chicot

I very much doubt that.

Did you watch the previous World Cup? That was far worse. South Korea made it through to the semi-finals courtesy of some of the most dubious decisions ever (by a strange coincidence, they were co-hosts of the tournament).

Though all Jews have the right to be Israeli citizens and to settle there, not all choose to do so. In fact, there are more Jews living outside Israel than within it. Given this fact, I hardly see how a criticism of current Israeli policy represents a criticism of the entire Jewish race (which is what using the phrase "the Jews" surely implies). When I criticize the actions of the Israeli goverment am I criticizing Jews For Justice For Palestinians (a British organisation which stands for exactly what it says on the label)? Of course not. Is the Jewish doctor in my neighbourhood to blame for the actions of a country in which he does not live and has no influence on?

Obviously I am all in favour of these practices

# Israel is the only liberal democracy in the Middle East. A liberal democracy that was founded on ethnic cleansing and refuses to allow it's original inhabitants to return home because they would effect it's racial purity. # With an aerial arsenal of over 250 F-16s, Israel has the largest fleet of the aircraft outside of the US. How on earth is this some sort of achievement? # Relative to its population, Israel is the largest immigrant-absorbing nation on earth. Immigrants come in search of democracy, religious freedom, and economic opportunity. See my first point. Israel's immigration policy is inherently racist.

Can't recall whether I have or not. I have no great love for Saudi Arabia and may have criticized them here, but I'm not sure of that. I've certainly said on many occasions that I'm completely opposed to suicide bombings, which may not be a criticism of an Islamic state, but is certainly a criticism of the policy of certain Arab groups. Anyway, why should I bother directing criticism at Islamic-majority states on this board? This board is full of people doing that - what would be the point of a "me too" type of post? I tend to post when my point of view differs from what is already being said on here, otherwise I can't see the point.

Well then, allow me to set the record straight - I haven't been indoctrinated by Islam or anything else for that matter. I'd also like to point out that I have never, not once, directed any criticism at "the Jews" but only at the state of Israel.

? Your reply seems to have little to do with my post, which was a reply to Moose accusing me of being influenced by "anti-jew indoctrination". I note that in one of your previous posts you said: "making Gaza a wide beach won't make it much safer". I took that to mean that you weren't 100% in agreement with Israel's actions in Gaza. Perhaps I misinterpreted that statement or have you changed your mind?

As for the "hate-the-jews" indocrination, did you read the Haaretz article? There's little there I'd disagree with. No doubt if the author posted those sort of views on this board, you'd accuse him of hating jews as well. I have my doubts that someone named Gideon Levy would have been indocrinated to hate jews, but there you are. That's the problem with using the anti-semitism slur against each and every critic of Israel. The inconvenient truth is that there are plenty of jews and Israelis that would make the very same criticisms of Israel. Are these also "jew-haters"? Or is that only jews are allowed to criticize Israel and anyone else who does the same is "anti-semitic"?

Bah. If all religions no longer existed the world would probably be a better place. Thank you for your concern but I think I'm somewhat better placed to make an assessment about the supposed "dangers" I face from the muslim community in Britain. I never actually "left" Islam since I was never in it in the first place.

There's trash talking and then there's trash talking. If a remark was made about Zidane, that's one thing and Zidane should have just laughed it off and got on with it. If, however, something was said about his sick mother, that's a different matter. Who can say for sure that they would not have snapped and reacted in the same way? I know I cannot. Having said that, I don't believe it affected the outcome of the game or makes Italy any less worthy champions. There was only 10 minutes to go and the game would probably have gone to penalties even had Zidane not gone off.

Never said he was.

The story being reported on ITV news (UK) is that Materazzi said to Zidane "I slept with your mother last night", followed by "Your mother is an Algerian whore". Given that Zidane's mother is ill at the moment, I can understand to a certain degree why he did what he did (assuming that the report is accurate). Of course, he would have been far wiser to keep his cool and not react during the match (he can nut him after the game is over ).

Thank you. Sadly, like Frank Costanza, I can never be President of the US

If you dont want to hear about this crap it might be wise to avoid the "World Cup Game Thread"

Presumably you're referring to Iraq. I'll reply to that in the other thread when I have more time.

I'm not quite sure how to reply to this because I'm not quite sure who you are referring to in particular, who is killing Americans. In the case of 9/11 for instance, weren't the hijackers all resident in the US for some months before the attack? Who could have informed on them in that case? Were their families back home aware of what they were going to do? I doubt that.

My people? Who are my people? Presumably you mean the Arabs? I'm afraid I don't have quite as much influence in the Arab world as you seem to think. I get your point about collective punishment however, but the difference is that it is not the armed forces of Arab countries that are killing Americans. It is free-lance organisations of lunatics that are answerable to no one.

I suspected as much Assuming that all Palestinians want all Americans and Jews to be killed is probably something of an exaggeration (didn't you have a debate with Wacka a few weeks ago in which you argued the point that Palestinians don't have a problem with all Jews just with Israelis?). In any event, the reality is that it's not the Palestinians that have invaded Israel using tanks, helicopters, F-16s etc... It is not the Palestinians that are cutting off the electricity to 750,000 Israelis nor causing 20,000 Israelis to leave their homes. I very much doubt that the Israeli actions are going to make the Palestinians love them more, reduce support for Hamas or make Israelis safer. If anything, it will have the opposite effect.

Four million? And how do you work that out?

Collective punishment is not only morally wrong but it is also counter-productive. This Haaretz editorial makes some excellent points: A black flag

Heh I live in Liverpool (Gerrard for captain!). I'm just not that fanatical an England fan.

Nope. The ref told Eriksson that he was sent off for the stamp. He also said that Ronaldo's actions had nothing to do with it. "I then went to the referee's room for a private chat and, when I asked him whether it was a red card, he was 100% sure. I asked him where the player [Carvalho] had been hit and the referee pointed exactly where. So, no complaints. I have seen it on television and I couldn't complain about it." Eriksson's statement In any event, there's no guarantee that England would have avoided penalties even had Rooney not got sent off. They hadn't managed to score against Portugal with 11 men, even though Portugal had 2 of their best players missing. The plain fact of the matter is that England were not good enough. They were overhyped from the very beginning. Best group of players for 40 years? Hardly. Look at the way they qualified - they narrowly won their qualifying group ahead of a dismal Polish team. The media built them up into world beaters when the reality was somewhat different.

If England has scored any of the numerous good chances they had in that game then there would have been no need for sour grapes about cheaters and biased referees. Stamping on someone's crotch is a straight red offence. Maybe Rooney didn't mean it, as he claims, but given his history of indiscipline I wouldn't be suprised if he did.

Exactly. Argentina were the better team but lost because their coach was gutless. He set up to hold out for a 1-0 win and had no plan B to fall back on if Germany equalized. Messi could have caused havok in the German defence in extra time, but the idiot had already used all of his substitutes.