Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 After giving it some serious thought, I have decided that the Bills would be better off trading away our 11th pick and Jason Peters. The real value in this draft is in the twenties of the first round. Many great players can be had in the 2nd and 3rd rounds as well. If we can acquire a first and a third for our 11th and a first and a second or a third for Peters we will have enough picks to fill the many holes that the Bills have on our roster. This scenario will give us, at the very least, two firsts a second a three third round picks. To be perfectly honest, I believe that all of the players that are worth taking at 11 have major question marks. The experts question Andre Smith's desire. It's not known if Orakpo and Maybin are able to play DE or 3-4 OLB. Crabtree has questions about his speed. Robert Ayers could only be a combine/senior bowl stud. Everrette Brown is too small to play DE and not athletic enough to play OLB in our defense. Is Pettigrew worth the eleventh pick? Cushing possibly used steroids. Here are some guys that can be available in the 20's of the first round. All of which have the makings to be good pros. Harvin, Jenkins, Mack, Oher, Maualuga, Jackson, Johnson, Darius Heyward-Bey, Peria Jerry, Vontae Davis, Larry English, Beanie Wells, and Hakeem Nicks. This is where the true values in the draft lie. Granted, not all of these guys are needs the Bills have, but many are. The possibilities are endless if the Bills can pull these trades off. We can end up with OT Oher or OL Mack and TE Pettigrew in the first and possibly DE Michael Johnson or DE Tyson Jackson in the second. We can then solidify the offensive line by selecting one of these guys to play guard, either Unger, Woods, Robinson, and Loadholt can end up falling to us in the third round. With our 2 remaining third rounders we can pick up a SS and a OLB, such as, Marcus Freeman, Sintim, and S Rashad Johnson. Here's what our O-Line can look like. Not so bad, if you ask me. LT Oher LG Hangartner/Woods (he's most likely to be available in the third) C Hangartner/Woods RG Butler RT Walker Add Pettigrew at TE to the mix and these guys should be stout on the line. Don't get me wrong, I don't WANT to get rid of Peters for an unknown, but he's starting to piss me off and that price tag is way too steep, especially after his '08 performance and the fact that the guy has TWO years remaining on his contract and isn't willing to take the very generous offer the Bills gave him even after having said all of that. Peters isn't worth it and this problem can become contagious. At the end of the day, stock piling picks will be the best thing the Bills can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurlyBurly51 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 Here's what our O-Line can look like. Not so bad, if you ask me. LT Oher LG Hangartner/Woods (he's most likely to be available in the third) C Hangartner/Woods RG Butler RT Walker You do realize Oher has a learning disability, and there are serious concerns about his ability to handle the mental aspect of the game in the pros, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 You do realize Oher has a learning disability, and there are serious concerns about his ability to handle the mental aspect of the game in the pros, right? So what you're saying is that Jason Peters is a genius? What did he score on the Wonderlic,a six? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 You do realize Oher has a learning disability, and there are serious concerns about his ability to handle the mental aspect of the game in the pros, right? dude's probably a whole lot smarter than jason-6-wonderlic-peters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurlyBurly51 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 So what you're saying is that Jason Peters is a genius? What did he score on the Wonderlic,a six? Ahh, so we'll replace our proven "genius" for another that has only proven he's able to regress last season. Sounds like a plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 Ahh, so we'll replace our proven "genius" for another that has only proven he's able to regress last season. Sounds like a plan. Every expert has Oher going in the first. Why should I agree with BuffalofreakinDenny's opinion instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 You don't trade for the sake of trading. If a player is there at 11 that another team covets & offers GOOD compensation to move up you make the trade, otherwise you take the guy you have on your board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurlyBurly51 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 Every expert has Oher going in the first. Why should I agree with BuffalofreakinDenny's opinion instead? He also raised serious questions in team interviews regarding his psyche and desire and passion for the game, and needs motivation. Not physically or mentally tough says one expert. Looks disinterested. It could take years before he is ready and needs to be brought along slowly. Not only could he struggle to pick up the mental aspect of the game, but he could be another Mike Williams. Have your draft "experts" reported that? Sounds like a good idea to create a hole at LT and replace a pro bowl performer with this guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 He also raised serious questions in team interviews regarding his psyche and desire and passion for the game, and needs motivation. Not physically or mentally tough says one expert. Looks disinterested. It could take years before he is ready and needs to be brought along slowly. Not only could he struggle to pick up the mental aspect of the game, but he could be another Mike Williams. Have your draft "experts" reported that? Sounds like a good idea to create a hole at LT and replace a pro bowl performer with this guy. Our "pro bowl performer" is only interested in one thing. Money. What's to say HE will play all out once he gets his money? Besides, I'm not fixated on Oher. Maybe the guy from Uconn in the second will be sufficient. How 'bout a one year deal for Jonas Jennings for $3mill just in case an Oher doesn't pan out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 So you are suggesting that the entire left side of our offensive line is filled with inexperienced rookies? Are you insane or just crazy? Do you actually want the Bills to succeed? Stupid notion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 So you are suggesting that the entire left side of our offensive line is filled with inexperienced rookies? Are you insane or just crazy? Do you actually want the Bills to succeed? Stupid notion. Ever hear of Donald Thomas and Jake Long? Miami did pretty good with those rookies. How about Richmond Webb and Keith Sims? