Sad as it may seem, this is three years too late

[GG]

The move was years in the making, is three years too late, but the firing optics are so bad that they’re leading to distortions of epic proportions to rehabilitate an average coach.

 

For the youngsters in this crowd, the TLDR version of this post is: Sean McDermott is Dick Jauron, but who was fortunate that he lucked out on coaching Josh Allen instead of Trent Edwards, and during a time when the rest of AFC East was in the gutter.

 

Sometimes, recency bias clouds what should have been a fairly straightforward decision, albeit three years too late.  It’s usually good practice to wait 24 hours to process the situation and come to a conclusion after more facts are known.  In this case, what would have been the reaction if McDermott was fired if Bills lost to Jax, or if he had been fired after yet another loss vs KC last year?   My guess is there would be much less consternation than now.   Which hints that people are more upset in the way he was fired than the rationale for the firing.  All of that is discussed in other threads and WGR calls.

 

But, if you take the clumsy firing and emotion out of it, the move had to be made for the team.

 

At the end of the day, McDermott is a fantastic person and a great leader of men, but is at best an average NFL coach.   I challenge anyone to prove that he’s a better coach than Dick Jauron, or at least argue that it was McDermott’s coaching mastery that guided 11-12 win seasons with Allen and Diggs, versus Jauron’s mediocrity with Losman and Trentative consistently winning 7 games in a division with peak Brady.   I’ll wait.

 

To be fair, there is a lot to commend the admiral job McDermott did to wash the stench that his predecessors left at One Bills Drive.  He brought discipline and accountability to the roster.  His team culture-building cannot be ignored in how the team rallied and battled through tough times.   His resilience and guidance after Damar’s near-death should be in every leadership textbook for decades.  His style and personality just meshed with Western New York, who adopted him as if he were their own. Nobody can and should take that away from him.

 

However, that’s not what he is here for.  He was here to bring a championship to the beleaguered city and franchise.  And on that front, he failed miserably. 

 

The real time to part ways was after 13 seconds.  That call was all on him.  It was his decision to kick deep and not squib.  It is his defense that has failed to make the critical stop in each excruciating playoff loss.   It’s not as simple as to point out his teams’ 0’fer in overtimes, it’s to ask why those games ended up in overtime in the first place.

 

In simplest terms, to win in football you need to have a stellar scheme and have players to execute the scheme to win consistently and bring home a championship. To me, if you have to sacrifice one of the two, I will always take the scheme, because it’s nearly impossible to always have the ideal players.  That’s why Wade Phillips was a defensive genius, because he adjusted the defense to the players he had.

 

Not so much with McDermott, whose scheme always needed a Chris Jones, or a healthy Star-type pivot in the front from which all other positions flow.   If you do not have an otherworldly DT who commands all the attention, the scheme falls apart and the defense gives up plays at most critical points.  So when you can’t field all stars in those positions, you call out the GM for the lack of talent in the positions.

 

By all means, it’s not a defense that sucks.  Quite the opposite, the complexity of the defense is great against dumb quarterbacks who will always make a mistake and turn it over.  That strategy is great to get you 9-10 easy wins, but tends to fail in the playoffs where you don’t see a lot of dumb quarterbacks.

 

McDermott’s defenses feast on turnovers, but has been dreadful when it needed a simple stop after 3-4 downs.  That’s been a consistent flavor in each playoff outing.  Even in the wins, how many were with a defensive stop vs a turnover?  How many times did the Bills beat the spread in a playoff game?   Only two wins in McDermott’s career were not nailbiters.  The team almost lost at home to friggin Skylar Thompson.  Is that championship caliber?

 

The biggest issue has been the defensive line, and we’ve all seen the sad statistic of the last sack by a DE in a playoff loss.  Sure, having All-Pros on the DL will add to the sacks, but scheme matters.  How many DL coaches has McDermott cycled through, with equally horrible results?  Maybe it’s not the players and coaches, but the scheme?   Why have free agent DL statistics nose dive when they hit Orchard Park?  Look up Poona Ford’s stats in his career vs one sorry year in a Bills uniform.  Are you telling me that a guy who’s a key player on a Superbowl contender couldn’t get a game day jersey in McDermott’s scheme?  Why do we need explanations that Greg Rousseau’s role is to contain rushing edge rather than rush the passer?  Which is more important?

