Da Big Man Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 1. No coach wins with poor lines and poor quarterbacks2. The Bills have given Jauron poor lines and poor quarterbacks Conclusion: Seven wins, nine losses exceeds reasonable expectations. Show me the hole in the logic. A good head coach and OC can generate an offense around any known weakness...that point moot. Example: Baltimore Ravens superbowl victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 1. No coach wins with poor lines and poor quarterbacks2. The Bills have given Jauron poor lines and poor quarterbacks Conclusion: Seven wins, nine losses exceeds reasonable expectations. Show me the hole in the logic. BBB, do you have any reason at all to think that Jauron didn't play a huge role in terms of bringing in these poor players of which you speak? He walked in and fell all over himself to draft first round defensive backs (for his dumb cover-2), and plays them a mile off of the ball. There was more than ample opportunity for him to address both lines and he didn't. He neglected these areas in the draft, and brought in mostly bad players as free agents for 3 years. Obviously, he places more emphasis on the secondary, which btw isn't all that. I am not being a wiseass BBB, but are you really not seeing the above? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunderbill Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Thanks for stealing the time it took me to read this lame post that has no relevance to anything other than some fan who doesnt understand football calling into a radio station and calling him a coward... I used to think the Raiders had the worst fans in football, I am starting to think its now the Bills fans...I mean, we have just had a very good offseason capped by a fantastic draft (based on what we know at this exact moment about the drafted players) and have all the reason to be optimistic, but yet you have your dirty panties in a wad about a dumb phone call probably from some drunk fan 7 years ago... Let me ask you this, whats the one thing DJ has never had during any of the years he has been a HC? Give up...a Quarterback...pretty hard to win in this league or be "aggressive" when your QB is NOT capable of handling that... isn't it partly the coaches job to find that QB? and we won't know if we had a good offseason until several games are played. so many draft picks and vets on new teams have amounted to nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 A good head coach and OC can generate an offense around any known weakness...that point moot. Example: Baltimore Ravens superbowl victory. hahahahaha, geezus, the s**t is getting deep in here... How anyone that lives in anything remotely close to reality can compare what DJ had to work with in his 3 years in Buffalo to what the Ravens had in talent in Balt when they won Super Bowl should just be banned for being delusional. In fact, you could pool the talent of every team he has ever coached in Chi, Det, and Buffalo and you would struggle to assemble a team as good as Balt that year. That was one of the best defenses in the history of the NFL, and some would argue the best ever. They had a 2000 yard RB, the greatest TE in history, and a QB who managed the game well for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 isn't it partly the coaches job to find that QB? and we won't know if we had a good offseason until several games are played. so many draft picks and vets on new teams have amounted to nothing. the front office is respopnsible for acquiring a QB- but our inept talent evalautors is a story for another thread. It is the coaches job to develop the QBs that are on the roster. Dick and his boys are going 0-2 with JP and Trent. Last year, Trent came out like gangbusters and showed he has the talent to be successful. That lasted for 5 games and then Trent became possessed by the ghost of Bruce Mathison. It's the coaches job to rebuild his confidence and put him in position to succeed with play design and play calling. the coaches failed him miserably in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 BBB, do you have any reason at all to think that Jauron didn't play a huge role in terms of bringing in these poor players of which you speak? He walked in and fell all over himself to draft first round defensive backs (for his dumb cover-2), and plays them a mile off of the ball. There was more than ample opportunity for him to address both lines and he didn't. He neglected these areas in the draft, and brought in mostly bad players as free agents for 3 years. Obviously, he places more emphasis on the secondary, which btw isn't all that. I am not being a wiseass BBB, but are you really not seeing the above? isn't it partly the coaches job to find that QB? and we won't know if we had a good offseason until several games are played. so many draft picks and vets on new teams have amounted to nothing. And my question to both of you: Just what is the standard for acquiring players in the NFL, and what has Jauron done to run contrary to that? Are we totally ignoring the Buffalo, NY factor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Just what is the standard for acquiring players in the NFL, and what has Jauron done to run contrary to that? Are we totally ignoring the Buffalo, NY factor? I thought I was clear. Levy'Jauron threw away the 06 draft by chasing defensive backs, including the 8th overall pick. They built the team ass backwards, and it resulted in losses. This is normal for Jauron. He doesn't win. He loses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 I thought I was clear. Levy'Jauron threw away the 06 draft by chasing defensive backs, including the 8th overall pick. They built the team ass backwards, and it resulted in losses. This is normal for Jauron. He doesn't win. He loses. We've gone through this before. The Colts have