Oct 2002 - The story of Dick Jauron "Coward"-gate

[thebandit27]

Are you really going to compare the resources used by the Jauron Bills and the Falcons wrt drafting dbs? Seriously?

 

The earliest pick Atlanta used from 06-09 on a db was the 5th pick of round 2. See for yourself. The Levy/Jauron combo dwarfs this almost every season. Since 1990 the Bills have used a whopping 8 selections on first round dbs, and most of them were during the period when Levy was here. Of course, Jauron took this ticket to losing to the next level. The Falcons used 4. Besides, Atlanta plays in a climate that is more favorable to passing than is Buffalo.

 

Teams need to have strong lines and good quarterbacks before they worry about the secondary. This is a given to all except time tested losers like Dick Jauron.

 

Are you really going to insinuate that the 1990-1999 drafts affect the state of the Dick Jauron-coached Bills?

Are you really going to whittle an entire post down to one line?

Are you really going to bring weather into the equation given that my post also included climates like NY, Denver, Philadelphia, and New England?

 

C'mon Bill, you're better than that. The point of the post is that EVERY team in the NFL drafts DBs early, and that some teams have done it more often recently than others.

[Ramius]

Are you really going to compare the resources used by the Jauron Bills and the Falcons wrt drafting dbs? Seriously?

 

The earliest pick Atlanta used from 06-09 on a db was the 5th pick of round 2. See for yourself. The Levy/Jauron combo dwarfs this almost every season. Since 1990 the Bills have used a whopping 8 selections on first round dbs, and most of them were during the period when Levy was here. Of course, Jauron took this ticket to losing to the next level. The Falcons used 4. Besides, Atlanta plays in a climate that is more favorable to passing than is Buffalo.

 

Teams need to have strong lines and good quarterbacks before they worry about the secondary. This is a given to all except time tested losers like Dick Jauron.

 

The titans have spent 4 of their past 9 1st rounders on DBs, yet you somehow leave them out.

 

And again, please explain how the early 90's bills selecting DBs (which they desperately needed, as our secondary was weak) somehow has a bearing on how the 2009 Bills will play. oh thats right. It has nothing to do with anything.

[thebandit27]

The titans have spent 4 of their past 9 1st rounders on DBs, yet you somehow leave them out.

 

And again, please explain how the early 90's bills selecting DBs (which they desperately needed, as our secondary was weak) somehow has a bearing on how the 2009 Bills will play. oh thats right. It has nothing to do with anything.

 

Logic isn't nearly as fun or convenient as grandstanding about how Dick Jauron drafts 26 DBs every year.

[Bill from NYC]

The titans have spent 4 of their past 9 1st rounders on DBs, yet you somehow leave them out.

 

And again, please explain how the early 90's bills selecting DBs (which they desperately needed, as our secondary was weak) somehow has a bearing on how the 2009 Bills will play. oh thats right. It has nothing to do with anything.

 

I think that when Polian left, Levy played a stronger role. Levy.....the guy who brought us Jauron.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

1. He wanted Whitner instead of Ngata...Loser

2. He had a hand in moving up in the first and drafting John McCargo when Nick Mangold was still there..Loser

3. He wanted Derrick Dockery..Loser

4. Before this draft Jauron was a key personell decisionmaker that was responsible for the malpractice-like neglect of the offensive line in the form of not one lineman drafted before the fifth round and ending up with the likes of Bell, Butler, Pennington and Mertz..Loser

5. Not only did he think Kelsay was starting material, he was on board for the big fat contract extension while going cheap with their all-pro left tackle to the point Peters forced a trade..Loser

5. He wanted Robert Royal..Loser

I'm sorry, but we have no way of knowing whether any of this is true. We have not been given any information into the behind-the-scenes workings of the Bills front office, and we have no clue which ideas came out of which mouths. We also have no idea how much Jauron has been involved with personnel decisions. I have no clue where you're pulling this from.

 

What makes you believe all of this? His title is only Head Coach...we have little to no reason to believe he's been any more involved with the process than any other Head Coach.

[I'm Spartacus]

wherever Dick goes - his protectors are playing the injury card to defend him

 

could it be that his training staff is incompetent?