 

McDermott’s defense never passed the eye test and has never been as dominant as the statistics showed.  He has a far greater grasp of secondary play than he does of the other positions that are also important.  That’s why it doesn’t matter who rotates in the front seven, but if there’s a hiccup among the back four – look out.

 

Compare that with what Kromer did with the OL that’s acknowledged as “elite.”    The elite stature may be a stretch, but they are very good, despite fielding two virtual castoffs from other teams.   Did the line collapse against a stout Steelers’ defense when two backups started?  Imagine the excuses we’d hear if the DL lost two stars for a game?

 

The other question to ask is why have the Bills never had the number one seed in the AFC during this playoff run?   We know why.  It’s always due to the inexplicable losses each October.  Yet, those are always washed away by the surging December wins.  The late season games’ record is undoubtedly a vindication of McDermott’s influence on the team to rise up to adversity.   And that’s wonderful if the October games didn’t count in the standings.  But they do, and you cannot wish away dumb losses to bad Atlanta, Miami, Denver, etc teams to lose the top spot.  Winning teams manage to get over the hump.

 

Maybe it’s just me nitpicking on the defense.  But that weakness is obvious to all inside and outside the team, and that’s why we need Superman Allen to come to the rescue. 

 

Think about it for a second.  Do you think there’s a little voice in Josh’s head that says, “Hey kid, you have to get a touchdown on this drive because you know the other team will just drive down the field and score.”  How many times has a good team NOT drive down the field and scored unless their stupid QB did not throw a pick?  Not too often.

 

Having that little voice in the back of your head matters.

 

So that’s that.  I love Sean McDermott as a man and as a coach and what he did for the franchise.  I also was a big Dick Jauron supporter because he was an awesome human being.   I just didn’t think he was the guy to bring a championship to the city.

[Man with No Name]

maybe

[Buffalo716]

We went to the playoffs with tyrod Taylor throwing 17 passing touchdowns lol

 

Rex couldn't get that team to the playoffs but he took the Jets to the AFC championship game twice lol

 

Moving on long-term could be the right call if they hit.. but to call McDermott dick J is hyperbole of the greatest extent lol

 

You think Josh Allen would have developed in New York? Zero chance 

 

But he did develop under McDermott's leadership and that also is never taken into account

Edited January 21 by Buffalo716

[gonzo1105]

I actually agree with you but they should have done it last year to get Ben Johnson 

[JPL7]

I wanted it two years ago to get Payton. I wanted it last year to get Vrabel. And Johnson would have been a nice consolation prize. It is late, but better late than never. 

[Mike in Horseheads]

The crazy thing about this last week is before Monday this place was pry 80-20 to fire McD. Now its like 20-80 we should have kept him , we even had a will he maybe come back thread. I mean WTF...

Edited January 21 by Mike in Horseheads

[harryS]

5 minutes ago, gonzo1105 said:

I actually agree with you but they should have done it last year to get Ben Johnson 

 

Agreed.  While I think a great head coach will interview with the Bills this cycle (and we will see if the Bills can recognize him and hire him), Ben Johnson may have been the GOAT coaching prospect.  He was like what Andrew Luck was as a prospect coming out of college, except for head coaching.

[NeverOutNick]

Would be awesome to have Jim Harbaugh right now 

[streetkings01]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

We went to the playoffs with tyrod Taylor throwing 17 passing touchdowns lol

 

Rex couldn't get that team to the playoffs but he took the Jets to the AFC championship game twice lol

 

Moving on long-term could be the right call if they hit.. but to call McDermott dick J is hyperbole of the greatest extent lol

 

You think Josh Allen would have developed in New York? Zero chance 

 

But he did develop under McDermott's leadership and that also is never taken into account

We went 9-7 and needed a miracle play by the Bengals……let’s not act like 2017 was some magical season to end the streak. 2019 was the season the set it off for us.

[Gugny]

9 minutes ago, GG said:

The move was years in the making, is three years too late, but the firing optics are so bad that they’re leading to distortions of epic proportions to rehabilitate an average coach.

 

For the youngsters in this crowd, the TLDR version of this post is: Sean McDermott is Dick Jauron, but who was fortunate that he lucked out on coaching Josh Allen instead of Trent Edwards, and during a time when the rest of AFC East was in the gutter.

