Why are we so late to adjust defensively?

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

So I don't necessarily have a problem with a talented offense putting points on the scoreboard. I get it, Cincy when healthy can do that to just about anyone other than maybe Houston. The path to beating them is what we did yesterday, try to put up 40 and create a couple negative plays on defense along the way.

 

My overarching complaint, and this is more about the roster construction than the coaching yesterday, is that we spent all this money and draft picks on the defense only for us to still end up in these shootouts. Like we're acknowledging before the game even starts that Cincy is putting up 30+ no matter what, so why do we not want offensive weapons that can keep pace in a game like that? What is the point of investing in the defense as much as we have at the expense of the offense if we're just going to throw our hands up and say "nothing more we could have done" when another offense has its way with us? Either it's true that we need to keep making big investments in the defense, or it's true that nobody can stop an elite offense when they're clicking. Those statements can't both be true. If the second statement is true (and I acknowledge that it mostly is) then you need an offense that can match.

You make a lot of valid points but football's not always x + y = z 

 

Patriots stopped the greatest show on turf and Bill belichick and the Giants kept The k gun under 20 

 

 there's a lot of chess pieces even when an elite offense plays an elite defense

 

Fortunately the bills will not play a quarterback who is as good as a passer the rest of the year as Joe b.. his mental makeup and pure passing ability is as good as it gets in the world

 

Even if the other quarterback is having a day your job is to play all 60 minutes and try to make as many plays as you can... Christian Benford did that most when it mattered 

 

Ed coming back can really help our defensive front especially in the playoffs with some push-up the gut

 

But I get it... Fortunately Benford, and hairston and bishop is a solid core in the secondary going forward 

 

[WotAGuy]

9 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

But I hear you… why not tighten the clamp from the get?!

You need to know whether it requires a C clamp or D clamp. That takes time, usually a half. 

[philholbroo]

its the game prep for the week leading up to the game, it is not good and this whole season opposing teams seem to know exactly how the Bills will look starting each game.

[The Wiz]

10 hours ago, eee1776 said:

The answer is simple. When Bobby Batxxxxx is calling plays we suck, When you see McD with the clipboard things geta lot better. McD has been covering up for him all year, I don't understand why BB is not getting any criticism he deserves.

The funny part is, regardless of who calls what plays when, it's always the same.  The bills defense sucks, "McDermott needs to be fired".  The bills defense is good, "Man Babich is calling a hell of a game right now".  

There is no in between with fans on this for some reason.

[HappyDays]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

You make a lot of valid points but football's not always x + y = z 

 

Patriots stopped the greatest show on turf and Bill belichick and the Giants kept The k gun under 20 

 

 there's a lot of chess pieces even when an elite offense plays an elite defense

 

Fortunately the bills will not play a quarterback who is as good as a passer the rest of the year as Joe b.. his mental makeup and pure passing ability is as good as it gets in the world

 

Even if the other quarterback is having a day your job is to play all 60 minutes and try to make as many plays as you can... Christian Benford did that most when it mattered 

 

Ed coming back can really help our defensive front especially in the playoffs with some push-up the gut

 

But I get it... Fortunately Benford, and hairston and bishop is a solid core in the secondary going forward 

 

 

Those two examples you used are ancient history in NFL years. These days there is maybe one defense per year that is able to actually slow down top offenses. This year it's Houston, and they have two top 3 picks that turned into superstars. A team like us picking at the bottom of the rounds, we're never going to have a defense that talented.

 

And just to be clear I'm not saying defense is totally meaningless even with the rules as skewed towards offense as they are today. I'm fine using 1st rounders on DL and CBs and occasionally giving out big FA contracts to legit defensive players. But you can't spend almost your entire set of offseason resources on that side of the ball, and then still get into games like yesterday. We're extremely lucky to have the only QB in the entire NFL that can win yesterday's game for the Bills, but I hate having to rely on that. There have been several games this year where we needed the offense to be the unit that made a play at the end. Same with our last two playoff losses. Sometimes Allen is able to pull it out all on his own but a lot of times he's not.

 

So I'm happy to accept that no defensive coaching could have made any kind of difference in yesterday's game, as long as we're also accepting that no amount of investment could have made a difference either. Whereas a couple legit investments on offense absolutely could have made it easier on us. Allen's ability to have a legendary performance in a shootout should be a bonus, not the only possible win condition.

[Old Coot]

10 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

The first drive was baffling. Everyone knew that you can't play soft zone against Cinci as burrow would eat it up, but that's exactly what the Bills did lol.

Could have been influenced by weather conditions. When its freezing and snowy the receivers have an advantage -- they know where they are going and the DBs have to react. If the DB slips, it's good by Mr Spaulding!

[nosejob]

16 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

We do. Ever seen a rugby game in the snow? 