 

or maybe the injuyies are because his teams are "soft" due to country club training camps and indoor practices which do not prepare the players for the rigors of an NFL season.

No.....

[Ramius]

I think that when Polian left, Levy played a stronger role. Levy.....the guy who brought us Jauron.

 

Interesting you use those 2 people.

 

Marv - If he had more input as you are hypothesizing, he would have had say during the Butler years, from the 93 draft to the 96 draft. In those drafts, the Bills spent 2 firsts and 2 thirds on DBs. They also took a 1st round OL in Rueben Brown.

Now in Marvs second stint with the bills, in 2 years he spent a 1st and a 3rd on DBs.

 

 

Bill Polian - Took over prior to the 1986 draft in buffalo, and his last draft was the 1992 draft. In 7 drafts with the Bills, Polian took 12 DBs in the first 7 rounds of the draft. (i limited the '86-92 drafts to 7 rounds so they'd be comparable to today),including 2 firsts and 2 seconds. In that same span, he spent 2 firsts on OL, in his first and last years with the bills. Note that aside from those 2, he spent a lone 3rd round pick on the OL in all the other years and took no other lineman higher than the 7th round.

 

"Marv years" with buffalo - 3 firsts and 3 thirds on DBs, 12 total DBs over 6 years

"Polian years" with buffalo - 2 firsts, 2 seconds, 1 third, 12 total DBs in 7 years.

Whoopsie! Why are the draft records similar, if these guys have "different ideas on how to build a team?"

 

Now we look at Polian in Indy, which he took over with the 1998 draft: Note that glenn and meadows were drafted by the previous GM. Polian has taken 25 DBs in the 12 drafts he's been in Indy, including 2 firsts, 4 seconds, and 6 thirds. In that same span in Indy, he's drafted exactly 3 OL in the first 2 rounds, with 0 first rounders.

 

Polian with Indy from '98 to '09 - 2 firsts, 4 seconds, 6 thirds and 25 total DBs. 3 picks on the OL in rounds 1-3.

Buffalo from '98-'09 - 4 firsts, 2 seconds, and 2 thirds, and 20 total DBs.In that same span, the bills have spent 5 picks on the OL in rounds 1-3.

 

 

So you tell me who is to blame for the Bills drafting DBs? Seems to me like Polian is the one with the history of extensive drafting of DBs. So perhaps Marv and polian agree on a strategy on what players to target in the draft and what players to target in free agency. Everyone drafts DBs. Everyone drafts lots of DBs. That's the nature of the game. In today's NFL, where there are 3 WRs most of the time, teams need to start as many DBs as OL.

 

Now feel free to ignore the numbers and tell us all how the 2006 draft was an "unmitigated disaster" and set the franchise back 65 years because we took some DBs.

[1billsfan]

The titans have spent 4 of their past 9 1st rounders on DBs, yet you somehow leave them out.

 

And again, please explain how the early 90's bills selecting DBs (which they desperately needed, as our secondary was weak) somehow has a bearing on how the 2009 Bills will play. oh thats right. It has nothing to do with anything.

 

The Titans drafted the all-pro Roos in the second in 2005, signed the perennial all-pro Kevin Mawae from the Jets in 2006 and signed the solid Jake Scott from Indy in 2008. Funny how this coincided in their recent success.

 

Meanwhile, the Bills floundered around overpaying average lineman like Dockery and Walker and foolishly believing that guys like Melvin Fowler and Duke Preston were anywhere near starting center material.

 

The signature Dick Jauron draft was in 2006 when they reached for the DB in Whitner over the DT Ngata and then reached for McCargo over the center Mangold knowing there would be blow-back for not getting the DT. NFL pundits and Bills fans all knew better then these morons that year. So all Bills fans were left with was the hope that Whitner was going to be a monster play-making strong safety worthy of passing over a guy like Ngata. Whoops!

 

Let's get real here. The Titans know what they're doing at every level (coaching and personnel) and the Bills clearly do not.

[Sisyphean Bills]

The Titans drafted the all-pro Roos in the second in 2005, signed the perennial all-pro Kevin Mawae from the Jets in 2006 and signed the solid Jake Scott from Indy in 2008. Funny how this coincided in their recent success.