 

Sometimes, recency bias clouds what should have been a fairly straightforward decision, albeit three years too late.  It’s usually good practice to wait 24 hours to process the situation and come to a conclusion after more facts are known.  In this case, what would have been the reaction if McDermott was fired if Bills lost to Jax, or if he had been fired after yet another loss vs KC last year?   My guess is there would be much less consternation than now.   Which hints that people are more upset in the way he was fired than the rationale for the firing.  All of that is discussed in other threads and WGR calls.

 

But, if you take the clumsy firing and emotion out of it, the move had to be made for the team.

 

At the end of the day, McDermott is a fantastic person and a great leader of men, but is at best an average NFL coach.   I challenge anyone to prove that he’s a better coach than Dick Jauron, or at least argue that it was McDermott’s coaching mastery that guided 11-12 win seasons with Allen and Diggs, versus Jauron’s mediocrity with Losman and Trentative consistently winning 7 games in a division with peak Brady.   I’ll wait.

 

To be fair, there is a lot to commend the admiral job McDermott did to wash the stench that his predecessors left at One Bills Drive.  He brought discipline and accountability to the roster.  His team culture-building cannot be ignored in how the team rallied and battled through tough times.   His resilience and guidance after Damar’s near-death should be in every leadership textbook for decades.  His style and personality just meshed with Western New York, who adopted him as if he were their own. Nobody can and should take that away from him.

 

However, that’s not what he is here for.  He was here to bring a championship to the beleaguered city and franchise.  And on that front, he failed miserably. 

 

The real time to part ways was after 13 seconds.  That call was all on him.  It was his decision to kick deep and not squib.  It is his defense that has failed to make the critical stop in each excruciating playoff loss.   It’s not as simple as to point out his teams’ 0’fer in overtimes, it’s to ask why those games ended up in overtime in the first place.

 

In simplest terms, to win in football you need to have a stellar scheme and have players to execute the scheme to win consistently and bring home a championship. To me, if you have to sacrifice one of the two, I will always take the scheme, because it’s nearly impossible to always have the ideal players.  That’s why Wade Phillips was a defensive genius, because he adjusted the defense to the players he had.

 

Not so much with McDermott, whose scheme always needed a Chris Jones, or a healthy Star-type pivot in the front from which all other positions flow.   If you do not have an otherworldly DT who commands all the attention, the scheme falls apart and the defense gives up plays at most critical points.  So when you can’t field all stars in those positions, you call out the GM for the lack of talent in the positions.

 

By all means, it’s not a defense that sucks.  Quite the opposite, the complexity of the defense is great against dumb quarterbacks who will always make a mistake and turn it over.  That strategy is great to get you 9-10 easy wins, but tends to fail in the playoffs where you don’t see a lot of dumb quarterbacks.

 

McDermott’s defenses feast on turnovers, but has been dreadful when it needed a simple stop after 3-4 downs.  That’s been a consistent flavor in each playoff outing.  Even in the wins, how many were with a defensive stop vs a turnover?  How many times did the Bills beat the spread in a playoff game?   Only two wins in McDermott’s career were not nailbiters.  The team almost lost at home to friggin Skylar Thompson.  Is that championship caliber?

 

The biggest issue has been the defensive line, and we’ve all seen the sad statistic of the last sack by a DE in a playoff loss.  Sure, having All-Pros on the DL will add to the sacks, but scheme matters.  How many DL coaches has McDermott cycled through, with equally horrible results?  Maybe it’s not the players and coaches, but the scheme?   Why have free agent DL statistics nose dive when they hit Orchard Park?  Look up Poona Ford’s stats in his career vs one sorry year in a Bills uniform.  Are you telling me that a guy who’s a key player on a Superbowl contender couldn’t get a game day jersey in McDermott’s scheme?  Why do we need explanations that Greg Rousseau’s role is to contain rushing edge rather than rush the passer?  Which is more important?

 

McDermott’s defense never passed the eye test and has never been as dominant as the statistics showed.  He has a far greater grasp of secondary play than he does of the other positions that are also important.  That’s why it doesn’t matter who rotates in the front seven, but if there’s a hiccup among the back four – look out.

