't have all of the players necessary to fit into the scheme...the ones we do have, are rookies....
My point is that there is a ton of issues that we need to address...whoever the QB is, will not develop or succeed without adequate time or even improved playcalling & franchise QBs are nearly impossible to come by; the RBs...tough to say without a OL that doesn't get blown off of the LOS, the WRs don't get open often enough (playcalling is suspect here too...they never go over the middle, never find a soft spot in zone coverage...on almost every play the D has 8 men in the bix and we still can't do anything..how often do we here coverage sack? The D - we need more talent....TKO is still healing, Flecth isn't what he was (could be from the lack of size at the DT position), McGee may not be suited for the Cover 2, Clements is gone - is a very me oriented player...
On the positive side, we will have a ton of cap room this year and another draft without TD; but we are still a couple of years away....and who knows how we end up?
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The support that this team has from its fans is really amazing....its been what 14 yrs since we've been to the show, its been 7 yrs since the playoffs...we have had 4 HC's since Marv, umm...8 QBs, more RBs & WRs than I can count....We were the winningest team of the 90's...
What do we have to show for it this decade...disaster after disaster, but everyone still sticks with the team...offers their own opinions and thoughts as to what's wrong....no matter how bad we are....we approach the begining of each season with so much optimism, only to have it ripped out & stomped on half way through the season year after year....
Why do we keep coming back? What is it about this franchise that makes us so obsessed? Don't get me wrong...I am a Bills fan to the core and I don't see that ever changing....I was reading a bunch of the posts from the last few days and the passion and conviction that everyone agrues their points with is just amazing...all for a team that has been dreadful for awhile now....we are sick people...but I wouldn't have it any other way...I am a Yankee fan to the core as well, but they don't even come close to comparing to this team....
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Because I was too lazy to do that....so...
Here it is...
I posted a few times in disgust yesterday and last night....after some rest and more thought over this terrible team that I love so much.....
This team is no different than the last 7 years since the Titans playoff game....we have not had a decent coach since Marv...Wade killed the Bills with RJ and DF and divded a good team...TD, GW, & MM...enough said there...too many good players lost, not so many good players drafted or signed..oh yeah...and a total lack of direction
that leads us to DJ and his staff...
They are forcing a 4-3 defense into a Cover no one...I personally prefer a 3-4 D, which would have been a much easier switch...Our CBs cannot play in a cover 2 D...Clements hasn't played great in a couple of years, but he is getting worse...some is his attitude and inabiliity to tackle...Antwain was sooo much better..McGee is a good corner, but blows in this D...We can't tackle...yesterday was an improvement from the Detriot and Chicago games...Schobel on a TE...Fletcher can't drop into coverage...just rush Schobel every down...he can pin his ears back and rush...We need at least 1 fat DT to stop the run
Kelsay is a *****...how could a coach not yell at him on the sidelines? Flectcher said he knew it was a penalty and that the league went over that with teams - where was Chris during those sessions? If TKO or Fletcher is a leader on this team - why did they not say something to him?
The offense...I have no idea what we want to do with it...Oline can't block...the only time JP plays a good game is when he isn't hurried, sacked or knocked down....once he is rattled, he plays like RJ...running and praying for his life...he has more heart than RJ...The WRs are never open when JP has time...I have been saying this for a few weeks...I am sick of "Coverage Sacks"...even other crappy teams have WRs that know how to get open...our TEs are only used for clocking and can't get off their blocks to be viable targets....we have the 5 OL and a TE and an FB and RB blocking a 4 man rush and the QB will have no more than 3 seconds to get rid of the ball....whoever the RB, he has 0 chance of being successful...Willis is lucky to do what he is doing...the playcalling....how about crossing routes over the middle? quick slants? I know that we have the speed to be able to hit them...I always thought the Rams passed the ball the last few years all over the field and used other formations than a max protect I (That doesn't protect)?
The Special Teams falling apart is do to the lack of concetration the players are placing on it...the players are too busy thinking about the plays they just blew that caused Mormon or Lindell to go on the field....sadly...these are the same players that can't tackle...