 

Meanwhile, the Bills floundered around overpaying average lineman like Dockery and Walker and foolishly believing that guys like Melvin Fowler and Duke Preston were anywhere near starting center material.

 

The signature Dick Jauron draft was in 2006 when they reached for the DB in Whitner over the DT Ngata and then reached for McCargo over the center Mangold knowing there would be blow-back for not getting the DT. NFL pundits and Bills fans all knew better then these morons that year. So all Bills fans were left with was the hope that Whitner was going to be a monster play-making strong safety worthy of passing over a guy like Ngata. Whoops!

 

Let's get real here. The Titans know what they're doing at every level (coaching and personnel) and the Bills clearly do not.

Jeff Fisher is doomed without a great QB.

[Ramius]

The Titans drafted the all-pro Roos in the second in 2005, signed the perennial all-pro Kevin Mawae from the Jets in 2006 and signed the solid Jake Scott from Indy in 2008. Funny how this coincided in their recent success.

 

Meanwhile, the Bills floundered around overpaying average lineman like Dockery and Walker and foolishly believing that guys like Melvin Fowler and Duke Preston were anywhere near starting center material.

 

The signature Dick Jauron draft was in 2006 when they reached for the DB in Whitner over the DT Ngata and then reached for McCargo over the center Mangold knowing there would be blow-back for not getting the DT. NFL pundits and Bills fans all knew better then these morons that year. So all Bills fans were left with was the hope that Whitner was going to be a monster play-making strong safety worthy of passing over a guy like Ngata. Whoops!

 

Let's get real here. The Titans know what they're doing at every level (coaching and personnel) and the Bills clearly do not.

 

I'm not defending dick jauron at all. I'm pointing out the error in BillfromNYc's argument. If your head hasn't firmly lodged in your ass, you'd see it was a comparison between Levy and Polian and their drafting strategies. Nowhere did i mention dick jauron. But you've never been one to deal in facts and/or reality, so why start now?

[C.Biscuit97]

Jeff Fisher is doomed without a great QB.

 

 

You realize that Fisher has had 9 non-winning seasons in his 15 years coaching. Most of those years were with a former MVP and #3 pick in McNair. But another great point.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/FishJe0.htm

[Sisyphean Bills]

I'm not defending dick jauron at all. I'm pointing out the error in BillfromNYc's argument. If your head hasn't firmly lodged in your ass, you'd see it was a comparison between Levy and Polian and their drafting strategies. Nowhere did i mention dick jauron. But you've never been one to deal in facts and/or reality, so why start now?

One can look at how Polian approached 3 different teams to get an idea of what his strategy is: Buffalo, Carolina, and Indy. In all 3 cases, he built a team by getting a franchise QB. He either had or got protection for his QB and went after an elite pass rusher. His philosophy is laid bare with the Panthers clean slate, when he drafted a QB, CB, LT, and DE with the team's first 4 picks. The team did not draft a S until after he was gone. He got a good versatile back and a productive WR. In both Indy and Carolina, Polian started with the offense and publicly stated they'd round out the defense with "savvy veterans" and others until they could address it down the road. The concept is to get a strong core: a QB, a QB protecting LT, a QB crushing DE, and a shutdown CB together and put ample weapons on the field so the QB can succeed.

 

Not once did Polian start a rebuild by taking a pint-sized SS. While Marv Levy's tenure as a GM is once and only 2 years (absurdly short), he most definitely started his rebuilding with the defensive secondary. Other than a few really bad free agents, he did nothing with the offense other than wishful thinking that JP Losman was the answer. They didn't even address the pass rush on defense; instead, deciding they needed to trade up to get the last good 3-technique in the draft who, they thought, could fit the new system they were putting in. In year 2, after they decided Willis McGahee wasn't suited to their Mike Martz system, they decided to go out and get Marshawn Lynch and signed a couple of pedestrian lineman, like Walker, to fat contracts. In Dockery's case, the biggest contract in Bills history -- for a guy that was the 3rd or 4th best G in free agency according to some. Trent Edwards wasn't even somebody they were targeting; he was just a player they liked that fell in their lap and so they took him.

[Bill from NYC]

Not once did Polian start a rebuild by taking a pint-sized SS.

 

 

Do you know how funny that sounds? I guess we have to laugh to keep from crying.