 

Compare that with what Kromer did with the OL that’s acknowledged as “elite.”    The elite stature may be a stretch, but they are very good, despite fielding two virtual castoffs from other teams.   Did the line collapse against a stout Steelers’ defense when two backups started?  Imagine the excuses we’d hear if the DL lost two stars for a game?

 

The other question to ask is why have the Bills never had the number one seed in the AFC during this playoff run?   We know why.  It’s always due to the inexplicable losses each October.  Yet, those are always washed away by the surging December wins.  The late season games’ record is undoubtedly a vindication of McDermott’s influence on the team to rise up to adversity.   And that’s wonderful if the October games didn’t count in the standings.  But they do, and you cannot wish away dumb losses to bad Atlanta, Miami, Denver, etc teams to lose the top spot.  Winning teams manage to get over the hump.

 

Maybe it’s just me nitpicking on the defense.  But that weakness is obvious to all inside and outside the team, and that’s why we need Superman Allen to come to the rescue. 

 

Think about it for a second.  Do you think there’s a little voice in Josh’s head that says, “Hey kid, you have to get a touchdown on this drive because you know the other team will just drive down the field and score.”  How many times has a good team NOT drive down the field and scored unless their stupid QB did not throw a pick?  Not too often.

 

Having that little voice in the back of your head matters.

 

So that’s that.  I love Sean McDermott as a man and as a coach and what he did for the franchise.  I also was a big Dick Jauron supporter because he was an awesome human being.   I just didn’t think he was the guy to bring a championship to the city.

Three???

 

13 Seconds should have been the end of this shitshow. 
 

 

Edited January 21 by Gugny

[Buffalo716]

Just now, streetkings01 said:

We went 9-7 and needed a miracle play by the Bengals……let’s not act like 2017 was some magical season to end the streak. 2019 was the season the set it off for us.

You act like we were six and 10? 

 

9 and 7 with that roster.. with a quarterback who couldn't put the ball in the end zone is pretty damn good.. don't care if he needed Jesus Christ to complete a hail Mary 

 

He literally did what nobody said he could do... Even last year everybody said this is a rebuilding year.. he had us in the AFC championship 

 

The bills are not in the top five for all pros the last 8 years.. he's not taking a top three roster and underperforming 

 

He's taking the 8th best roster and has them competing every single year 

 

Harbaugh with the Ravens the last 8 years has the most all pros in the NFL.. and the worst record than the bills in the regular season and postseason 

 

That's underperforming

 

 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

1 minute ago, Mike in Horseheads said:

The crazy thing about this last week is before Monday this place was pry 80-20 to fire McD. Now its like 20-80 we should have kept him , we even had a will he maybe come back that. I mean WTF...

I do think some people say things just to vent and don’t actually mean them or think about what it would look like if the thing comes true and some people will accuse the team of doing the wrong thing no matter what it is 😂. Not sure those things explain THAT big of a difference though lol it is pretty interesting 

[Behindenemylines]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

We went to the playoffs with tyrod Taylor throwing 17 passing touchdowns lol

 

Rex couldn't get that team to the playoffs but he took the Jets to the AFC championship game twice lol

 

Moving on long-term could be the right call if they hit.. but to call McDermott dick J is hyperbole of the greatest extent lol

 

You think Josh Allen would have developed in New York? Zero chance 

 

But he did develop under McDermott's leadership and that also is never taken into account

I would counter that it was much less mcD than Daboll. Josh and Daboll had a connection that McD would never have because Daboll was probably the real first person to push him to greatness.  McD was one step removed and could never replace that. 

Not saying bringing in Daboll is the answer-because that moment has sailed but it’s the reality. 
 

McD was a good coach-and great at building a culture that I pray is the building blocks for the next stage.  And That’s OK.  He did his job and he was great at doing that.  Just not the guy In Buffalo to get us there.  
 

Rejoice Buffalo fans it’s an opportunity to make a move to get us home.  We have the Best Player in the whole game as our QB.   We have the best fans bar none.
 

dare I say we have ownership that wants a win for personal and professional reasons. 
 

it’s a new day. A new dawn. Embrace because repeating the last three years would be madness. 

 

Go Bills and I’m behind us no matter what that looks like.  I hope…and I know we are all behind us because Damn there ain’t no team like the Bills!! 

