leonbus23 Posted January 17 Posted January 17 (edited) Thought I'd share some penalty information from the NFL penalties website. My overall impression is that the Bills had a tough go of it with penalties this season. I decided to compare them to the Patriots*** because the Bills had almost the same number of total plays as them this season. First, the Bills received the least number of "beneficiary" calls (calls against their opponents) this season in the entire NFL. They only had 85. The Pats*** had 112. The Bills had six more penalties called against them than the Pats***. Bills at 108 and the Pats*** at 102. The Bills were the third best in the league for pre-snap penalties at only 31. The Patriots had 33. It is a bit too time consuming to find the data about how many of the beneficiary calls were pre-snap penalties by the Bills or Pats*** opponents, so it is excluded. Anyway, I chose pre-snap penalties because those calls are generally the most objective, such as with false starts, encroachment, and neutral zone infractions (that stop the play) compared to more subjective things like holding, pass interference, illegal contact, etc. But by these numbers, if we take away pre-snap penalties the Bills committed and subtract that from their total number of penalties, we get 77. The Pats*** get 69. This is not a huge difference until the beneficiary numbers are added. If we take the number of penalties the Bills benefitted from and subtract the number of penalties the Bills committed we get 8. The Pats*** get 43. In essence, the Pats*** benefitted from 35 more penalty calls then penalties they committed this season while the Bills only benefitted from 8, when pre-snap penalties are excluded. It is hard to say that the Bills were a less disciplined team then the Pats*** or anyone else, since they were the third best in the league at not committing pre-snap penalties. I am not sure if there is a correlation between not committing pre-snap penalties and not committing other types of penalties, but not committing pre-snap penalties seems to point to a disciplined team, in general. In addition, the Bills were the lowest in the league at receiving beneficiary penalties. Seems like the Bills opponents frequently committed less penalties than in their games against other teams. Incidentally, we were called for 15 penalties in the first Pats*** game with one false start for a total of 14 non-presnap penalties. While the Pats*** were called for 10 penalties with two false starts and a neutral zone for a total of 7 non-presnap penalties. The Broncos were called for a 124 total penalties with 40 pre-snap and were beneficiaries of 118 penalties. The Bill were beneficiaries of only 85 penalties. Anyway, the information is a bit superficial, so take for what it is. And, no, I am not trying to invoke a conspiracy. Just reporting this data. One last thing, the team that really benefitted from how officials called games was the Rams. Aside from the Bills, a team that really did not benefit from how officials called games were the Eagles. Edited January 17 by leonbus23 4 Quote
LEBills Posted January 17 Posted January 17 15 minutes ago, leonbus23 said: Thought I'd share some penalty information from the NFL penalties website. My overall impression is that the Bills had a tough go of it with penalties this season. I decided to compare them to the Patriots*** because the Bills had almost the same number of total plays as them this season. First, the Bills received the least number of "beneficiary" calls (calls against their opponents) this season in the entire NFL. They only had 85. The Pats*** had 112. The Bills had six more penalties called against them than the Pats***. Bills at 108 and the Pats*** at 102. The Bills were the third best in the league for pre-snap penalties at only 31. The Patriots had 33. It is a bit too time consuming to find the data about how many of the beneficiary calls were pre-snap penalties by the Bills or Pats*** opponents, so it is excluded. Anyway, I chose pre-snap penalties because those calls are generally the most objective, such as with false starts, encroachment, and neutral zone infractions (that stop the play) compared to more subjective things like holding, pass interference, illegal contact, etc. But by these numbers, if we take away pre-snap penalties the Bills committed and subtract that from their total number of penalties, we get 77. The Pats*** get 69. This is not a huge difference until the beneficiary numbers are added. If we take the number of penalties the Bills benefitted from and subtract the number of penalties the Bills committed we get 8. The Pats*** get 43. In essence, the Pats*** benefitted from 35 more penalty calls then penalties they committed this season while the Bills only benefitted from 8, when pre-snap penalties are excluded. It is hard to say that the Bills were a less disciplined team then the Pats*** or anyone else, since they were the third best in the league at not committing pre-snap penalties. I am not sure if there is a correlation between not committing pre-snap penalties and not committing other types of penalties, but not committing pre-snap penalties seems to point to a disciplined team, in general. In addition, the Bills were the lowest in the league at receiving beneficiary penalties. Seems like the Bills opponents frequently committed less penalties than in their games against other teams. Incidentally, we were called for 15 penalties in the first Pats*** game with one false start for a total of 14 non-presnap penalties. While the Pats*** were called for 10 penalties with two false starts and a neutral zone for a total of 7 non-presnap penalties. The Broncos were called for a 124 total penalties with 40 pre-snap and were beneficiaries of 118 penalties. The Bill were beneficiaries of only 85 penalties. Anyway, the information is a bit superficial, so take for what it is. And, no, I am not trying to invoke a conspiracy. Just reporting this data. One last thing, the team that really benefitted from how officials called games was the Rams. Aside from the Bills, a team that really did not benefit from how officials called games were the Eagles. This is just my narrative but I think our team is built to not get too may beneficiary calls. 