 

I doubt if Levy would have hired a coach who was not stupid enough to do the above, let alone spurning offers to trade down. I sincerely believe that somebody (Brandon?) stopped Jauron from drafting dbs as early as he would have liked this year.

[Da Big Man]

hahahahaha, geezus, the s**t is getting deep in here...

 

How anyone that lives in anything remotely close to reality can compare what DJ had to work with in his 3 years in Buffalo to what the Ravens had in talent in Balt when they won Super Bowl should just be banned for being delusional. In fact, you could pool the talent of every team he has ever coached in Chi, Det, and Buffalo and you would struggle to assemble a team as good as Balt that year. That was one of the best defenses in the history of the NFL, and some would argue the best ever. They had a 2000 yard RB, the greatest TE in history, and a QB who managed the game well for them.

Baltimore did it with Defense and a quality coaching staff. The question was with the QB and weak Offense. They made it work and adjusted according to the offense's ability or lack there of. There is only one person in denial here...look in mirror and you will see him. The point is Dicky J and his staff could coach The Patriots and still F that up .

[C.Biscuit97]

Baltimore did it with Defense and a quality coaching staff. The question was with the QB and weak Offense. They made it work and adjusted according to the offense's ability or lack there of. There is only one person in denial here...look in mirror and you will see him. The point is Dicky J and his staff could coach The Patriots and still F that up .

 

 

Dude, you sound like an idiot. Billick was considered an offensive genius and they sucked on offense. Marvin Lewis and Mike Nolan (and now Rex Ryan who hopefully follows the trend) became head coaches after being the Ravens' defensive coordinator. They have had 1 winning season between them. The Ravens won because of their defensive talent is some of the best ever assembled. Using them as example of good caching is beyond stupid.

[Sisyphean Bills]

 

Do you know how funny that sounds? I guess we have to laugh to keep from crying.

 

I doubt if Levy would have hired a coach who was not stupid enough to do the above, let alone spurning offers to trade down. I sincerely believe that somebody (Brandon?) stopped Jauron from drafting dbs as early as he would have liked this year.

Taz me bro.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

I like how coaches run drafts now. I doubt its in the job description, though.

[spartacus]

I like how coaches run drafts now. I doubt its in the job description, though.

 

you would be correct

 

a well run team would have a clear delineation of responsibilities between its HC, GM and other front office personnel.

 

unfortunately in Buffalo we don't have a GM and the front office is not well run

 

we are subjected to the inner circle jerk system where no one has ultimate authority and no one is accountable.

 

but since Dick is the only one with actual football background, it is not beyond reason that he has more input in the circle jerk than other HCs who report to a real GM in a real front office environment.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

but since Dick is the only one with actual football background, it is not beyond reason that he has more input in the circle jerk than other HCs who report to a real GM in a real front office environment.

It is not beyond reason, agreed...but exactly why everyone is assuming we have a Coach/GM, I really can't understand.

[NewHampshireBillsFan]

you would be correct

 

a well run team would have a clear delineation of responsibilities between its HC, GM and other front office personnel.

 

unfortunately in Buffalo we don't have a GM and the front office is not well run

 

we are subjected to the inner circle jerk system where no one has ultimate authority and no one is accountable.

 

but since Dick is the only one with actual football background, it is not beyond reason that he has more input in the circle jerk than other HCs who report to a real GM in a real front office environment.

 

I think Levy had a lot of input in the draft when he was here. I mean Levy would have liked to have coached again and if he couldn't do that he certainly would have wanted to be heavily involved in personnel. Every time Levy was interviewed about the draft and free agent signings he made it seem like he was the decider. Remember how after he drafted Whitner he gave that long summary about how all the SB teams of the last several years had all pro SS's. The point is Levy came back to be involved and not a figurehead. He mentioned that the difference between the GM's job and HC was that his job as GM was now mostly in the off season for the draft and free agent signings.

 

Of course Levy relied heavily on Modrak for serious understanding of how good various prospects were.

 

I think DJ only got more input when Levy left since it left only Modrak and DJ who had serious football backgrounds.

 

I hate to say it because I will always admire Levy, but he should bear any blame about the drafts he was involved in and not DJ.