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 After giving it some serious thought, I have decided that the Bills would be better off trading away our 11th pick and Jason Peters. The real value in this draft is in the twenties of the first round. Many great players can be had in the 2nd and 3rd rounds as well. If we can acquire a first and a third for our 11th and a first and a second or a third for Peters we will have enough picks to fill the many holes that the Bills have on our roster. This scenario will give us, at the very least, two firsts a second a three third round picks. To be perfectly honest, I believe that all of the players that are worth taking at 11 have major question marks. The experts question Andre Smith's desire. It's not known if Orakpo and Maybin are able to play DE or 3-4 OLB. Crabtree has questions about his speed. Robert Ayers could only be a combine/senior bowl stud. Everrette Brown is too small to play DE and not athletic enough to play OLB in our defense. Is Pettigrew worth the eleventh pick? Cushing possibly used steroids. Here are some guys that can be available in the 20's of the first round. All of which have the makings to be good pros. Harvin, Jenkins, Mack, Oher, Maualuga, Jackson, Johnson, Darius Heyward-Bey, Peria Jerry, Vontae Davis, Larry English, Beanie Wells, and Hakeem Nicks. This is where the true values in the draft lie. Granted, not all of these guys are needs the Bills have, but many are. The possibilities are endless if the Bills can pull these trades off. We can end up with OT Oher or OL Mack and TE Pettigrew in the first and possibly DE Michael Johnson or DE Tyson Jackson in the second. We can then solidify the offensive line by selecting one of these guys to play guard, either Unger, Woods, Robinson, and Loadholt can end up falling to us in the third round. With our 2 remaining third rounders we can pick up a SS and a OLB, such as, Marcus Freeman, Sintim, and S Rashad Johnson. Here's what our O-Line can look like. Not so bad, if you ask me. LT Oher LG Hangartner/Woods (he's most likely to be available in the third) C Hangartner/Woods RG Butler RT Walker Add Pettigrew at TE to the mix and these guys should be stout on the line. Don't get me wrong, I don't WANT to get rid of Peters for an unknown, but he's starting to piss me off and that price tag is way too steep, especially after his '08 performance and the fact that the guy has TWO years remaining on his contract and isn't willing to take the very generous offer the Bills gave him even after having said all of that. Peters isn't worth it and this problem can become contagious. At the end of the day, stock piling picks will be the best thing the Bills can do. The Bills not taking a DE/LB who can get to the QB in the first round = big mistake (in my opinion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 The Bills not taking a DE/LB who can get to the QB in the first round = big mistake (in my opinion). None of these guys at DE are sure things. Besides, you can't fill every hole in one year. There is no such thing as a perfect team with Pro Bowlers at every position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthGeorgiaBillsFan Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 Why do some people think you can replace elite NFL talent in the draft? I'm tired of losing, and if the Bills trade Jason Peters, I don't think there is any way they will be able to assemble a good enough line to allow Trent to utilize his new weaponry. You just cannot replace Jason Peters right now, and those of you who think he "sucked" last year quite obviously are ignorant to the fact that football is a game with many dynamics and that a stat line doesn't ever tell the whole story. If the Bills trade Peters we will lose, plain and simple. No Peters, no playoffs. Period. LT OherLG Hangartner/Woods (he's most likely to be available in the third) C Hangartner/Woods RG Butler RT Walker This doesn't look bad to you? Look we aren't trying to win an ACC championship here pal. WTF are you smoking? Let's see, we would have two rookies who aren't even top flight or a career backup protecting Trent's blind side. And you think that's good? Not to mention Butler is pretty much minimum starting caliber and Langston walker is by no means a superstar. Thanks for inadvertently proving my point. Take a good look at this guy's suggested starting O-line all you people who want to trade Jason Peters away and ask yourself if this is really going to lead us to the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 Why do some people think you can replace elite NFL talent in the draft? I'm tired of losing, and if the Bills trade Jason Peters, I don't think there is any way they will be able to assemble a good enough line to allow Trent to utilize his new weaponry. You just cannot replace Jason Peters right now, and those of you who think he "sucked" last year quite obviously are ignorant to the fact that football is a game with many dynamics and that a stat line doesn't ever tell the whole story. If the Bills trade Peters we will lose, plain and simple. No Peters, no playoffs. Period. With Peters, no playoffs. What's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynchMob23 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 And the key is that anyone we draft for pass rush purposes will not show it this year - the average defensive end gets about 3 - 4 sacks his first year, not the 17.5 some think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 After giving it some serious thought, I have decided that the Bills would be better off trading away our 11th pick and Jason Peters. The real value in this draft is in the twenties