1. we are a run heavy team - the most likely penalty on a running play is offensive holding which we had 26 of this season. 2. plays like defensive pass interference or holding happen on pass plays, which again we are one of the run heaviest teams. And our wide receiver position is not very talented which may make it easier for defensive backs to play them without penalty 3. finally, our defensive line - at best - can be described as banged up this year. So the holding on other teams may just not be as frequent. That is my guess at least. 1 Quote
Jared Posted January 17 Posted January 17 Most of the time ref complaints are wildly overblown because people remember one or two controversial calls in big games. 1 Quote
Big Turk Posted January 17 Posted January 17 It's more important WHEN the penalties occurred versus that they occurred, IMO. 2 Quote
atlbillsfan1975 Posted January 17 Posted January 17 5 minutes ago, Big Turk said: It's more important WHEN the penalties occurred versus that they occurred, IMO. Agree. During the drought it seemed we always got a questionable call at a critical point in the game. Quote
Big Turk Posted January 17 Posted January 17 5 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: Agree. During the drought it seemed we always got a questionable call at a critical point in the game. You mean like the one Jags game where the Bills player never even touched him on a 4th down that would have ended the game essentially but they gifted them a phantom DPI call and they ended up winning the game? 28 minutes ago, LEBills said: This is just my narrative but I think our team is built to not get too may beneficiary calls. 1. we are a run heavy team - the most likely penalty on a running play is offensive holding which we had 26 of this season. 2. plays like defensive pass interference or holding happen on pass plays, which again we are one of the run heaviest teams. And our wide receiver position is not very talented which may make it easier for defensive backs to play them without penalty 3. finally, our defensive line - at best - can be described as banged up this year. So the holding on other teams may just not be as frequent. That is my guess at least. I don't buy the argument on the DLine not getting held and having no penalties called against the offensive lineman. For a long portion of the season the Bills were among the fastest pressure teams in the NFL but also the ones that drew the least holding calls against. That makes no sense and is nearly impossible. So apparently when your players get beaten quickly, they are LESS likely to take penalties? Quote
SoonerBillsFan Posted January 17 Posted January 17 If we go to NE for the AFCCG we will have to fight them, the refs and most likely the NFL. For some reason, Goodell and the NFL love Kraft and the pats Quote
HardyBoy Posted January 17 Posted January 17 7 minutes ago, Big Turk said: You mean like the one Jags game where the Bills player never even touched him on a 4th down that would have ended the game essentially but they gifted them a phantom DPI call and they ended up winning the game? I don't buy the argument on the DLine not getting held and having no penalties called against the offensive lineman. For a long portion of the season the Bills were among the fastest pressure teams in the NFL but also the ones that drew the least holding calls against. That makes no sense and is nearly impossible. So apparently when your players get beaten quickly, they are LESS likely to take penalties? It's called a recovery grab Quote
Success Posted January 17 Posted January 17 11 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said: If we go to NE for the AFCCG we will have to fight them, the refs and most likely the NFL. For some reason, Goodell and the NFL love Kraft and the pats It's funny - Pats fans are saying the same about us, at least online. They can't get over some of those calls from the last game w/ them. It was like the most egregious officiating they'd ever seen. Such an entitled group - every call in that game was legit. A few were ticky tacky, but if they want to see truly bad calls, I can put together a compilation from when they were on top & Brady got PF calls for players breathing in his vicinity. 1 Quote
SoonerBillsFan Posted January 17 Posted January 17 16 minutes ago, Success said: It's funny - Pats fans are saying the same about us, at least online. They can't get over some of those calls from the last game w/ them. It was like the most egregious officiating they'd ever seen. Such an entitled group - every call in that game was legit. A few were ticky tacky, but if they want to see truly bad calls, I can put together a compilation from when they were on top & Brady got PF calls for players breathing in his vicinity. They got used to getting everything handed to them for 15 years. Now when it evens out, or even goes in our favor which its past time!, then they can't take it. Watching their HC whine like a little ***** is awesome 1 1 Quote
Turf Toejam 34 Posted January 17 Posted January 17 1 hour ago, SoonerBillsFan said: They got used to getting everything handed to them for 15 years. Now when it evens out, or even goes in our favor which its past time!, then they can't take it. Watching their HC whine like a little ***** is awesome Vrabel spends more time working the refs than any other coach that I've seen. Non stop..... 1 Quote
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