I'm glad I didn't make a trip for this game (and for the record I go to 2-3 games a season for the last 20yrs), but on TV they showed the players ( TKO and Flecth most notably) just sitting on the bench with a puss on their face....The Oline same thing
If JK was getting tossed around like a rag doll back there - would he not be in his teammates faces? If a member of the D planted a QB sitting indian style on the ground - would Bruce, Darryl, Henry, Biscuit not say anything? If a QB made a poor pass - Would Lofton, Andre, Eric not open thie mouth? If TT had no holes to run through or on x down & 1-2 and the oline gets no push or is blown back at the time of the snap - would he have said soemthing? Would Marv tolerate his players sitting on the bench - showing no emotion, no fire or will to win? Would Marv have let Kelsay return to the bench without saying anything?
This is the same team that has sucked for 7 season, hasn't had an oline in like 10 yrs - that was uanable to give any QB the ability to develop - I remember in 95 & 96 fans calling for Collins over JK - Why you ask? The oline started sucking then and has never been addressed....sunsequently...we haven't had a good offense since the K-gun...think about this....have we?
We focused on building a great D...which we had until GW and TD tore it apart....In 2003 through last season...it was rebuilt and good...then TD let the good players go and left us with mostly crap and a couple of good players...now we have coaches who are trying to run a scheme that the remaining players are unable to succeed in...
you will see a lot of player turnover the next two seasons...The only remaining players I can see staying are Evans, Mormon, Lindell, Crowell, Schobel, Willis, Reed, Parrish and our 2006 draft...Clements forget about him...Fletch's replacement is Ellison...McGee not in a Cover 2...
JP there are thigns I like and things I don't like...Walsh and Holmgren say it takes about 20 starts to see if a QB has it...they have had success with QBs so I would take their advice....a bad oline can kill a young QB....it happened to TC, RJ, DF, and JP...before we think about getting another QB...fix the line, give the some WRs and a RB and then he will have a shot at not being a nervous mess once the ball is snapped....It has been proven time and time again in this league...nothing can kill a young QB like a terrible O line...
Our best case scenario is that it will take atleast 3 years to sort through JBs, TDs, GWs, MMs mess...I think everyone was fooled...look at RWs comments there is no talent...less than he thought...less than Marv thought..less than everyone thought...(Sorry for the spelling)
here are some of the comments...
1.) denniswf:
See this post over on another board: http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=54027
This is a great post about how you rebuild.
2.) As you asked, where is the "veteran leadership"? There in lay the BIGGEST problem. Without that leadership, this team cannot form any identity. Jauron talkes about "identity" but a lot less often over the three game embarrassment streak.
Marv and Jauron were face with a no win situation from the start. How in earth can you go from a pile of "me" players to a T-E-A-M lockerroom in less than one year? You can't, because of the players "rights" and the cap.
Next year will see more changes, yes, I would have to say that the UFAs will most likely be bypassed, and some of the other "veterans" will be cut as well.
Just remember, this IS a rebuilding team and most people knew it.
I only hope they realize they NEED better talent than 3rd teir FAs on the o-line. This is what NEEDS to be addressed ASAP.
3.) The simple answer....there IS NO LEADERSHIP. Not from JP, not from Evans, not from TKO, not from Fletch, or Villarial, or ANYONE. Not from the coaches either, obviously. This bye week comes at a critical time...what will we see on the field against the Packers...the Buffalo Bills, or some sad joke masquerading as them? I have an increasingly sinking feeling that we'll once again see the latter...
4.) It was on the Patriots side of the field.
5.) I am a die hard fan of the Bills, but I also like the Steelers. I was thinking during the Bills game, can you imagine what Bill Cowher would do if he were coach of the Bills? OMG, Kelsay would still be getting screamed at by Bill! That is where I think the leadership needs to start, HEAD COACH. I want a coach in here that will grab a guys facemask and give them a 5 minute verbal thrashing! A coach who actually lets his point be known and makes the players accountable. Before the KC game, I read in Sports Illastrated that Coach Cower was unhappy with the way practice was going, so he called the team together, gave them a lecture and started practice ALL OVER AGAIN! They were half way done at the point he started all over again.
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One of the other posts on here or the Bills website board was $30 million...dunno about the accuracy or where they got it from, but we are like $7 million under now... with clements $7mil and the $14mil you give above...$30 million sounds about right...
