twoandfourteen
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Posts posted by twoandfourteen
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1 hour ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:Matt Birch, The Sports Daily4 hrs ago
"Still, head coach Hue Jackson remains undecided about who will start under center for the team in their Week 4 game against the Raiders, at least at this time. That’s what he told reporters after Thursday’s game. "
I think that is simply a case of professional courtesy for Taylor. Hue probably wants to talk to him in person first before making any announcement.
TT has earned that.
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14 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:
The same national media that bashed McDermott for benching Tyrod after his 56 yard game were out in full force last night with “Tyrod the terrible” tweets and “Tyrod would never make that throw”. #receipts!!!!!
But Bills fans who just wanted to move on are all racists who don't understand that you can win with Tyrod as long as he has the right pieces around him and a good defense.
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9 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:
I can just imagine Sully's best man toast. "I'll give it a week at best."
What are these guys supposed to write?
The Bills & Sabres have given them practically nothing to work with over the past two decades.
There are only so many ways to write the same article -- but it's not Sully & Bucky's fault that the Bills & Sabres have been stuck in a perpetual, never-ending miasma of failure.
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4 hours ago, Dr.Sack said:
At this point you have to wonder does Peterman know how to throw a man open, does he process things slowly & because of that is that why he’s not an NFL caliber QB? Either way his lack of velocity, questionable durability, nerves, and unathleticism attribute to what we’ve seen so far on Sunday’s. I’m not sure how someone with so few ideal skills can get many more starts.
I can't figure out why the kid looks functional-to-decent in the preseason and then looks like a guy who won a "QB FOR THE DAY" fan contest in the regular season.
I get it -- it's the preseason, blah, blah, blah... but still, he was able to execute the basic fundamentals of throwing and completing a pass to a receiver.
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3 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:
I'm kind of in this boat as well.
Peterman's #1 problem is that he's just not that good. But at the same time is he really this bad? Historically bad? Chargers don't have Bosa this week and the game is in Buffalo and not likely to be a blizzard. Got to think he can at least muster a normal bad game by NFL standards. I know a lot of people don't want to see Peterman start but I am okay with it for two more weeks. Let Allen start @ Green Bay after we get through the Purple People Eaters.
This is a very good point too -- I could be talked into giving him one more shot under more-favorable circumstances. The kid really has been thrown into some ridiculous games to start his career.
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On 9/9/2018 at 9:24 PM, Elite Poster said:
They have gut feelings instead of using brain power.
If you bench Tyrod because of that Saints' game performance, you HAVE to bench Peterman. Period.
Agree 100%
I defended NP after the Chargers game only because it was one game. However, he burned up a lot of rope with that one, and now after the "Baltimore Steamer" he took last Sunday -- unfortunately, it's pretty much game over for the kid. I'm sure he'll have a great career as a financial planner.
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6 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:
Great write up about the difficult of the sideline throw and another reason Brees and NP dont compare.
Very interesting article. Thanks for posting.
I'd really like to see a similar look at other former Bills QBs for comparison -- like Fitz, Tyrod, etc.
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10 hours ago, bills11 said:
It's not about the numbers..I'm saying I can def see in person and on tv a difference with how hard Flacco throws vs Peterman .just like I can tell when I watch NBA that Russell Westbrook is faster than Kyle Lowry or that Connor McDavid in the NHL skates faster than max pacciorety..point is you can definitely visually perceive things it's not some super complex insight .
I honestly love this place sometimes.
Never change, TBD.
Never change.
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7 minutes ago, bills11 said:
Great job failing to understand that you can perceive things with your eyes genius . I don't need scientific data to tell me that Deshaun Watson has a stronger arm than Nate peterman. That's the point..the data is showing oddities that don't show up on Sundays. Joe Flacco has an absolute cannon arm yet the data shows he only throwers the football 1 mph more than Peterman and his arm is weaker than Andy Dalton..believe the data blindly if u want it's irrelevant to me I'll trust my eyes .