drafted more defensive backs than the Bills have in the last 10 years. Difference is that they have have Manning while we have had a washed up Bledsoe, Losman, and Holcomb. If Edwards develops this year into the QB they think he is, this team will magically look a lot better. Again, and people love to dismiss it, but Belichick had a worse record than Jauron until Mo Lewis nearly killed Bledsoe. Great coaches are made by great QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 We've gone through this before. The Colts have drafted more defensive backs than the Bills have in the last 10 years. Difference is that they have have Manning while we have had a washed up Bledsoe, Losman, and Holcomb. Yeah, they had Manning......and Meadows, Tarik Glenn, Harrison, James and Freeney before their push on the secondary. See for yourself. That is how a team is built. You don't draft Donte Whitner at #8 when your lines suck because if you do, you will lose. Like Dick Jauron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunderbill Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 It sucks when your Dick is too soft he does lack a mean streak. And my question to both of you: Just what is the standard for acquiring players in the NFL, and what has Jauron done to run contrary to that? Are we totally ignoring the Buffalo, NY factor? Money will knock the Buffalo NY factor on its head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Yeah, they had Manning......and Meadows, Tarik Glenn, Harrison, James and Freeney before their push on the secondary. See for yourself. That is how a team is built. You don't draft Donte Whitner at #8 when your lines suck because if you do, you will lose. Like Dick Jauron. When they drafted Whitner, they thought their lines were set. Our d-lines had more sacks than the Giants d-line and we finished 8th in the NFL. We just signed Dockery, Fowler, drafted Butler, and had a motivated & somewhat in-shape Peters. And for all this talk about Jauron being being in love with dbs, you realize in 4 drafts we have drafted 2 in the first 2 rounds: 1 in the 1st and 1 in the 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 BBB, do you have any reason at all to think that Jauron didn't play a huge role in terms of bringing in these poor players of which you speak? He walked in and fell all over himself to draft first round defensive backs (for his dumb cover-2), and plays them a mile off of the ball. There was more than ample opportunity for him to address both lines and he didn't. He neglected these areas in the draft, and brought in mostly bad players as free agents for 3 years. Obviously, he places more emphasis on the secondary, which btw isn't all that. I am not being a wiseass BBB, but are you really not seeing the above? I'll answer with a question of my own, Bill. Does this post do anything to dispell the theory that, theoretically, Dick Jauron (acting purely as a Head Coach) would win football games with strong line & QB play? If not, the guy coaching the team may not be what needs to be re-examined. The structure of this team's front office is. I strongly believe that with a front office that provides him with ingredients necessary for winning, he can get the job done. We have no way of knowing for certain either way, because Buffalo hasn't done that so far, whether Jauron was (wrongfully?) involved in the process or not. But, then again, this was certainly an encouraging draft (Wood, Levitre)...so maybe something has changed that we aren't privy to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 A good head coach and OC can generate an offense around any known weakness...that point moot. Example: Baltimore Ravens superbowl victory. Baltimore got outstanding line play on both sides of the football, so I'm not sure what you're getting at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynical Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 When they drafted Whitner, they thought their lines were set. Our d-lines had more sacks than the Giants d-line and we finished 8th in the NFL. We just signed Dockery, Fowler, drafted Butler, and had a motivated & somewhat in-shape Peters. And for all this talk about Jauron being being in love with dbs, you realize in 4 drafts we have drafted 2 in the first 2 rounds: 1 in the 1st and 1 in the 2nd. You are so confused, you have no clue what you are talking about: Whitner was drafted #8 overall in 2006 McKelvin was drafted #11 overall in 2007 Byrd was drafted in the 2nd round in 2009 That's THREE in the first 2 rounds in 4 years. By why stop at just the first 2 rounds? Lets count them all up in 2006, they drafted 3 DB in 2007, they drafted 1 DB in 2008, they drafted 3 more DBs in 2009, they drafted 4 more DBs Total drafted: 11 DBs Total # of draftees: 34 That makes almost one third of all draftees were DBs since the Dick has been here. ONE THIRD. Throw in 2 first rounds and 1 second, and it almost becomes sickening Note: that does not include free agent DBs such as Florence Secondly, Butler was drafted in 2006 Fowler was signed in 2006 Walker and Dockery were both signed in 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Then again, there were complaints amongst Bills fans about drafting too many DBs about ten fcking years before Jauron got here, and these complaints have stayed relevant that whole time. So how much this really has to do with the head coach, we could sit here and debate for days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 Then again, there were complaints amongst Bills fans about drafting too many DBs about ten fcking years before Jauron got here, and these complaints have stayed relevant that whole time. So how much this really has to do with the head coach, we could sit here and debate for days. The debating is over about Dick Jauron's head coaching abilities. The jury is in and he sucks monkey balls as an NFL