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Kelly the Fair and Balanced Dog,Oct 23 2006, 09:53 AM]
5] Fairchild has really disappointed me more than the other three so far. Mostly because I thought he was going to be the best of the three and I think he started out well. I was thoroughly pissed when they didnt try to hurry up the game late in the third quarter when it was still within reach. That was playing to lose and inexcusable. He dosen't let Losman do what he does well. I understand trying to keep him in the pocket but he is wasting his wheels. We need him to run when he can pick up a first on 3rd and 3.
I thought he would be a great pick-up, but he part of GW's staff here with that Great Offense we had....I am having flashbacks off Killdrive, TC and MM...a direct snap to JR...come on
6] McGee has just sucked. I don't know the reason for it. Mostly I think that the coaching has left him in Clements in no man's land. They want to help the young safeties so much that they keep the CBs too far off the WRs and then the CBs can't do either thing they're supposed to, stop the short stuff or stop the longer stuff. It's backfired terribly but Mcgee is just lost right now.I really think its that they are not suited for the Cover no one...I mean Cover 2 Defense...
10] Our receivers were simply not getting open at ALL yesterday. Every time I watched them closely we were getting nothing. Then the few plays they finally do, like Davis getting deep, Losman misfires. It was putrid. I still don't know why they don't stretch the field more however. And I can't recall a play-action pass. The one time they rolled Losman out to throw on the run it was a completion, so they Mukarkeyed it for the rest of the game.I said this on a few posts last week...it seems like every game...there are no open WRs...there have been no PA passes, we use 5 step drops with a crappy line...they should run the ball and use the PA pass to setp up their passing game...they should use 3 step drops with quick slants over the middle...that should give JP the time to throw before getting killed and at least attempt to use some of our WR speed...and they should roll JP out of the pocket...he seems to play better on the move...
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10000000000000% correct....
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Kelly is a joke....either ride it with JP or Nall...the team will be young for the forseeable future...lets give the young Qbs the shot
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Wasn't Wade canned because he didn't want to fire his friend who was a O-line Coach? Carl Mauck? our oline has been terrible for years.....even before TD it was not that good..
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simply put...better than CV...better than Preston....better than Gandy
(who wasn't awful yesterday)
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I really wanted to see Dick rip Kelsay's head off yesterday on the sideline...that play alone was the final nail in the coffin...I used to think it was the coaches, but we have had 3 coaches in succession that have teams that make mental mistakes - poor play clock management, dump penalties (False Starts, Holding, Personal Fouls)...could we really have three duds in a row? The simple fact is there are a handfull of players worth keeping, the rest need to go...the coaches & Vetrans need to light some fires under the players...If you look at the D&C article..Fletcher knew Kelsay's hit wasa penalty Kelsay said he didn't know it was illegal? thats crap...either the coaches didn't drill it into the players heads or he fell asleep during the training sessions on common football rules...don't smash a QB who is sitting indian style on the turf...Fletcher should have laid into him - Talley Biscuit, Bruce would have...
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Its amazing how much better McGee was in a good scheme....Clements hasn't been good in a couple of years, but he has never been this bad either...I am so sick of seeing a snap and a quick toss to the WR on the sideline, whether its a screen or not, and have them gain 10 yds...it's rediculous....
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The Bills actually did a good job in this Draft...Whinter was a great pick, Kyle Williams for Eric Who (what has he done this year), Simpson & Ellison (will take over for Fletcher) will be good...they may as well play Yobouty and kiss Clements goodbye, McCargo broken foot again...that worries me...
I am just hoping that the scouts did a good enough job knowing what talent should be coming out this year and next year...and they draft players accordingly...Its obvious the Oline (LT & RG) needs to be next and yeah...we need a Fat DT...it will be 3 more years...I think we will see quite a bit more player turnover....remember when TD let Holecek, Rogers, Washington, Williams, Winfield go? This time it will be London, Clements, Gandy, Villariel, possibly JP and even TKO if he turns into Cowart....
A-Train should start
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Thomas played well yesterday in place of Willis...given the OL; I have to say I like what I saw on the leftside yesterday...who knows if Willis would have done better or worse?
I don't think that will keep up though...teams will overload that side...given a stronger right side of the line (CV was terrible)...these two can be a good 1-2 combo