Beane debate has gone too far

[GunnerBill]

38 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

I don't know why you think it impossible for a coach to have final say GB. Pat Kirwan said on his radio show that Pete Carroll was in charge of the draft when he was the Jet coach. Do you think that anyone could overrule Bill Parcells in the draft room? Parcells even spoke about this.

 

When McDermott was hired in 2017, Beane wasn't there. The two of them worked together on the Panthers. Now, who got who the job?  McDermott sold Mr. Pegula a bill of goods and he went for it. 

 

Mr. Pegula made the right move. I wish McDermott well. I sincerely do but it was time for a change and I support this move 100%.

 

I think he made the right move too. But as per Brandon Beane and Terry Pegula, Brandon Beane had the final say on draft picks. Always. Even when he chose guys it was coaches or scouts pushing for.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

18 minutes ago, NewEra said:

We need to execute better.

Line them up.  I can think of a few, players and executives.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think he made the right move too. But as per Brandon Beane and Terry Pegula, Brandon Beane had the final say on draft picks. Always. Even when he chose guys it was coaches or scouts pushing for.

Thats easy to say but it’s probably not that simple. For example, last year, I’m guessing it goes down more like McD desperately wants to fortify the D Line, and Beane gets the final say on exactly which player they draft from a pool of three or four possible candidates. 

[Epstein's Mother]

12 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I literally cant remember 

Yesterday 🤣

 

 You're so lucky.

[Mister Defense]

12 hours ago, ToGoGo said:

I’m on the “everything is going to be OK side”. 

 

Okay, thank you. I am there overall  and in general too.

 

But I am concerned that this was not a planned move, but  based on a very emotional response by the players after the loss and the owner witnessing this.

 

The reason that concerns me is because of that they did not think this out, including the laser like focus they should have had on their top coaching choices going forward if they were to let McDermott go.  From my experiences in life, that type of  first step is not one that often lends itself to good follow up steps.

 

So, no ducks in a row at all, making it less likely they will get a better coach now, capable in helping the Bills win it all finally.

 

But I hope they do get that better coach now and that will convince me even more that  "everything is going to be OK". 

 

Should know in the coming weeks.

 

 

[ToGoGo]

Just now, Mister Defense said:

 

Okay, thank you. I am there overall  and in general too.

 

But I am concerned that this was not a planned move, but  based on a very emotional response by the players after the loss and the owner witnessing this.

 

The reason that concerns me is because of that they did not think this out, including the laser like focus they should have had on their top coaching choices going forward if they were to let McDermott go.  From my experiences in life, that type of  first step is not one that often lends itself to good follow up steps.

 

So, no ducks in a row at all, making it less likely they will get a better coach now, capable in helping the Bills win it all finally.

 

But I hope they do get that better coach now and that will convince me even more that  "everything is going to be OK". 

 

Should know in the coming weeks.

 

 

McD was a sacrifice. No doubt. Someone had to go in Terry’s eyes. There were probably plenty of finger pointing at OBD since the Pats loss. 
 

But I know Beane is a savvy and competent GM despite the recent narratives. 
 

I’m staying positive since we have Allen and McDermott for all his positives was a “controller” personality. I don’t mean that in a bad way,l and thank God we hired him, but it was time to let Allen gain some more seniority and find a coach who will build around him rather than the defense. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

14 hours ago, Mikie2times said:

I think we need to allow him FA and the draft to build this out. Milano was very good this year. Shaq was a huge surprise. Will those guys be back? Hoecht looked like he was going to ball out. Groot is at least Karlaftis quality. Perhaps if he doesn't have so much run contain he makes more splash plays.  He's had some good value defensive signing in the past. Floyd comes to mind, even Bosa this year until he just fizzled out. This will be the first offseason under this layout, lets see what that ends up looking like. 

 

 

I have been completely aligned with nearly all your takes of late and agree completely on not fully blowing this up. It's also what I originally wanted but the more I have watched this play out the more I think that would have been a mistake. Beane is competent, that helps keep Terry competent. We have been very close and have a lot of good going with the culture. It the whole thing was blown up I would be way less confident than I am now. 

 

Defensively the Bills have some good players, as has been pointed out, the Bills  have very few to any all-pros on defense and that's been the issue.  Think if the Bills were able to get either Crosby or Hendrickson, pair him with Groot, Oliver, and Walker and the line is much better.  Likely need at least 1 if not 2 LB's but that's not a super high paying position so that helps.  Make changes there, put Benford, Hairston, Bishop in secondary with guys like Lewis, White, Sanders and a couple more and this defense could look much better very quickly.

 

As was pointed out guys like Poona Ford looked much better elsewhere so maybe the issue we have isn't the players, but the scheme??

14 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

Don’t you need me to post the 50 times this season they let defenders run straight at Allen?