head coach. Frankly, I wouldn't even hire him as an NFL defensive coordinator. For you to keep on excusing this guy's suckitude has now broke on through to the absurd side. Not only does his schemes, game planning and game day decisions suck over and over and over again, the guy has had three years worth of drafts and free agent signings to get "his" players into Buffalo and they still fell off the cliff in 2008 not even winning one freaking stinking AFC East game and losing to the Browns and 49ers at home along the way. They finished the last ten games 2-8. He isn't even excused by poor talent because these are his guys. Other than being good at being a nice guy, he sucks every which way you can suck. Please get a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 The debating is over about Dick Jauron's head coaching abilities. The jury is in and he sucks monkey balls as an NFL head coach. Frankly, I wouldn't even hire him as an NFL defensive coordinator. For you to keep on excusing this guy's suckitude has now broke on through to the absurd side. Not only does his schemes, game planning and game day decisions suck over and over and over again, the guy has had three years worth of drafts and free agent signings to get "his" players into Buffalo and they still fell off the cliff in 2008 not even winning one freaking stinking AFC East game and losing to the Browns and 49ers at home along the way. They finished the last ten games 2-8. He isn't even excused by poor talent because these are his guys. Other than being good at being a nice guy, he sucks every which way you can suck. Please get a clue. You're right. He should have taken teams with crappy lines and awful quarterback play to the SuperBowl. Now I've seen the light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 You're right. He should have taken teams with crappy lines and awful quarterback play to the SuperBowl. Now I've seen the light. Dude, what part of "these are his guys" did you not understand???? 1. He wanted Whitner instead of Ngata...Loser 2. He had a hand in moving up in the first and drafting John McCargo when Nick Mangold was still there..Loser 3. He wanted Derrick Dockery..Loser 4. Before this draft Jauron was a key personell decisionmaker that was responsible for the malpractice-like neglect of the offensive line in the form of not one lineman drafted before the fifth round and ending up with the likes of Bell, Butler, Pennington and Mertz..Loser 5. Not only did he think Kelsay was starting material, he was on board for the big fat contract extension while going cheap with their all-pro left tackle to the point Peters forced a trade..Loser 5. He wanted Robert Royal..Loser You literally have nothing to hang your hat one with regards to Dick Jaroun. Not only does he suck at being a talent decision-maker, he's going to go down as one of the all time worst coaches in the league. BTW, I believe that if Dick were given the 2008 Pittsburgh Steelers last season he still wouldn't have been able to have a winning season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 You are so confused, you have no clue what you are talking about: Whitner was drafted #8 overall in 2006 McKelvin was drafted #11 overall in 2007 Byrd was drafted in the 2nd round in 2009 That's THREE in the first 2 rounds in 4 years. By why stop at just the first 2 rounds? Lets count them all up in 2006, they drafted 3 DB in 2007, they drafted 1 DB in 2008, they drafted 3 more DBs in 2009, they drafted 4 more DBs Total drafted: 11 DBs Total # of draftees: 34 That makes almost one third of all draftees were DBs since the Dick has been here. ONE THIRD. Throw in 2 first rounds and 1 second, and it almost becomes sickening Note: that does not include free agent DBs such as Florence Secondly, Butler was drafted in 2006 Fowler was signed in 2006 Walker and Dockery were both signed in 2007. - San Diego drafted a DB with one of their top 2 picks every year from 2005 to 2008 - TheGiants have spent 3 of their 4 1st & 2nd round picks in 2007 and 2008 on DBs - Denver took DBs in the first round for 3 straight seasons earlier this decade, and drafted 2 DBs in the 2nd round in 2009 (one of which cost them a first rounder in 2010) - The Eagles have drafted more DBs than any other team in football since 2004 - At least 8 teams have drafted multiple DBs in the top 3 rounds since 2005 - The Patriots drafted DBs with their 1st and 3rd picks (both 2nd rounders) in the 2009 draft - Miami drafted DBs with their 2nd and 3rd picks (both 2nd rounders) in the 2009 draft - Atlanta, who drafted as many DBs as Buffalo from 2006 to 2008, drafted DBs in the 2nd and 3rd round in 2009 I know it's fashionable to regurgitate the "Dick Jauron is the only coach that drafts DBs" argument, but it's not exactly a stretch to say that every team drafts more DBs than any other spot. They do make up 20% of most teams' rosters, you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 - Atlanta, who drafted as many DBs as Buffalo from 2006 to 2008, drafted DBs in the 2nd and 3rd round in 2009 Are you really going to compare the resources used by the Jauron Bills and the Falcons wrt drafting dbs? Seriously? The earliest pick Atlanta used from 06-09 on a db was the 5th pick of round 2. See for yourself. The Levy/Jauron combo dwarfs this almost every season. Since 1990 the Bills have used a whopping 8 selections on first round dbs, and most of them were during the period when Levy was here. Of course, Jauron took this ticket to losing to the next level. The Falcons used 4. Besides, Atlanta plays in a climate that is more favorable to passing than is Buffalo. Teams need to have strong lines and good quarterbacks before they worry about the secondary. This is a given to all except time tested losers like Dick Jauron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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