Why are so many fired retread head coaches the belles of the off season coaching ball this year?

[Mister Defense]

I don't get the unique focus, fascination and hyberbolic hype this year by both the NFL owners and the national media on the previously (and often recently) fired head coaches as potential head coaches, and saviors, of NFL teams:

 

King Harbaugh, whose extremely talented teams dramatically underperformed for years-- and blew more late leads in the last 3 seasons than any team in the league.

 

Mike McCarthy, whose teams in Dallas could not win a big game if their lives depended on it, underperforming in those games ALL of the time

 

MikeTomlin, who those in the know say would be 2nd only to Harbaugh if he were to decide to coach again.  A man whose teams do not even compete in the playoffs anymore, got blown out as if they were in a different league---no chance. (Yes, not fired technically, but I think that was just to allow him to save face. That fan base would have been incensed if he was back next year.)

 

Robert Salah, the head coach of the lost and confused hapless Jets, who looked as lost and confused as his team, and so fired in the middle of last season

 

Kevin Stefanski, who led one of the worst teams in the NFL this year and previously

 

Kliff Kingsbury!,

 

(And Mike McDaniel, a good offensive coordinator, who at least has some upside as a head coach still—as his team actually played hard for him late in the season.  I think he becomes a great OC, does that for a year or two, and then becomes a solid head coach. So, I don’t want to group him with the others here.)

 

Maybe I am wrong but I don’t believe in past years that fired NFL coaches with clearly problematic later resumes, coaches of teams that have underperformed, have been painted in such glowing terms and were leading the way for NFL teams in need of a head coach.  Rather, it seems in the past top coordinators and college coaches were the focus, and rightfully so.

 

Look at some of this year’s playoff and up and coming teams: Jacksonville, Houston. Chicago, Seattle, all considered some of the most dynamic, well coached teams in the league now.  (And an on the rise team like New Orleans as well.) No retread, fired head coaches to be  found there,and all former NFL coordinators I think.  But yes, Vrabel, is one fired ex head coach who did well.

 

How discouraging it would have been if the Bills had lost this past week, and McDermott was fired, only to see the Bills going backwards, bringing in a Tomlin! Harbaugh, Salah—McCarthy!! That would have been devastating.

 

(And furthermore, when I read and watch NFL analysis this week the focus should clearly be almost exclusively on the Bills, with a bit thrown in on the other playoff teams. Instead, each day another one of these teams and the fired, re-tread coaches are their focus, day after day. Taking all of the Bills' rightfully earned air time.)

 

 

 

Edited January 16 by Mister Defense

[TheFunPolice]

Saleh is under rated. His Jets defenses were always pretty good. 

 

The Jets jumped the gun firing him midseason IMO. 

[ddaryl]

retread

belles

[Virgil]

If you are looking at this from the perspective of a Bills fan, I would agree with you.  But you have to factor in that many teams don't even know how to win and have zero culture.  To them, just making the playoffs would be a HUGE improvement.  If we were still in the drought years, I would be banging the drum to bring in Harbaugh.  

 

Harbaugh - Will create a culture and get you to the playoffs.  Could be a Reid situation where he needs a reset

 

McCarthy - Honestly, no idea.  I've never understood the hype.  But he should be able to get you a functional team that gets to the playoffs

 

Tomlin - Same as Harbaugh, but I don't see him coaching this year

 

Salah - Great coordinator who deserves a second chance.  Plus, has anyone been able to make the Jets look good in the last two decades?  I'd give him a pass for that stint, in which I'm sure he learned from.

 

Stefanski - The fact that he won coach of the year TWICE with the Browns is an amazing accomplishment.  Similar to Salah, he gets a bit of a pass because he worked for a horribly dysfunctional organization.  

 

Kingsbury - Showed sparks of potential greatness when he coached and can bring an offense to live.  If I'm the Titans, he's number one on my list and maybe the best they'll be able to get

 

McDaniels - If he gets a HC job, it'll mainly be because there are so many openings.  He had a great start in Miami and seemed to be turning it around this past season.  He did have good support from ownership, but I think the Tua and Hill drama eventually hurt him.  The cold weather stuff was bizarre.  Biggest issue with him is his personality in the media.  It's fun while you're winning, but gets old fast when you lose.  

 

Edited January 16 by Virgil

[Watkins101]

I think there are some fair criticisms here for some of these coaches, but I really have to disagree on Tomlin. The Steelers roster has been below average year over year, and yes they do get blown out in the playoffs just about every year, but I think without Tomlin they are more of a 6/7 win team.