[SoonerBillsFan]

13 minutes ago, GG said:

The move was years in the making, is three years too late, but the firing optics are so bad that they’re leading to distortions of epic proportions to rehabilitate an average coach.

 

For the youngsters in this crowd, the TLDR version of this post is: Sean McDermott is Dick Jauron, but who was fortunate that he lucked out on coaching Josh Allen instead of Trent Edwards, and during a time when the rest of AFC East was in the gutter.

 

Sometimes, recency bias clouds what should have been a fairly straightforward decision, albeit three years too late.  It’s usually good practice to wait 24 hours to process the situation and come to a conclusion after more facts are known.  In this case, what would have been the reaction if McDermott was fired if Bills lost to Jax, or if he had been fired after yet another loss vs KC last year?   My guess is there would be much less consternation than now.   Which hints that people are more upset in the way he was fired than the rationale for the firing.  All of that is discussed in other threads and WGR calls.

 

But, if you take the clumsy firing and emotion out of it, the move had to be made for the team.

 

At the end of the day, McDermott is a fantastic person and a great leader of men, but is at best an average NFL coach.   I challenge anyone to prove that he’s a better coach than Dick Jauron, or at least argue that it was McDermott’s coaching mastery that guided 11-12 win seasons with Allen and Diggs, versus Jauron’s mediocrity with Losman and Trentative consistently winning 7 games in a division with peak Brady.   I’ll wait.

 

To be fair, there is a lot to commend the admiral job McDermott did to wash the stench that his predecessors left at One Bills Drive.  He brought discipline and accountability to the roster.  His team culture-building cannot be ignored in how the team rallied and battled through tough times.   His resilience and guidance after Damar’s near-death should be in every leadership textbook for decades.  His style and personality just meshed with Western New York, who adopted him as if he were their own. Nobody can and should take that away from him.

 

However, that’s not what he is here for.  He was here to bring a championship to the beleaguered city and franchise.  And on that front, he failed miserably. 

 

The real time to part ways was after 13 seconds.  That call was all on him.  It was his decision to kick deep and not squib.  It is his defense that has failed to make the critical stop in each excruciating playoff loss.   It’s not as simple as to point out his teams’ 0’fer in overtimes, it’s to ask why those games ended up in overtime in the first place.

 

In simplest terms, to win in football you need to have a stellar scheme and have players to execute the scheme to win consistently and bring home a championship. To me, if you have to sacrifice one of the two, I will always take the scheme, because it’s nearly impossible to always have the ideal players.  That’s why Wade Phillips was a defensive genius, because he adjusted the defense to the players he had.

 

Not so much with McDermott, whose scheme always needed a Chris Jones, or a healthy Star-type pivot in the front from which all other positions flow.   If you do not have an otherworldly DT who commands all the attention, the scheme falls apart and the defense gives up plays at most critical points.  So when you can’t field all stars in those positions, you call out the GM for the lack of talent in the positions.

 

By all means, it’s not a defense that sucks.  Quite the opposite, the complexity of the defense is great against dumb quarterbacks who will always make a mistake and turn it over.  That strategy is great to get you 9-10 easy wins, but tends to fail in the playoffs where you don’t see a lot of dumb quarterbacks.

 

McDermott’s defenses feast on turnovers, but has been dreadful when it needed a simple stop after 3-4 downs.  That’s been a consistent flavor in each playoff outing.  Even in the wins, how many were with a defensive stop vs a turnover?  How many times did the Bills beat the spread in a playoff game?   Only two wins in McDermott’s career were not nailbiters.  The team almost lost at home to friggin Skylar Thompson.  Is that championship caliber?

 

The biggest issue has been the defensive line, and we’ve all seen the sad statistic of the last sack by a DE in a playoff loss.  Sure, having All-Pros on the DL will add to the sacks, but scheme matters.  How many DL coaches has McDermott cycled through, with equally horrible results?  Maybe it’s not the players and coaches, but the scheme?   Why have free agent DL statistics nose dive when they hit Orchard Park?  Look up Poona Ford’s stats in his career vs one sorry year in a Bills uniform.  Are you telling me that a guy who’s a key player on a Superbowl contender couldn’t get a game day jersey in McDermott’s scheme?  Why do we need explanations that Greg Rousseau’s role is to contain rushing edge rather than rush the passer?  Which is more important?