of the first round. Many great players can be had in the 2nd and 3rd rounds as well. If we can acquire a first and a third for our 11th and a first and a second or a third for Peters we will have enough picks to fill the many holes that the Bills have on our roster. This scenario will give us, at the very least, two firsts a second a three third round picks. To be perfectly honest, I believe that all of the players that are worth taking at 11 have major question marks. The experts question Andre Smith's desire. It's not known if Orakpo and Maybin are able to play DE or 3-4 OLB. Crabtree has questions about his speed. Robert Ayers could only be a combine/senior bowl stud. Everrette Brown is too small to play DE and not athletic enough to play OLB in our defense. Is Pettigrew worth the eleventh pick? Cushing possibly used steroids. Here are some guys that can be available in the 20's of the first round. All of which have the makings to be good pros. Harvin, Jenkins, Mack, Oher, Maualuga, Jackson, Johnson, Darius Heyward-Bey, Peria Jerry, Vontae Davis, Larry English, Beanie Wells, and Hakeem Nicks. This is where the true values in the draft lie. Granted, not all of these guys are needs the Bills have, but many are. The possibilities are endless if the Bills can pull these trades off. We can end up with OT Oher or OL Mack and TE Pettigrew in the first and possibly DE Michael Johnson or DE Tyson Jackson in the second. We can then solidify the offensive line by selecting one of these guys to play guard, either Unger, Woods, Robinson, and Loadholt can end up falling to us in the third round. With our 2 remaining third rounders we can pick up a SS and a OLB, such as, Marcus Freeman, Sintim, and S Rashad Johnson. Here's what our O-Line can look like. Not so bad, if you ask me. LT Oher LG Hangartner/Woods (he's most likely to be available in the third) C Hangartner/Woods RG Butler RT Walker Add Pettigrew at TE to the mix and these guys should be stout on the line. Don't get me wrong, I don't WANT to get rid of Peters for an unknown, but he's starting to piss me off and that price tag is way too steep, especially after his '08 performance and the fact that the guy has TWO years remaining on his contract and isn't willing to take the very generous offer the Bills gave him even after having said all of that. Peters isn't worth it and this problem can become contagious. At the end of the day, stock piling picks will be the best thing the Bills can do. Dude, your asking for Buffalo to pick guys in the 2nd and 3rd rounds that will fly off the board between picks 17 and 30...Tyson Jackson in the 2nd? Come on man, there's no way. Eric Wood, Clint Sintim, Phil Loadholdt, and Rashad Johnson in the 3rd? Forget about it, not happening. I realize that it's fun to surmise wheel-and-deal situations that end up with great players falling to Buffalo's new draft position, but very little of your post is realistic. Here are some other general comments: - It's highly unlikely that any of the top 4 OTs will be on the board when Buffalo picks at 11, which means it would be extremely risky to trade Peters. - Everette Brown is not too small to play DE in the NFL, there are plenty of guys that play the position successfully that are either shorter or lighter than Brown. The real question--in my opinion--is whether or not he has the pure pass-rushing prowess to make it as a DE. - As far as Peters' price tag, Buffalo is paying premier salaries at only 3 positions (WR, DT, and DE). Most NFL teams pay premier money to at least 5 (QB, OT, WR, DE, and CB), so it's not outlandish for Buffalo to do the same, especially if they cut some dead weight like Kelsay. Just my 1 cent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthGeorgiaBillsFan Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 With Peters, no playoffs. What's your point? The point is that last year teams starting shutting us down by double teaming Lee Evans and loading 8 guys in the box. Trent had no place to go with the ball, and Lynch was unable to really dictate a game despite his impressive season like he would be able to against an honest defense. With no options to throw to, Trent did the smart thing and ate sacks rather than throw picks, and his 10 ints is testament to that. It's not that he didn't have comparably good time to throw, its that nobody could get open, and that's the dynamic of the game I'm referring to that doesn't show up on the stat line. The point is with TO on the field, nobody will be able to load up the box, and defenses will have to pretty much give single coverage to either TO or Lee, or drop more defenders into coverage, thus lessening the pressure on the QB. Either way, Trent is going to have options. But you take Jason Peters out of there and put two rookies on Trent's blind side and our quarterback is going to be injured before the season reaches the half way point. That's my point you brainless waste of bandwidth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 Ever hear of Donald Thomas and Jake Long? Miami did pretty good with those rookies. How about Richmond Webb and Keith Sims? Yeah, right. Ever hear of Mike Williams? He was a rookie starter and he was AWESOME! Any fan who thinks they can predict performance of a rookie is smoking crack. Starting rookies isn't a recipe for winning. Suggesting that it is - pure stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 With Peters, no playoffs. What's your point? I agree. Ive been trying to back this for over a month now. I think you would see the following line start the season LT Walker LG Unger/Mack C Hangartner RG Butler RT Bell And by the end of the season you would see LG switch with C once the rookies get a better feel for the line calls. Possibly Bell and Walker switch at RT+LT Walker played fine last season when filling in for JP he can do it again. Also we have an unknown at Bell, for all we know, the Bills could have more promise with him than they have with Peters. I hope Bell becomes a stud LT and makes the Pro-Bowl for the next 3 years. All of the Peters lovers will shut their mouths then. If not, I'll eat my crow with salt and pepper and enjoy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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