obie_wan
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Posts posted by obie_wan
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I would really just like to be a fly on the wall while this is all being discussed behind the scenes.....I have mixed feelings on the Peters camp not saying anything to the media so it can get leaked out to the fans.....
- I respect the fact that he isn't playing media politics
- I hate the fact that no excuse is being made that we can hear about as fans
The way bills mgt is making it sound Peters camp is just not saying anything.......how the heck to you negotiate from that?
Bills have no interest in opening a dialogue since they have already made their position clear to the Peters camp back in Jan - no more money this year.
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It doesn't say what they talked about or that they made offers to each other.
The conversation could have been about how Peters is doing after surgery. His agent may have said that they were looking to re-do his deal, or that he isn't happy with his current deal. No where does it say they spoke numbers, or discussed figures either. The conversation may have also gone like this
Parker (after completing Hardy's deal) - "Hey Brandon (or who ever negotiates contracts), so my other client, Peters, has some issues with his contract"
Brandon - "Oh, ok, so how is he doing? Is he 100% from his surgery now? Is he in shape and ready for Training Camp in a few days?"
Parker - " Yeah, he is doing good after the surgery, but he said he wants to re-negotiate his contract to be paid as the best O-linemen on the team before he reports to camp"
Brandon - "Ok, Didn't we just do this 2 years ago? Well he did really step up, and he did get voted to the Pro Bowl. I will tell you what, you tell him that if he reports to camp we will sit down and talk some new numbers"
Parker - "No, he says he won't show up unless he has a new deal in place first, he is not happy about being underpaid as a Pro bowler"
Brandon - "Tell him to report and we will talk. I gotta go, I have a meeting with McKelvins agent followed by Dinner with Lee Evans and his agent. If he reports we will work out a fair deal"
Of course theres always the Obie/TBD chicken little crowd theory about hot the discussion went
Parker - "Mr. Brandon Sir, my client, your only Pro Bowler Jason Peters feels that his pay is too low and has been trying to contact you for months to work out a new deal"
Brandon - "Pfft, didn't we just give him a new deal? Please, we would rather trade him away and replace him with a DB. The offensive line is by far the easiest position to fill and your client wasn't that good anyways. Who cares about Pro Bowl o-linemen, DB's are where winning teams spend all their money"
Parker - "But Sir, all the good teams build from the lines out and have top quality backups at ever spot on the line, plus you spent money last offseason for some o-linemen"
Brandon - " we only did that to piss off your client, if we cared about him we would have called him to give him a huge raise already. Screw him, we can put Chambers in there and we are just as good, maybe even better. And besides, Mr. Rodgers told Ralph he doesn't want any more high priced players on the team until he successfully has the team in Toronto. Thats why we never drafted any. Now get out of my office, i have to pretend to care about making the playoffs, but we all know this team doesn't because Ralph lives off the misery of Buffalonians and its all that keeps him alive"
Parker - "My client has said he will sit out for a long as it takes to get a new deal, the fans won't be happy to hear that"
Brandon - "Screw the fans, we already have sold more seasons tickets then usual this year. Tell your client to get a comfy chair cause he will be sitting for a long time, and we will double his fines for sitting out! Now get out of my office, HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. Mr. Hamdan, please escort this man off the property"
Your version is what transpired back in January -
The rest sounds about right
Inconceivable that Peters stayed away from all off season activities without some understanding of the Bills position to not give him a raise.
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The Bills are pre-occupied with the Peters fiasco.
Oh - wait - they haven't talked to him since january.
Sorry about that
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I've mentioned this twice already but to no avail:
Is Peters healthy?
Do we know what his rehabilitiation was like following his surgery? Shouldn't this have been done under the team doctor's supervision?
How serious was the injury and the ensuing surgery recovery?
Has it EVER been confirmed that he was actually working out this off season?
Are you insinuating that an NFL franchise worth close to $1 billion would not bother to check up on their best player since Janaury after he underwent surgery from an injury that forced him to miss game time?
No way!!
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Deceptively quick and athletic!
BOOOYA!!!!!
for a slow white guy
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I hate this crap....I know, from my experience as a Bills fan, the team will not blink on this. Peters will eventually come in, be out of shape, take a few weeks to get into "game shape", be misearable. He will become a free agent in three years, and will not even consider signing with the Bills. That will be fine with the Bills, because they will never consider making a market value offer for one of their own free agents...particularly at the market value for a left tackle in 2011. But hey, look at the bucks they saved on Schobel, Kelsay and Kyle Williams...this is one case where I think the Bills would be wise to break their routine.
you forgot the part where he gets injured because he is not in game shape and misses a lot games
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While it would be nice if Peters took the same approach that Kyle Williams and Chris Kelsay showed, there's a key difference here. Williams and Kelsay SUCK. They better f**ing be team players and show up or they will be cast aside as the journeymen that they truly are.
In any case, I agree with you that the best course of action the Bills can take at this point is to do nothing. Let him collect the fines and rot -- he has 3 years on his deal and he's not going to forgo his salary this year.
