Keep telling us McD wasn’t the problem…

[MasterStrategist]

52 minutes ago, Einstein said:

That MVP level QB was developed under his coaching/coaching staff. 

Funny how that never gets attributed.

Allen came to this league RAW. McDermott and his staff developed him. Then McD gets the blame for not getting that talent he developed into a superstar into the Super Bowl.

Wait, we are supposed to give credit to McD for developing Josh?!  Entire new level of hot takes now.

 

I give McD credit for getting Daboll here as the OC, but also Daboll had obvious local ties as well.  So it was a likely landing spot for him anyhow.

 

But I give Daboll and Beane credit for identifying Josh as a top echelon QB, when a lot of opinions were polarized.  And Daboll credit for developing Josh.  Daboll and Josh were basically best friends during his time here, McD was more rigid and too uptight --- it was only over the past couple years that McD and Josh started to form a closer bond, and McD started to loosen the reigns.

[transient]

33 minutes ago, Einstein said:

That MVP level QB was developed under his coaching/coaching staff. 

Funny how that never gets attributed.

Allen came to this league RAW. McDermott and his staff developed him. Then McD gets the blame for not getting that talent he developed into a superstar into the Super Bowl.

I don't think you account enough for the fact that Allen is most likely one of those rare athletes that was going to become who he is today regardless of where he ended up. His natural talent/athletic ability, work ethic, and drive to improve is probably the only thing that kept the organization from sinking him at the outset. Their rookie development plan with him was atrocious and blew up by the first half of the first game of Allen's career. Do you recall the sit and learn behind AJ McCarron/Nate Peterman fiasco? After they dealt McCarron, they didn't even have the common sense to add a veteran QB voice in the room until October, when they signed Derek Anderson after Allen hurt his elbow, then Matt Barkley after Anderson got hurt. They're lucky they managed to draft right Josh. Wrong Josh, Darnold and possibly Mayfield would have been broken by midseason of year 1 with a developmental plan like that combined with the relative lack of talent on offense. 

[Einstein]

1 minute ago, transient said:

I don't think you account enough for the fact that Allen is most likely one of those rare athletes that was going to become who he is today regardless of where he ended up.

We have zero proof of this.

[MasterStrategist]

46 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

That’s just not true at all to me. I enjoyed each season as we posted the best winning percentage in North American sports over a period of years. A lot of cool things happened that were not the Super Bowl. If you can’t enjoy the ride, I don’t know why you get on the train. To each their own. 

 

 

Pretty certain the poster is referring to why McD is gone now, ie: lack of success to get us to the big game. 

 

Not the "enjoyment" aspect of what our team has brought to fans.  2 different topics IMO.  I think most people would be lying, if they didn't enjoy the last 5-6 seasons of Bills football -- but when it comes to what our expectations have now become, getting to the SB is the bar.

 

 

[Einstein]

5 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

Wait, we are supposed to give credit to McD for developing Josh?!  Entire new level of hot takes now.

Absolutely. Why wouldnt he? 

Belichick, a defensive coach, gets credit for developing Brady, too.

McD put the staff together that developed Josh to who he is today. He deserves credit for that.

[Nihilarian]

On 5/5/2026 at 10:44 AM, Augie said:

 

I’d say we lost to the Giants in the SB because Jim Kelly would not just keep handing the ball to Thurman Thomas, who should have been the MVP of that Super Bowl victory. 

This!

 

Ted Marchibroda taught Jim Kelly the offense and to call his own plays. Kelly kept calling for pass plays and ignoring what got them there, and that was Thurman Thomas. Thomas kept Barry Sanders on the bench at OSU, and he was Marshall Faulk before Marshal Faulk. 

 

Both John Elway and Dan Marino stated they wished they had an RB like Thomas, and eventually, Elway got one in TD...finally, he won some SB with him.

 

In that 1990 SB, they still had Marchibroda as OC, and apparently, the Buffalo Bills coaching staff failed to see what the NY Giants did to the SF 49ers with Joe Montana in SF for that NFL Championship game. Beating them at SF by a score of 15-13. The Giants held Rodger Craig to 8 rushes for 28 yards. Rice had 5 receptions for 54 yards, and Montana went 18 of 26 for 190 yards, 1 TD.

 

The thing about that game was the overconfidence by the Buffalo players, coaching staff, and, at one point, before the game, they were 20+ point favorites. The Bills had just beaten the Giants at their stadium in week 13 that season, with both starting QBs getting injured and both backups finishing the game, which Buffalo won 17-13.

 

Now, for the SB, Phil Simms was out injured, and nobody had any faith in Jeff Hostetler to win that game for them...except Bill Parcells.