Can't say as I have.

[Rochesterfan]

16 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

Yep I did, I think Houston had 5 plays their opening drive? Pretty hard to judge from that.

 

I would almost guarantee that Spags would send pressure if there was a big 3rd down on the plus side of the field on that opening drive 

 

Like the Bills did on the Bengals first 3rd down - where we brought an extra LB and rushed 5, while simulating a 6 man rush?

15 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

When did we send a pressure on the opening drive? I honestly don't remember that at all.

 

Looked like they played some man coverage with 2 safeties on the first 3rd down when Higgins converted. 

 

Everything after that looked like soft zone. Greg Olsen even called them out on it , especially on that 3rd and 7 around the 20-25 yard line.

 

First 3rd down of the game - had 4 down and 2 LBs on the LOS - the announcer mentioned the Bills rarely blitz, but they brought 5 and 1 LB dropped into coverage.

 

 

[Rochesterfan]

15 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

I'll have to re watch that first 3rd down as maybe I missed that.

 

Ya I am saying it loosely. Essentially what I mean is they are playing zone coverage with lots of space off the receivers and are playing over the top.
 

correct me if I'm wrong of course but that's what it looked like to me and Olsen mentioned that 2-3x on the opening drive also

 

 The Bills did play several 3rd downs at the sticks, but they also mentioned several times how Burrow does not like to throw short of the sticks - the Bills played tendencies and Burrow did throw short because of it and the Bills did a poor job of tackling at the catch point.

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

Those two examples you used are ancient history in NFL years. These days there is maybe one defense per year that is able to actually slow down top offenses. This year it's Houston, and they have two top 3 picks that turned into superstars. A team like us picking at the bottom of the rounds, we're never going to have a defense that talented.

 

And just to be clear I'm not saying defense is totally meaningless even with the rules as skewed towards offense as they are today. I'm fine using 1st rounders on DL and CBs and occasionally giving out big FA contracts to legit defensive players. But you can't spend almost your entire set of offseason resources on that side of the ball, and then still get into games like yesterday. We're extremely lucky to have the only QB in the entire NFL that can win yesterday's game for the Bills, but I hate having to rely on that. There have been several games this year where we needed the offense to be the unit that made a play at the end. Same with our last two playoff losses. Sometimes Allen is able to pull it out all on his own but a lot of times he's not.

 

So I'm happy to accept that no defensive coaching could have made any kind of difference in yesterday's game, as long as we're also accepting that no amount of investment could have made a difference either. Whereas a couple legit investments on offense absolutely could have made it easier on us. Allen's ability to have a legendary performance in a shootout should be a bonus, not the only possible win condition.

 

Is worth saying by cap dollars THIS year the Bills are heavily slanted towards offense. Even without Josh it is more on offense than defense. Worryingly we are spending the 18th most in the NFL on receivers this year to get what I suspect is the 32nd best production.

 

[BillsFan130]

8 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

Like the Bills did on the Bengals first 3rd down - where we brought an extra LB and rushed 5, while simulating a 6 man rush?

 

First 3rd down of the game - had 4 down and 2 LBs on the LOS - the announcer mentioned the Bills rarely blitz, but they brought 5 and 1 LB dropped into coverage.

 

 

Shaq actually didn't rush the passer though. He was responsible for the back. If brown stayed in, he would have rushed. But Chase Brown went out for a route and Shaq followed him.

 

So it was actually a 4 man rush to the quarterback if you watch that clip again

Edited 5 hours ago by BillsFan130

[T master]

23 hours ago, I'm Spartacus said:

I think everyone is happy about the win. But Buffalo fans are very knowledgable about football. We see shortcomings in the coaching schemes that put these narrow wins in jeopardy. If we fans can see problems (first half defense), that could possibly be avoided why can't McDermott? The definition of insanity if doing the same things over and over expecting different results.

Well by looking at the difference between the 2 half of the game good or decent teams/coaching staffs see what the opposition is ***** and make adjustments  to their game plan during half time which is what the Bills have done 2 weeks in a row but that is all but forgotten in this fan base .

 

The main emphasis of every out come of every game is put on the negative twist to it no matter what or seemingly how much they win by, even last season when the Bills were the highest scoring team in the league the only thing the fan base did was B word about the D .

 

 

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Worryingly we are spending the 18th most in the NFL on receivers this year to get what I suspect is the 32nd best production.

 

Yeah that is just crazy. Beane chose to spend $30M on three C+ receivers instead of one A receiver. Obviously that strategy has turned out to be disastrous. Partly because he just refuses to consistently spend draft capital on them. Most teams have their version of Josh Palmer playing on a 3rd-5th round rookie contract. We waste $10M on him then we get lectured by the GM that it's not his fault he can't afford better WR talent.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

You want us to pre-adjust?