 

McDermott’s defense never passed the eye test and has never been as dominant as the statistics showed.  He has a far greater grasp of secondary play than he does of the other positions that are also important.  That’s why it doesn’t matter who rotates in the front seven, but if there’s a hiccup among the back four – look out.

 

Compare that with what Kromer did with the OL that’s acknowledged as “elite.”    The elite stature may be a stretch, but they are very good, despite fielding two virtual castoffs from other teams.   Did the line collapse against a stout Steelers’ defense when two backups started?  Imagine the excuses we’d hear if the DL lost two stars for a game?

 

The other question to ask is why have the Bills never had the number one seed in the AFC during this playoff run?   We know why.  It’s always due to the inexplicable losses each October.  Yet, those are always washed away by the surging December wins.  The late season games’ record is undoubtedly a vindication of McDermott’s influence on the team to rise up to adversity.   And that’s wonderful if the October games didn’t count in the standings.  But they do, and you cannot wish away dumb losses to bad Atlanta, Miami, Denver, etc teams to lose the top spot.  Winning teams manage to get over the hump.

 

Maybe it’s just me nitpicking on the defense.  But that weakness is obvious to all inside and outside the team, and that’s why we need Superman Allen to come to the rescue. 

 

Think about it for a second.  Do you think there’s a little voice in Josh’s head that says, “Hey kid, you have to get a touchdown on this drive because you know the other team will just drive down the field and score.”  How many times has a good team NOT drive down the field and scored unless their stupid QB did not throw a pick?  Not too often.

 

Having that little voice in the back of your head matters.

 

So that’s that.  I love Sean McDermott as a man and as a coach and what he did for the franchise.  I also was a big Dick Jauron supporter because he was an awesome human being.   I just didn’t think he was the guy to bring a championship to the city.

Wow, that was a lot.

 

If I owned the Bills, he would have been fired the day after 13 seconds

[Einstein]

11 minutes ago, gonzo1105 said:

I actually agree with you but they should have done it last year to get Ben Johnson 

This has been bugging me. 

Why would Terry not do this LAST year, when Ben Johnson was available? Or the previous year when Harbaugh was available?

He does it now ... to get Klint Kubiak!?

[Jkgobills]

Should have been fired after 13 seconds.  Great human, not a good enough coach of the side of the ball that is his expertise.

[Bob in STL]

Spent all that time typing just to put down a person you say you “love”, all the while comparing him to Dick Jauron. 

[buffblue]

14 minutes ago, Mike in Horseheads said:

The crazy thing about this last week is before Monday this place was pry 80-20 to fire McD. Now its like 20-80 we should have kept him , we even had a will he maybe come back that. I mean WTF...

People are understandably reacting to the injustice of his ouster and Beane's promotion. I believe there were separate polls on both after the loss and the percentage of folks who wanted Beane fired was significantly higher (80 plus percent) than McDermott (closer to 50/50). There is no scenario where he should've been the only one let go

Edited January 21 by buffblue

[gonzo1105]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

This has been bugging me. 

Why would Terry not do this LAST year, when Ben Johnson was available? Or the previous year when Harbaugh was available?

He does it now ... to get Klint Kubiak!?

I think people underestimate Kubiak. If he’s anything like his father he’s going to be a hell of a HC. Dad won 3 championships as an asst and 1 as a HC. Also took the Texans to their first two division titles one with TJ Yates at QB. Klint already has a Super Bowl ring and might have another by the end of the year. Every place he’s gone his QB has played well above expectations. He has the same demeanor as Kyle Shanahan and his father to be honest. I would be super excited about us hiring him. He is by far my # 1 candidate this cycle 

[Einstein]

Just now, gonzo1105 said:

I think people underestimate Kubiak. If he’s anything like his father he’s going to be a hell of a HC. Dad won 3 championships as an asst and 1 as a HC. Also took the Texans to their first two division titles one with TJ Yates at QB. Klint already has a Super Bowl ring and might have another by the end of the year. Every place he’s gone his QB has played well above expectations. He has the same demeanor as Kyle Shanahan and his father to be honest. I would be super excited about us hiring him. He is by far my # 1 candidate this cycle