[MasterStrategist]

Just now, Einstein said:

Absolutely. Why wouldnt he? 

Belichick, a defensive coach, gets credit for developing Brady, too.

McD put the staff together that developed Josh to who he is today. He deserves credit for that.

As I said, I agree with McD getting Daboll here.  From there, it was Daboll finding his offensive staff.  How much was this McD bringing Daboll to Buffalo, versus Beane versus other connections (from his local upbringing) --- that part is unknown, but I'll give McD credit for getting Daboll here.

 

From there, McD could have fallen off a cliff and Josh would be who Josh is today.  Daboll was the best coach for him at the time, I'm convinced of that.  And it was obvious with the bond they established.  

 

No offense, but I think if we asked 100 Bills fans, a very high majority would say Josh was just "special" and was going to become who he is today regardless.  Dude has an unbelievable level of competitiveness, grit, work-ethic from his upbringing that led to who he is today (along with his insane talent).

 

 

[ngbills]

2 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Absolutely. Why wouldnt he? 

Belichick, a defensive coach, gets credit for developing Brady, too.

McD put the staff together that developed Josh to who he is today. He deserves credit for that.

Here is how it works...

 

Its McD fault our offense went conservative. Its McD fault we didn't value WR's. It's McD fault players played tight in important games. Its McD we signed average players and did not draft well. 

 

McD had nothing to do with developing Josh. McD had nothing to do with being a record setting winning team. McD had nothing to do with any of the offensive success. 

[Mikie2times]

 

53 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Here is how it works...

 

Its McD fault our offense went conservative. Its McD fault we didn't value WR's. It's McD fault players played tight in important games. Its McD we signed average players and did not draft well. 

 

McD had nothing to do with developing Josh. McD had nothing to do with being a record setting winning team. McD had nothing to do with any of the offensive success. 

Its funny that your sarcasm is closer to reality than your beliefs. 

 

Its McD fault our offense went conservative. 100% and not even disputed by his fan boys

Its McD fault we didn't value WR's. Very possible towards the end, not as clear at the start

It's McD fault players played tight in important games. Seems pretty obvious at this point 

Its McD we signed average players and did not draft well. Debatable, reasonable to think he boxed in desirable traits for his scheme, but can't put it all on him

McD had nothing to do with developing Josh. A lot less than some here think. People are throwing around BB, one of the all time football minds. Josh used Dabs and Palmer more than anything. McD didn't care about the offense his first few years.

McD had nothing to do with being a record setting winning team. He played a role in our consistency and domination of sub par teams, but was HC in one of the weakest divisions in the NFL with a HOF QB, what should have been the expectation for him?

McD had nothing to do with any of the offensive success. He really didn't, how exactly did he from your POV?

 

[transient]

50 minutes ago, Einstein said:

We have zero proof of this.

Astute observation... that I have no proof of the unprovable. We also have nothing that disproves it... and we have plenty of evidence that suggests it's a fairly reasonable conjecture. 

[GaryPinC]

1 hour ago, Einstein said:

We have zero proof of this.

Josh being so humble and driven to better himself is really all the proof you need.  The attention to detail, conversations with former quarterbacks for learning and advice.  Plus, his rookie year wasn't a plan, it was a sh*t show.  Obviously the physical abilities.  Josh, Mahomes, and and Lamar are all examples of QB's who would have succeeded regardless of their situation because they are so self-motivated to succeed.  Baker Mayfield was never as driven as Josh to better himself, and while Sam Darnold worked out with Palmer also, there was an article back then saying Sam never had the same attention to details when he worked out there.

Baker and Sam I consider talented guys that found the right circumstances and coaching to be developed.

[Augie]

1 hour ago, MasterStrategist said:

Pretty certain the poster is referring to why McD is gone now, ie: lack of success to get us to the big game. 

 

Not the "enjoyment" aspect of what our team has brought to fans.  2 different topics IMO.  I think most people would be lying, if they didn't enjoy the last 5-6 seasons of Bills football -- but when it comes to what our expectations have now become, getting to the SB is the bar.

 

 

 

What do you mean by “the bar”? I’d describe it as the goal. Just because you didn’t reach your ultimate goal does not make a season a failure, imo. It can be disappointing, but that is different from failure. 

[HerdMenatlity1]

2 hours ago, Augie said:

 

That’s just not true at all to me. I enjoyed each season as we posted the best winning percentage in North American sports over a period of years. A lot of cool things happened that were not the Super Bowl. If you can’t enjoy the ride, I don’t know why you get on the train. To each their own. 