You are most certainly a football savant. I'm so very impressed that you can visually discern the difference between footballs traveling at 52 mph vs. 53 mph, without actually having to be there.
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2 hours ago, bills11 said:
certainly you should be able to realize by now that theres a flaw in those numbers..use your eyes if you think Joe Flacco has a weaker arm than andy dalton then you clearly dont know how to judge velocity..deshaun watson made throws last year that peterman has no ability to make yet the list says his arm is significantly weaker than petermans..dont use data thats clearly skewed to show your personal bias. Cam newton has an absolute cannon according to that list he has a weaker arm than mark sanchez no one would agree with that.
Great point. I definitely agree that your "eye test", conducted while watching the halftime highlights on TV from your couch is definitely a far more objective, reliable, and accurate measuring tool than any sort of in-person radar measurement of velocity.
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2 hours ago, reddogblitz said:
not sure where you get this from. Bills were top 1/3 in the league in scoring in 2015 and 2016. Then something changed and scoring went way down. It wasn't Hotrod.
Shady also dropped 1.4 yards from his ypc last year btw.
Couldn't possibly be that defenses & defensive coordinators were very quick to catch up to and solve Tyrod's game, could it? Could it be that he was a very limited player and didn't possess the necessary passing skills to adapt to and overcome what defenses were throwing at him?
Could it be that defensive coordinators realized that Taylor presented no threat as a passer, so he brought 9 guys in to stop the run? Maybe that was why 25 lost a yard-and-a-half per carry?
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2 hours ago, ScottLaw said:
It's an awful point.
Not sure why it's even being done. Peterman will be a career back up. If that.
1. It's a very relevant and cogent point, actually. If the greatest players are capable of flaming out in games early in their careers, then certainly a 5th round nobody is capable of it and it shouldn't cause anyone to pass final judgement on the kid until he's had a few more games in the regular season. Now, if he goes out there and blows up a few more times -- then all bets are off. You guys were right and I'll happily agree with you that this kid probably won't have much of a career in the NFL.
2. That's my projection for him, as well. He looks like he has a "high-end backup/fringe starter" ceiling to him, like Fitz, McCown, or Tyrod at best. At least we agree on that. I'm talking to the "Peterman has no business being on a football field ever again" crowd, however.
1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:Last preseason, Peterman was 43 of 79, 54% completion for 113 YPG.
This year for 3 games, Peterman is 33 for 41, 80.5% completion for 143 YPG.
(per NFL.com stats)
There are two kinds of statisticians - Baysian statisticians and the other kind :). The former include all available information into their calculation of odds - which would include preseason stats. Yes, overall, the odds of a late round QB succeeding in the NFL are poor, but that's quite a preseason improvement between last year and this. I'd like to see the odds on 5th round picks that are given a chance and show that kind of improvement between their 1st and 2nd season.
While I'm no way a Peterman fan, I can't understand the reluctance to give the man props for the way he's played through TC and preseason. My main concern about Peterman is whether he's yet learned to recognize his limitations, throw the ball away, and live to play another down. Because he's spent parts of preseason throwing against next month's burger flippers, that remains TBD in my opinion.
My man -- I couldn't have said it any better myself.
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3 minutes ago, prissythecat said:
What is the probability of Peterman being another Jeff Tuel vs being another Tom Brady ? Just going by odds of a 5th round QB being a productive starter(and not considering preseason stats ) , it seems foolish to think Peterman will perform any better than how he did last season in actual games--especially now that the OL is much worse.
I'm sure there were guys like you saying the same thing about the 'Ol Gunslinger after his first two appearances at QB. Favre's stat line from those two games? 8-18 for 73 yards, 0 TDs and 3 INTs. In fact, his first two NFL completions were to members of the other team's defense.
Now, it's highly, highly, highly unlikely (bordering on "impossible") Peterman has anywhere near the career Brett Favre had. However, is it really foolish to think that Peterman could become the next Josh McCown or Ryan Fitzpatrick... or dare I say it, a better passing version of Tyrod Taylor? Those guys are all elite backups/fringe starters in the NFL. No reason NP couldn't hit that level and have a nice career.