[TheFunPolice]

If I were the Ravens I would see if a Flores/Daboll combo is possible. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

McDaniel or McDaniels?  Pay attention to the small details, the larger story will emerge.

[Man with No Name]

Harbaugh might not be HIM, but he's good enough to turn a stumbling franchise around. No brainer for a floundering franchise lacking directioin

 

Verdict is still out on Saleh. There is no chance to succeed with the Jets. But they were a lot more formiddable with him than they are now. He's not a SAFE pick. But he's worth a roll of the dice. 

 

Tomlin's a great leader. He just needs to pick better coordinators and let them coordinate. But I think he's done with it, so doesn't matter. Maybe he'll do some self reflection and get the itch again. 

 

Most of the other guys I think got a fair chance and have shown that they're more coordinator than HC. 

 

 

[4merper4mer]

20 minutes ago, Mister Defense said:

I don't get the unique focus, fascination and hyberbolic hype this year by both the NFL owners and the national media on the previously (and often recently) fired head coaches as potential head coaches, and saviors, of NFL teams:

 

King Harbaugh, whose extremely talented teams dramatically underperformed for years-- and blew more late leads in the last 3 seasons than any team in the league.

 

Kevin McCarthy, whose teams in Dallas could not win a big game if their lives depended on it, underperforming in those games ALL of the time

 

MikeTomlin, who those in the know say would be 2nd only to Harbaugh if he were to decide to coach again.  A man whose teams do not even compete in the playoffs anymore, got blown out as if they were in a different league---no chance. (Yes, not fired technically, but I think that was just to allow him to save face. That fan base would have been incensed if he was back next year.)

 

Robert Salah, the head coach of the lost and confused hapless Jets, who looked as lost and confused as his team, and so fired in the middle of last season

 

Kevin Stefanski, who led one of the worst teams in the NFL this year and previously

 

Kliff Kingsbury!,

 

(And Mike McDaniels, a good offensive coordinator, who at least has some upside as a head coach still—as his team actually played hard for him late in the season.  I think he becomes a great OC, does that for a year or two, and then becomes a solid head coach. So, I don’t want to group him with the others here.)

 

Maybe I am wrong but I don’t believe in past years that fired NFL coaches with clearly problematic later resumes, coaches of teams that have underperformed, have been painted in such glowing terms and were leading the way for NFL teams in need of a head coach.  Rather, it seems in the past top coordinators and college coaches were the focus, and rightfully so.

 

Look at some of this year’s playoff and up and coming teams: Jacksonville, Houston. Chicago, Seattle, all considered some of the most dynamic, well coached teams in the league now.  (And an on the rise team like New Orleans as well.) No retread, fired head coaches to be  found there,and all former NFL coordinators I think.  But yes, Vrabel, is one fired ex head coach who did well.

 

How discouraging it would have been if the Bills had lost this past week, and McDermott was fired, only to see the Bills going backwards, bringing in a Tomlin! Harbaugh, Salah—McCarthy!! That would have been devastating.

 

(And furthermore, when I read and watch NFL analysis this week the focus should clearly be almost exclusively on the Bills, with a bit thrown in on the other playoff teams. Instead, each day another one of these teams and the fired, re-tread coaches are their focus, day after day. Taking all of the Bills' rightfully earned air time.)

 

 

 

Wasn’t Kevin McCarthy the kid in Hime Alone?

[nuklz2594]

18 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

Saleh is under rated. His Jets defenses were always pretty good. 

 

The Jets jumped the gun firing him midseason IMO. 

wearing Palestine flag after terrorist attacks did not help either?

[Captain Hindsight]

10 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

Saleh is under rated. His Jets defenses were always pretty good. 

 

The Jets jumped the gun firing him midseason IMO. 

He sucked. When Rodgers got hurt, his crisis management was horrendous. They got a victory over a division rival in an emotional game, then got blown out a week later in Dallas. This was a time to build confidence in his young QB who had just been replaced then suddenly back in the lineup. He said something to the effect of "our QB play sucked today"

 

Wilson needed the backing of his HC, get the guys to rally around him and the HC gave a vote of no confidence. Horrible way to manage a horrible situation. That team was more than good enough to win with Zach Wilson and Salah undercut him at every opportunity. Even when Mike White emerged, he basically opened the door for White to take his job. Wilson had plenty of issues, but Salah gave a masterclass in how to undercut your handpicked franchise QB

 

I hope he goes to Miami so McDermott can make him look like a clown for 3 more years 

[TheFunPolice]

Don't forget when it comes to the Jets that the owner's college aged kid allegedly shows up here and there and starts directing people and influencing decisions. Since daddy owns the team everyone has to bite their tongue. That's what was reported, so I think someone leaked that info out there. 