 

Well we do agree on this one! 

 

I do wonder if McGovern has some injury as his play dropped off a fair amount this year.   Both him and Dawkins seemed to have had a lot of whiffs on pass blocking.  If McGovern was 100% healthy this season, then think I may let him walk, if turns out he was playing all season injured, then may try and bring him back as then the drop off in play is explainable.

Edited January 23 by Ed_Formerly_of_Roch

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

17 hours ago, bmur66 said:

I love to see the Bills offense play the Bills defense for real. How would that go?

Too many injuries! 🙁

Including three down from late Rapp berserkers.

[JP51]

18 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Someone pin this.  Well done, especially the bolded is pretty spot on and important

Especially the bolded spot... McD's vision of what succeeds defensively to me is flawed. 

[mjt328]

Looking around the league, I don't see any dominant rosters.

The teams with the strongest overall rosters either don't have a franchise QB, or they have a young guy who hasn't gotten paid yet.

 

At the same time, the media and fans tend to look at rosters through a Fantasy Football and Pro Bowl lens.

Meaning they see QB first.  Then what players are stars.  Then skill positions that get yards and score points.

Having one of the better O-Lines in the NFL doesn't mean squat to the average person, and never comes into consideration.

 

Contrary to popular opinion, the Bills aren't Josh Allen and a bunch of trash.

They have a good overall roster.  Not great or exceptional.  But good.

 

I'm not saying this to excuse Beane.  He's made a lot of mistakes.

This team doesn't have enough difference makers, because he's too comfortable taking safe/solid B level players.

He's also missed on a lot of picks and free agents, which would have possibly put us over the top.

 

Overall, I can understand Pegula feeling that something needed to change... but shy away from completely blowing everything up and starting over.

Maybe giving Beane a chance to start over with a new coach will work.  

[The Wiz]

I think it's just getting started.

 

 

[BigDingus]

I get what you're saying, but I am in 100% disagreement about who we fired.

 

It should've been either BOTH fired or Beane fired.

 

McDermott did a miracle job with this roster. Had our QB not suddenly regressed to turnover machine Josh, we would've beaten the 1 seed, on the road, with a heavily depleted roster of little talent!

 

So how McDermott could get fired, when roster assembly falls more in Beane's purview, is beyond me. 

[nedboy7]

1 minute ago, BigDingus said:

I get what you're saying, but I am in 100% disagreement about who we fired.

 

It should've been either BOTH fired or Beane fired.

 

McDermott did a miracle job with this roster. Had our QB not suddenly regressed to turnover machine Josh, we would've beaten the 1 seed, on the road, with a heavily depleted roster of little talent!

 

So how McDermott could get fired, when roster assembly falls more in Beane's purview, is beyond me. 

You don’t think Rivers could have done a better job?  😜

[colin]

beane might have had the final say on picks and free agent signings, but he didn't just pick guys he liked, he picked guys for the team mcd was coaching.  he picked scheme fit players.  he re built the offense from dabol bombs away to number one rushing in the nfl.  maybe you can argue the o was successful because of josh, even in spite of the rest of the o roster and coaching (i often do) but guess who made player and pick trades to get allen, guess who extended him twice?  ya, THE DARK LORD KING BEANE.

 

it's true we have chumps and fools  all over the d, which sucks hairy bags when it matters, but that d was mcd's baby.  mcd brought in the elite expert team of absolutely no one of merit including frazier (who i will credit as having his own chops and walking away from mcd, but it's not like mcd protested too strongly to keep him) WHO MCD EMASCULATED BY TAKING PLAY CALLING AWAY FROM ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS.  jim fassil of the nyg famously took pay calling away from jason garret and took them to a super bowl, but he never gave it back.  he realized once you make that move you undermine the man in front of everyone, you take the reigns you gotta steer the horse.  mcd treated his d coaches like student drivers, just jumping in when he thought he needed to and giving them back the wheel.  who does that?  who would want to work for that guy?  so yes the d sucks bad, but in the same way mcd was a squirrely little red faced clap merchant with his coaches, what grown up would think he didn't have a similar impact on the roster?  he absolutely needed his guys, only a select few smaller slower and less talented players can possibly fit into his plan of allowing 3rd and long conversions to any competent OC in the playoffs.

 

all you have to do is look at the spreads of the games.  the bills were either very slight under dogs to multiple time champion teams or favorites in every single freaking game since 2022.  vegas does not assign spreads because they think the less talented team is just so greatly coached, they asses the performance and matchups of the players who actually paly the games.   the bills were always in the top 3 of superbowl odds every freaking year.  is that because of mcd's "leadership"?  no, it's because we have josh freaking allen and some blockers and backs and tes and a couple players on D. 

 

up with Beane, over and out with McD