You said it's foolish to think that Peterman will perform any better than how he did last season... for that to be true, you would have to claim that most (if not all) players DON'T improve from their rookie year, and that what you see in the beginning is the ceiling. It's an absolutely ridiculous statement to make -- especially considering how the kid has performed this preseason.
30 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:yeah but I think Manning played in other games as well..
Exactly the point -- even the GOATs have bad days, but we didn't make a final verdict on their careers because of it. Give Peterman a chance to rebound and see how he does. So far, it's trending in the right direction, but it could absolutely fall apart once the games are real.
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6 hours ago, COTC said:
This is ridiculous, but I’ll play.
Narrow that list down to 5 picks in the first half, IF he played the second, how many more would he have had?
(hypothetical) 2,3 maybe 4 more. That would of make 7-9 picks in that game. How many successful qbs have done that?
Big Ben is a very talented, yet lazy QB. He is already a hall of famer, with effort he could of been goat. There is no comparison, no he obviously should not of been sent packing.
In real time, Peterman panics.
We all know TRod scored points and helped tremendously with his legs, because of him, we were #1 in rushing for two years straight. His yards came elsewhere. We will miss Trod.
Hypothetically, he could have thrown 8 more INTs in the 2nd half, or 10 or 0. Hypothetically, what if he came back in the 2nd half and tossed 5 TDs?
How many successful QBs have thrown 5 TDs in a half after throwing 5 INTs? (See how the 'hypothetical' game works?)
The point is that if it can happen to an established, veteran, SB-winning QB -- it can absolutely happen to a 5th round rookie forced into starting his first game on the road because the previous starter was incapable of running a passing offense.
Tyrod scored points, yes. Usually between 3 and 17 of them over the course of an entire game.
As for his running ability, Tyrod was a defensive coordinator's dream matchup -- of course, no DC would never admit it, but it's true. Look at it this way... a good QB would generally be around 285 passing yards and 2-3 TDs on a given Sunday. Tyrod's production generally looked more like 160 yds passing, 35 yds rushing, and 1 TD. I'm no genius, but 195 total yards is far better than 285. One TD is also far better than allowing 2 or 3. If I'm a DC, I'll take Tyrod running around and producing FGs & punts all day long as opposed to someone who is capable of lighting up my secondary for 4 TDs.
Also, if I'm a DC, I also know that once my team has a lead of 7 or more... its game over for Tyrod. He's not bringing his team back from behind, ever.
We'll miss Tyrod the person... but definitely not Tyrod the QB.
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32 minutes ago, COTC said:
After That performance last year he deserves to be out of the league. Only with the Bills, do feelings trump talent.
such sensitvie ❄️’s. McDermott worries me.
Ben Roethlisberger threw 5 INTs in a game last year, too. Two of them were run back for TDs.
Should he have been sent packing to never play again?
If you go back and look, I posted a list containing many examples of QBs who had 5+ INTs in a game. It happens. It happens to Super Bowl MVPs and it happens to 5th round rookies in their 1st ever start. Get over it.
Tyrod Taylor had multiple games last year with less than 100 yards passing going into the 4th Q. Were you thinking he should be out of the league for those unacceptable performances? Or because he didn't turn the ball over, those abysmal passing days were ok with you?
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22 hours ago, Success said:
Didn’t Peyton Manning have a 6 pick game?
I looked this up back in January and found the post. Here's it is:
Fortunately for you, I have an important presentation I need to finish this weekend. So, I was looking for a way to procrastinate and this is the perfect thing to do instead. Who doesn't like a little pro football reference wormhole on a Friday night?
Join me, as we delve into the fascinating world of the "Fantastic Fives", QBs who have thrown 5 or more INTs in a game (since 1999).
Since 1999, QBs who have thrown 5 INTs in one half:
- Ty Detmer (DET) had 5 in the 2nd half against the Browns in 2001. Threw 7 INTs that day.
- Ryan Fitzpatrick (NYJ) had 5 in the 2nd half against the Chiefs in 2016. Had 6 INTs that day. Threw an INT on 5 straight drives, in fact.