 

I mean, what a disaster of an organization if true. Literally impossible to build anything in that type of setup. 

 

And Stefanski is "criticized" in the Browns organization for "undermining" Sanders, like Sanders is some great QB prospect? 

 

Both Stefanski and Saleh escaped and in Saleh's case he's done an amazing job (again) as a DC and proved he can coach. Stefanski can obviously coach offense and can also recognize when a player is just not that good, which nobody wanted to hear apparently. 

 

4 minutes ago, nuklz2594 said:

wearing Palestine flag after terrorist attacks did not help either?

 

I didn't see/hear that part. Every time politics mixes with football an angel loses its wings. 

 

I just keep hoping that Rex Ryan will reemerge. He has been in the mix the last couple of seasons, last few really. 

 

Denver DC (they went with Vance Joseph, their former HC. Rex claimed it was about $ and he was offered the job). 

Cowboys DC (they went with Mike Zimmer because of Zimmer's cowboy hat). 

Jets HC (LOL) 

rumors mid-season about Dolphins HC if McDaniel got fired (which he eventually did). 

 

Just for the pure entertainment value. 

Edited January 16 by TheFunPolice

[DrBob806]

This thread is real reactionary.

 

We lucked out into getting Josh. Without him, the Bills are lost just like the teams you ( & just about everybody else) rips on. 

[zow2]

Teams wants head coaching experience, and if there is some success in the coach's background that goes a long way.

 

If McD got fired would we want some newbie head coach learning on the job here?  Sometimes it's a home run like the Seattle guy.  But often times it blows up and there are many examples.  

[WeckMonster]

Because different teams have different needs at different times.

 

Same reason two people might make a terrible couple and then live happily ever after with others.

[Big Turk]

McDaniel to the Ravens MIGHT make some sense because I think his schemes could be far more effective with a player like Jackson running them than a player like Tua.

[Kirby Jackson]

I generally am in agreement with you @Mister Defense. It’s odd. I try to look at them each individually but as a rule it’s strange. So while I think Stefanski is a really good coach that had his hands tied, why are teams interviewing Mike McCarthy?!? 
 

My guess is that teams are scared to fail. It’s way safer to hire Mike McCarthy than it is to hire Jesse Minter (for example). That’s a loser mentality IMO. Believe in your process. Believe in your evaluation. A guy having a resume doesn’t mean he will be better than a guy that doesn’t. Teams are so scared to be wrong, they take the “safe” choice. “If we hire, Mike McCarthy we won’t be too bad.” What a loser mentality. I’d rather hire the wrong guy taking a chance than hire a guy that’s been there that can’t win (even if he doesn’t fail). To me 6-11 with Jesse Minter (or whomever) is a better ideas than 8-9 with Mike McCarthy.

[Walking Tall]

Most every head coach in the NFL eventually gets fired. Do they all suck because of that?

 

There are only so many Don Shula’s that go out on their own.

Edited January 16 by Walking Tall

[Mister Defense]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

I generally am in agreement with you @Mister Defense. It’s odd. I try to look at them each individually but as a rule it’s strange. So while I think Stefanski is a really good coach that had his hands tied, why are teams interviewing Mike McCarthy?!? 
 

My guess is that teams are scared to fail. It’s way safer to hire Mike McCarthy than it is to hire Jesse Minter (for example). That’s a loser mentality IMO. Believe in your process. Believe in your evaluation. A guy having a resume doesn’t mean he will be better than a guy that doesn’t. Teams are so scared to be wrong, they take the “safe” choice. “If we hire, Mike McCarthy we won’t be too bad.” What a loser mentality. I’d rather hire the wrong guy taking a chance than hire a guy that’s been there that can’t win (even if he doesn’t fail). To me 6-11 with Jesse Minter (or whomever) is a better ideas than 8-9 with Mike McCarthy.

 

Great take, analysis, support...

 

Playing it safe, they think, is better than striving for significant success, greatness.

 

Yes, a loser's mentality.

 

 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

I think a lot of faith is put in the whole ‘change of scenery’ angle and sometimes it works out…sometimes it doesn’t.  Hiring a retread seems like as much of a crapshoot as hiring a first time head coach as far as chances of them being fantastic go but teams are probably more comfortable about the floor being higher

the big time retreads Andy Reid and bill belichick were heavily influenced by upgrading at qb tremendously at their second  stop.  Another sneaky one you can throw in there is Pete Carroll.  Wade Phillips was pretty solid too.  I think there’s juuust enough pretty successful or better retreads historically for teams to give it a try 😂 

 

 

Edited January 16 by Generic_Bills_Fan