If the front office were smart, they would have drafted some depth at tackle the last two years so that we would at least have some good, promising young players in the pipeline. If only...
why waste the picks
they already have Chambers and Matt Murphy.
just not enough roster spots for adding actual talent to the OL
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If anyone believes that there has been NO contact with the Bills from Peters' agent, or that the Bills have NO IDEA what he wants in a contract, or what his (threatened) plans are to sit, you should be locked in a rubber room. There are few things in this world totally impossible to believe and that is one of them.
thank you
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Bill, the reasonable minds on this board with just a touch of real-life experience acknowledge that Peters has valid arguments for the renegotiation of his contract. What sticks in my craw is the juvenile way in which he has apparently chosen to handle the situation.
Act like an adult, and perhaps he'll be treated like one.
If you add in the unstated item that the Bills probably told Peters no raise this year back in January (which is what prompted him to stay away) - then maybe its the Bills acting in a juvenile fashion with their best player.
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What's missing from this discussion:
The second most important number in this Peters situation, besides "three", the number of years left on his contract, is HOW MUCH DOES HE WANT? That is very likely the major factor in what is going on. Chances are extremely likely that his agent's starting point for Peters is for him to be made the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. And he might be worth it considering all factors: his play, age, position, talent, potential, etc. The Bills entire stand could be predicated (and probably is) on the fact that we're simply not ready to pay him that much money this year. And it would be dumb, IMO, for Peters or Parker to be asking for anything less. That is likely why there is little communication between them.
The Bills obviously knew this back in January when their contact broke off.
Yet they arrogantly refused to acknowledge the problem and failed to protect themselves by gettiong anyone with any experieince to fill in at LT
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I posted this in another thread, it's and interview of RB on WGR:
He states he's had little contact regarding Peters, but says Peters agent knows where the Bills stand.
my guess is the Bills opening response as noted by Brandon was - "we just re-did your contract, you have 3 years left, wait till next year"
which is what prompted Peters to stay away.
The current response that they are willing to talk if he shows up is damage control, after the horse left the barn
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so why should a team EVER sign a player to an extension? what is the reward they get for their risk (i.e. the fat signing bonus that comes with an extension)? if you allow guys to not honor the terms of their contacts then extensions become worthless because they are then a no risk/all reward proposition for the players and a no reward/all risk proposition for the owners
The Bills probbly should not have set the precedent then by re-upping Schoebel, Butler, Williams etc.
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I think Hardy's got a pretty strong shot at locking up the #2 WR spot. I'm not sure who Darian Barnes is even competing with right now. And Wright and Omon have a ways to go to catch Freddy. So it's really TE that's the strongest competition.
That, and the LT showdown between Chambers and Bell. Ugh.
you forgot Matt Murphy.
the staff consider him the favorite since he is a converted TE - just like Peters.
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obes, they spent last year making a substantial attempt to upgrade the line, and received substantial heat for the way they went about it. going back the year before that, they extended all-world Jason Peters a wise business move, locking him up for an extended period of time. part of the game involves posturing, and unfortunately holdouts as well. Peters may end up getting the money, he may not, but you gotta at least give this group credit for the past two years activity.
peters should show, peters should play, and peters should negotiate what he can get. unfortunately, for us, it's business, and business is conducted in ways that can be a real pain in the a$$.
There is NO excuse for not having a bona fide backup LT for the 2nd most important position of the team - especuially when you are trying to develop a young QB.
Contract situations happen.
Good mgmt expects it and plans for it
Instead the Bills stick their head in the stand - regarding the talent at OT and about letting the Peters situation fester to this point.
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So you are saying a proper front office caves to any demand made by a player? Get a grip here. This holdout is a bit unexpected since they just gave Peters a new deal 2 years ago. But even if he wanted a new contract, can't the guy say so instead of acting like he has PMS? I mean I can see this if he went to the Bills and they told him to go jump in the lake. But he or his agent never said word one to the Bills. They went right to skipping OTA's, skipping camp, and threatening a hold out, all without ever making an official contact with the Bills.
Does this hurt the team? No question. But blame the guilty party here: Peters, not the Bills. They are trying to do right by their players, but they can't be held liable when a player and his agent decide to act like babies.
PTR
I know the Bills want to conserve the greenbacks, but hopefully they have at least one telephone on which they can make outgoing calls.
Peters may be acting like a jerk - but the more mature front office may want to come down from their ivory tower and be a bit pro-active in finding out what he wants and why he missed those OTAs.
Pretty lame for the COO to claim that "Peters never called"
The real crux of the problem is that Bills gave themselves no leverage by not addressing the backup LT situation. Going with Kirk Chambers or moving Walker to LT will both be disasters -- with the development of Edwards being severely hampered as a by-product.
They knew something was up well in advance of the draft and should have taken some proactive steps to protect the offense for 2008.