- Nathan Peterman (BUF) had 5 in the 1st half against the Chargers in 2017.
How about 4 in a half?
- Peyton Manning (IND) had 4 in the 1st Quarter against the Chargers in 2007. Threw 2 more that day, 1 on the opening drive of the 3rd Q and 1 more in the 4th. Along with Peyton's 6 INTs that day, the Colts also missed 2 FGs and lost the game 23-21.
- Troy Aikman (DAL) threw 4 in the 1st half against the Giants in 2000. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Matt Barkley (CHI) threw 4 in the 2nd half against the Redskins in 2016. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Drew Bledsoe (NE) had 4 in the 2nd half against the Dolphins in 1999. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Daunte Culpepper (MIN) threw 4 in the 2nd half against the Bengals in 2005. Just missed the 5 in one half club by 1:06. 5 INTs that day.
- Brett Favre (GB) threw 4 on 4 straight drives in the 2nd half, also against the Bengals in 2005. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Josh Freeman (TB) had 4 in the 2nd half against the Panthers in 2009. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Dan Marino (MIA) had 4 in the 2nd half against the Cowboys in 1999. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Kyle Orton (CHI) threw 4 in the 1st half against the Bengals in 2005. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Ben Roethlisberger (PIT) threw 4 in the 2nd half against the Jaguars in 2017. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Tony Romo (DAL) had 4 in the 2nd half against the Bears in 2012. Had 5 INTs that day.
- Tony Romo (DAL) checks in again with 4 in the 1st half against the Bills in 2007. Had 5 INTs that day.
Honorable Mention:
- Mark Sanchez (NYJ) threw 3 INTs in the 2nd half against the Bills in 2009. He also threw 1 INT in the 1st and 1 INT in OT. Steve Weatherford also threw an INT in OT on a fake punt attempt.
- Chris Chandler (STL) threw 3 INTs in each half against the Panthers in 2004. That lesson in symmetry resulted in 6 INTs on the day.
The rest of the games can be found here and were mostly 3/2 or 2/3 splits between the two halves. But who cares about those -- It's not like any of them was a rookie throwing 5 INTs in one half in his 1st ever start, am I right?
Actually, now that I think about it, I'm fairly certain that Nathan Peterman is the only guy on this list who was playing in his 1st NFL start. At least, since 1999.
One more "Fun 5INT Fact" for today: A QB has thrown 5 INTs in a game 225 times in NFL history.
Here's the link to the full thread if you're interested:
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26 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:
Of the QBs who have started at least 15 games from 2015 to 2017 I have him 19th out of 39. ANY/A would put him 18th, Passer Rating would put him 15th.
Great. I'm curious to see who the 20 guys behind him are, but you don't have to waste your time posting that.
However, I'm talking about the 40-50 guys playing QB on teams in the NFL heading into the 2018 season. By "better", I'm looking at their overall value -- talent, potential, past performance, etc.
I also just realized I forgot about Mahomes in KC. So there's 37 guys who are "better" than Tyrod Taylor in the NFL right now.
Edit -- also forgot about Winston in TB, so now it's 38.
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8 hours ago, SouthNYfan said:
I'd say he's above Brissett.
He's definitely below Trubisky based solely on the fact that he's only a sophmore and they traded a bunch to get him.
He shouldn't be starting in the NFL anymore IMO.
I mean, of course there's going to be some disagreement here and there on a couple of the guys. I personally think Brissett is better -- younger with more upside -- but he's not one I'd care enough about to debate.
The point of this exercise is to show that you're not going to find 16-20 guys on there that TT is clearly better than to put him in the top 20 or 15 QBs in the NFL. Even if you took the 5 rookies off the list, there's still 31 names -- you would be really hard pressed to argue he's better than 11 of them.
However, if your rationale is that "passing yards & passing TDs" are irrelevant to gauging a QB's production (like some of the #TeamTyrod guys around here) then maybe you could get him up into the top 20.