 

 

Augie, thanks for this post. I have essentially stopped coming here, much less post here. Why? This place seems to thrive on negativity. Kinda like Joe and Jeremy in the morning show on wgr. Every Monday morning, their show was the 'We won but...' show, or the 'Negative Nancy' show. A symptom of them growing up watching both the Sabres and the Bills sucking as franchises. I get it. to a point. after a while, why not just sit back and enjoy what is going on with this franchise right now? I enjoyed the great play of the Bills in the early 90's. It was fun and it was winning football. A lot better than the consecutive 2-14 seasons I endured prior to this team of the 90's. Fast forward past a bunch of crap seasons of no playoffs and having to see Sexy Rexy coaching us and we're an elite franchise again that has been playing winning football over the past few years. Fun times for me. 

[Augie]

19 minutes ago, HerdMenatlity1 said:

Augie, thanks for this post. I have essentially stopped coming here, much less post here. Why? This place seems to thrive on negativity. Kinda like Joe and Jeremy in the morning show on wgr. Every Monday morning, their show was the 'We won but...' show, or the 'Negative Nancy' show. A symptom of them growing up watching both the Sabres and the Bills sucking as franchises. I get it. to a point. after a while, why not just sit back and enjoy what is going on with this franchise right now? I enjoyed the great play of the Bills in the early 90's. It was fun and it was winning football. A lot better than the consecutive 2-14 seasons I endured prior to this team of the 90's. Fast forward past a bunch of crap seasons of no playoffs and having to see Sexy Rexy coaching us and we're an elite franchise again that has been playing winning football over the past few years. Fun times for me. 

 

Those 2-14 seasons were the first two years of my marriage. My bride asked me “why do you do this to yourself???”  😂  She now wears a Bills shirt that says “I Married Into This”. We have fun with it, and we have Bills stuff everywhere, but it’s a game played for entertainment. 

 

There are legitimate things to be upset with when it comes to the Bills. It is also true that some people just like to complain. After the Ravens game this season I employed the Ignore feature to weed some of that out. I must say, if you weed out a handful of the most chronically negative life here gets better. 

[13 Seconds to Mars]

3 hours ago, Augie said:

 

That’s just not true at all to me. I enjoyed each season as we posted the best winning percentage in North American sports over a period of years. A lot of cool things happened that were not the Super Bowl. If you can’t enjoy the ride, I don’t know why you get on the train. To each their own. 

 

 

I hate the “If you’re not first, you’re last” attitude. Division titles, All Pros, MVPs, Classic games win or lose all matter to me as a fan. Obviously, I want a title, but I’m not going to look at the past 30+ years as a waste. The Bills not winning a SB does not make fans or players losers. There is so much that goes into winning one. Skill, luck, injuries, and officiating all going your way. 

[SoTier]

3 hours ago, Augie said:

 

That’s just not true at all to me. I enjoyed each season as we posted the best winning percentage in North American sports over a period of years. A lot of cool things happened that were not the Super Bowl. If you can’t enjoy the ride, I don’t know why you get on the train. To each their own. 

 

 

 

Prior to the McDermott era, the Bills had all of 22 winning seasons.  Not playoff seasons (they had 17 of those) but 22 seasons in which they won more games than they lost.  In the 1970s, they had just three winning seasons and 1 playoff season.  Of course they topped that by having only a single winning season and no playoffs between 2000 and 2009, and then extended that sad scenario to have only 2 winning seasons and no playoffs in the first 17 years of the 21st century.   Moreover, the way that the Bills lost games during the Drought isn't expressed by numbers alone.   I remember one game they were up on the Patriots something like 21-0 in the first half and were crushed in the second half when NE rang up 52 points.   On the opposite side, there was that god awful game against the Browns that the Bills lost on a fumbled kick reception IIRC, 6-3.  Fun, fun, fun ... not.

 

During his tenure as Bills HC, McDermott chalked up 98 wins in 148 games and had 8 winning seasons and 8 playoff seasons in 9 years.  His teams made being a Bills fan fun again.   They were exciting.   The best thing about Bills games was celebrating great plays that led to win after win against good teams rather than the tailgating before the inevitable losses to mediocre opponents.   

 

That doesn't mean that McDermott should have remained the Bills HC indefinitely.   Maybe McDermott had reached the highest level he could go, and it was time to try something -- someone-- new.  I'm good with that.  What McDermott doesn't deserve is the hatred that some posters have expressed for him in this thread and some of the previous ones.  Get over it.  He was a good coach, maybe a great one.   He deserves to be considered with Marv Levy and Chuck Knox as among the best Bills coaches of all time and not with the bottom feeders that some haters have compared him to in this thread.

Edited May 6 by SoTier

[Einstein]

2 hours ago, transient said:

Astute observation... that I have no proof of the unprovable. We also have nothing that disproves it... and we have plenty of evidence that suggests it's a fairly reasonable conjecture. 