Eventually Peters will return - but at what ultimate cost to the team in preparing for the 2008 season. The longer he holds out, the more likely he will miss time due to injury in 2008 - thus furhter hindering the offense.
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Because it's so easy to find good LT these days.
It's a lot harder when you don't even look.
Knowing Peters was an issue (health or contract), Brandon Albert would have at least given them an option at LT.
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Yeah, and then we could go another 15 or so years with a second rate left tackle and draft defensive backs with our best picks.
This situation is mind boggling.
Mind boggling to most NFL organization, but not to Bills fans saddled with a front office that has no respect for the importance of the OL (especially LT)
The galling thing is the Bills should have known from the lack of contact with Peters since January that his desire for a new contract was coming. However, the Bills in their typically arrogant way chose to ignore the situation and not reach out to their best player.
1. to determine his contract demands
2. to determine his health
Peters is either still injured and the Bills are justified in waiting on a new deal or he is healthy and deserves a new deal.
Either way, the front office put the team at a huge competitive disadvanatage by not obtaining a bona fide backup at LT to fill in while this situation plays out. The stated plan to move Wlaker to LT is a joke. He can barely pass block the right side without TE help on every down. Moviong him to LT will be a joke and again hamstring the offense by needing to keep TE in on both sides. After moving Walker, they have no one capable of taking his place on the right side
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Has anyone ever followed through with the full season or "until week 10" holdout?
Joey Galloway - in his prime
then traded for #1 pick (or 2)
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They were playing sound bites from Bills COO Russ Brandon during the 5pm hour today. Sounds like the Bills are going to play hard-ball with Peters. They claim they haven't seen or heard from him since shortly after the season ended. Brandon sounded kinda pissed and said they already "took care" of Peters two years ago. Sounds like they would have been willing to discuss an extension but he said they can't even think about it because he's been a no-show. He has until Midnight tonight to report.
Sounds like they should have had an idea of what Peters was up to before free agency and the draft.
If they were committed to playing hardball, they should have protected themselves and obtained a bona fide LT to fill in for Peters while the Bills again cripple the franchise.
Either he's healthy and deserves more money, or he's injured and the Bills are justified in waiting. Under either option, relying on moving Walker to LT is stupid at best, but typical of the Bills treatment of the OL over the last 15 years.
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My thought as well. They very well could have been targeting Hardy all along.
yeah - good thing Jauron fixated on McKelvin or hardy would have been the pick at #11
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? ?
I learned to count from the Holy Book of Hand Grenades -
". . the counting shall be 3
4 shall not be counted
and 5 is right out . . ."
they didn't cover the # 2
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Brandon said he would be willing to work out a new deal, but he said to do that he needs to speak with Peters. It seems to me the barbs being thrown at Ralph Wilson are not fair in this situation. It takes two to negotiate. In the meantime, Peters should be at camp.
On the complete flip-side, at least we don't need to worry about our star left tackle blowing out a wheel on the first day of camp.
he already has a blown out groin from last year
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The Butler and Williams agreements shouldn't even factor into this. A Pro Bowl LT at age 26 is far and away different that an average at best DT and promising RG. And neither one are even on the same field as Peters when it comes to future potential.
Ordinarily I wouldn't support a player who wants a new deal. Russ Brandon may talk tough, but he's in over his head on this one, and the example RB used repeatedly about giving Peters a deal two years ago doesn't wash. Going into 06, Peters earned the starting RT spot. I'm convinced it was McNally or another OL coach who told Jauron that Peters could make the transition to LT, and it happened after the bye week in 2006 when the OL was hurting under the weight of players like Tutan Reyes and mediocre OLT play from Mike Gandy. So it was that Peters became their go to OL, and the Bills ran behind him more often than not.
Now he's proven that he can play the most crucial spot on the OL against some of the best pass rushers in the league. And...Buffalo has no one else remotely capable of handling this job. I daresay that only 3-5 OLT's in the league can play at Peters' level.
This is when a savvy personnel man in a GM role is needed. Draft day is nice for taking pictures, but it's what's not going on behind the scenes that is irritating in this case. RB says the team has had no contact with either the player or agent. Frankly, I'm not buying it, and I think Peters has all the leverage in a situation like this and the Bills know it.
if Brandon wanted to play hardball with Peters, they should have at least got somebody on the team that could play LT.
the last contact they had with Peters was January. They could have brought in a free agent and drafted someone that could at least line up at LT.
It took 15 years to find a LT and only a few months to poison the relationship.
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You're kidding, right? Brandon and the Bills are handling the situation like adults in the business world. As soon as Peters and his agent follow suit, I'm sure something will get done.
The Bills are handling this like a first time GM flexing his muscles would be expected to.
Unfortunatnely they are jerking around the best player on the team and have no real ability to go forward without him.
They need to check their egos at the door and get this resolved before it gets ugly and reaches a point they regret.
OK, So for those of you that support this Front Office, ...
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
well - you just affronted many of the posters on this board -
the Bills said it - it must be true