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12 hours ago, dave mcbride said:
On what planet were the Bills the worst passing offense in the league the last three seasons? And please don’t say it’s all about the yardage. That on its own is a horrible metric to judge a passing game by.
Also, saying that Taylor, a bona fide league average qb, isn’t in the top 30 makes me really question your judgment.
Now, just to clarify for us slow kids in the back of the room... you are saying that "passing yardage" is a "horrible metric" to judge a passing game by.
You're right. Maybe we should be using "Goals Against Average" or "Slugging %" to really get a true sense as to how good or bad a team's passing game is.
This right here is a big part of why I am so intrigued by the "Great Tyrod Debate". It has caused what I can only assume were once rational people to make -- and then resolutely stand by and argue -- statements such as: "passing yardage is a horrible metric to judge a passing game".
By definition, passing yards are the measure of how many yards a team produces throwing the football.
Now, as for my "top 30" comment. I used one simple criteria... "Would an NFL GM trade that player for Tyrod Taylor straight up?"
So, lets do this one more time:
Brady
Brees
Rogers
Ben
Rivers
Ryan
Wilson
Wentz
Goff
Stafford
Watson
Luck
Cousins
Smith
Garappolo
Newton
Bortles
Dalton
Carr
Bridgewater
Manning
McCown
Keenum
Prescott
Mariota
Bradford
Foles
...and then a few "borderline" guys:
Tannehill
Trubisky
Flacco
Brissett
...and then the new rookie class:
Mayfield
Darnold
Allen
Rosen
Jackson
There are 36 names for you right there. Now, granted, you could probably lump TT in at the tail end of that Tannehill-Trubisky group... but my point still stands. There are easily 28-30 guys that are clearly ahead of TT in the NFL right now.
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32 minutes ago, billieve420 said:
Based on what Darnold hasn’t taken a snap in this league. Bridgewater hasn’t put up impressive numbers during his time as starter in Minnesota. McCown had his best year as a starter last year and still didn’t put up 3000 yds.
Tyrod has put up better numbers than those 3 overall.Try again.
You're not getting any of those 3 for Tyrod straight up in a trade.
Also, JMcC & TB have both put up better numbers than TT. TB is by far a more talented passer & QB overall.
(JMcC also only played in 13 games last year. He averaged 45 more passing yds/gm than TT.)
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2 minutes ago, billieve420 said:
Not a top # 30 QB is really reaching?
The NY Jets have 3 just on their roster.
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6 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:
Ok let’s get real. There are football fans that have an issue rooting for a black QB. They need a white QB because that’s what they need. I don’t know why. But Tyrod isn’t horrible, he just isn’t great.
I'm not denying that this doesn't exist. I'm sure they're out there.
But "how many of them are there?" has been my question -- and no one seems to want to answer it.
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7 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:
Aaron Rodgers ?
oops no he was
17/42
40.5 percent completion
185 yards
4.4 ypa
2 ints
1 sack
Not saying Tyrod = A rod, you did
Exactly- elite guys have bad games and so do bad ones, so do average ones.
Tyrod isnt elite, but he’s proven himself beyond any of the other guys on the roster by quite a lot.
Ps I hate this thread, guy is gone, Bills have moved on, I belive for all the right reasons, but the narrative this guy is the worst to ever play the game is wrong.
Mccarron and Peterman have proven in no way they are upgrades. If Josh doesn’t pan out we are going to see the worst Bills qb play in several years.
Literally no one is saying that. In no way, shape, or form is TT the worst ever to play the game.
He's just not nearly as good as the media wants to make him out to be and not really in the top 30 at the position currently in the league.
Where the pushback comes from is the very real attempt to push a narrative that says "only racists think Tyrod should have been replaced". I resent and take personal offense at this notion that all Bills fans are practically klansmen because we were ok with them moving on from a QB who led the NFL's worst passing offense for 3 years and just happened to be black.
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1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:
You can't run a full offense with him at the helm given his limitations.
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Is Nate Peteman the worst QB in NFL history?
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
He's certainly making a very strong case for the title.