 

That’s a long way of saying “I pulled my comment out of you know where”

[Nihilarian]

3 hours ago, ngbills said:

Here is how it works...

 

Its McD fault our offense went conservative. Its McD fault we didn't value WR's. It's McD fault players played tight in important games. Its McD we signed average players and did not draft well. 

 

McD had nothing to do with developing Josh. McD had nothing to do with being a record setting winning team. McD had nothing to do with any of the offensive success. 

Funny stuff.

 

While I think that the buck stops with the head coach. I also think it's ridiculous the amount of Buffalo Bills fans that are crapping on the best HC this franchise has seen since the 90s.  

 

It's like on game day, when reading the posts here, and the team starts losing so many fans, just spewing negativity about everything. Now, there have been times when it's been deserved, and fans would bark at me for being negative about Rex Ryan, and so many other bums that attempted to run the team properly, and couldn't get it done. 

 

This head coach built a team that so many NFL players wanted to come here to play, and that didn't happen in the past. The bad winters, the small city/nightlife, the losing. McDermott built a culture in Buffalo that other NFL players wanted to join, and as Joey Bosa stated, it is one of the NFL's best franchises, and how good it is to be a Buffalo Bill. 

 

As others have stated, perhaps it was time for a change, as this franchise couldn't get to the Super Bowl after so many years. And it was either promote Joe Brady or lose him to a different NFL team. I get it. What I don't get is a thread like this still complaining about the man who turned this franchise around while making them the envy of most other NFL teams. 

 

 

EDIT: Oh, and it's not just Josh Allen. In 2023, when the team was 6-6 and about to lose the division to the 9-3 Miami Dolphins, McDermott made the change to fire OC Ken Dorsey and promote Joe Brady. When an assistant coach wasn't getting it done, McDermott made the change to improve the team. So many different coaching changes all over the team in the last nine years. 

 

Edited May 6 by Nihilarian

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, 13 Seconds to Mars said:

I hate the “If you’re not first, you’re last” attitude. 

 

I used to be this person.

 

I was wrong.

 

And others will realize how wrong they are to think this way when we are *actually* among the last again.

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, MasterStrategist said:

Wait, we are supposed to give credit to McD for developing Josh?!  Entire new level of hot takes now.

 

I give McD credit for getting Daboll here as the OC, but also Daboll had obvious local ties as well.  So it was a likely landing spot for him anyhow.

 

But I give Daboll and Beane credit for identifying Josh as a top echelon QB, when a lot of opinions were polarized.  And Daboll credit for developing Josh.  Daboll and Josh were basically best friends during his time here, McD was more rigid and too uptight --- it was only over the past couple years that McD and Josh started to form a closer bond, and McD started to loosen the reigns.

Daboll wasn't even at Josh Allen's wedding and Sean McDermott was one of the few football players or coaches there 

 

Josh Allen took one of his biggest steps when Sean McDermott stepped in and told Brian daboll to stop screaming in his face on the sideline 

 

Josh's early career you would see daboll screaming at Josh on the sideline red as a tomatoe.. Sean McDermott literally was the one to step in and say hey you can't coach him like that on game day 

 

And then the dynamic changed and Josh continued to grow even more 

 

A head coach gets credit for hiring his coordinators and Sean McDermott 100% had to be ok with the Buffalo Bills drafting Josh Allen because it's his career on the line too 

 

And Josh Allen is on record saying Sean McDermott help them grow as a football player and coach Sean McDermott was here for 9 years of course he helped 

 

Nobody gets a 100% of the credit Brian was here for 3 years.. sean has been a steady influence for 9 

 

He absolutely deserves SOME credit.. this website is ridiculous on one half they say Sean McDermott had too much control of the organization lol and on the other they're not willing to give him any credit for helping Josh grow when he was the only consistent constant for 9 years 

 

He's a professional football coach who slept at one Bills drive.. of course he helped Josh Allen grow as a football player he doesn't have to be a quarterback guru to do that

 

Bill belichick helped Tom Brady.. Sean absolutely helped Josh 

 

It literally takes an entire organization a dozen people to develop a franchise quarterback like the bills did with Josh Allen

 

Nobody says Sean deserves a 100% of credit for developing Josh Allen but he deserves some credit 

 

Buffalo Bills and Sean McDermott would have developed Baker Mayfield better than the browns did.. and they would have developed Sam darnold better than the Jets did 

 

That's all you have to know about 9 years ago we would have developed both those quarterbacks better than the franchises that failed them did

 

They all would at least have been more successful getting developed in Buffalo then buy those franchises

Edited May 6 by Buffalo716