Bills Utter Collapse-- Jim Kubiak BN

[Freak-O]

1 hour ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Again Allen is not playing at an MVP level but EVERY stat available for judging a QB would say he is playing in the top 10.  There is almost no credible support for the idea that Allen is NOT playing well. And that ranges from every QB metric to the Bills won/loss record.  Could he be playing better?  Yes, though the lack of big play WR's is a limiting factor as to how much better he could play.  

 

 

 

 

A top 3 player only playing at a top 10 level means he’s underperforming. We need him to play like one of the three best QB’s in the league for this team to be great. 

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

3 hours ago, Mikie2times said:

He's not going to ask for a trade. He's not going to ask for McD to be fired. You can see right thru him with how transparent he is. Winning HERE is what matters to him. I understand that he is a mega star. But that fact is still why he is so special IMO. He's a mega star in a normal person and will never be anything else. 

For now … another season or two of this could change his tune 

[DuckyBoys]

dont its mechanics  He's completing 70%  He's probably bored with half the passing game being basically glorified hand offs Passing game needs an injection of some creativity  Feels like Brady's playsheet is in very large print on one small piece of paper

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

4 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

Our WRs are nice

Your argument lost its juice when you said this…

[Gilberto]

29 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

 

As I posted after the Miami loss (and I know it seems like I'm being dramatic):

 

I believe this is the first week in the McBeane Era where a majority of Bills fans are now skeptical and doubtful that they can deliver a Super Bowl victory.

 

I hope McBeane can prove the doubters wrong but in the court of public opinion, for the first time, I believe the majority of Bills fans are no longer unequivocally in support of this administration.

 

I am a fan. I watch the games, but do not pretend to know anything beyond an intermediate knowledge of playcalling, talent evaluation or any other deep topic that gets discussed around here. 

 

But your statement is true. This is the first time that I have been legitimately doubting the collective wisdom of the GM and coaching staff. The problems that we have right now seem too overwhelming and after 5 years of being on the brink of a SB, maybe it is time to think about bringing in fresh ideas. I doubt I am alone in this.  

[Scott7975]

8 hours ago, bmur66 said:

Does anyone else think that limiting Cook might have been intentional because he injured his ankle the previous week? 

No. The blocking was bad. Even though Cook got a few decent runs, a lot of them were held to two yards. This team isn’t built to play behind the sticks. They moved away from it both because it wasn’t working and the clock was ticking while they were behind 2-3 scores all game. 

[26TrapDraw]

1 hour ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

Unless you’re implying Hailee is a

football, or that Kubiak lives with them, I’m really not following…

if he needs to tape a pic of her to his play calling wristband to get him to pay attention great. Kubiak is implying based on his missed reads and absolutely garbage play that his head is not on football right now. whether it's on Hailee or rainbows and butterflies or world peace. I'm saying get your head out of your ass Josh because it's not on your job.

[Sierra Foothills]

15 minutes ago, Gilberto said:

I am a fan. I watch the games, but do not pretend to know anything beyond an intermediate knowledge of playcalling, talent evaluation or any other deep topic that gets discussed around here. 

 

But your statement is true. This is the first time that I have been legitimately doubting the collective wisdom of the GM and coaching staff. The problems that we have right now seem too overwhelming and after 5 years of being on the brink of a SB, maybe it is time to think about bringing in fresh ideas. I doubt I am alone in this.  

 

The fear has always been that 13 seconds was our best chance and that we've not progressed since then.

 

Like I said, I really hope I'm wrong and that the Bills circle the wagons and show us that they can rise up another level or two.

 

Go Bills!

[Simon]

51 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

I believe this is the first week in the McBeane Era where a majority of Bills fans are now skeptical and doubtful that they can deliver a Super Bowl victory.

 

This is an interesting point and could very well be true.

I've always thought McDermott's rigidity and conservative nature were a bad fit for Allen and the Bills SB chase, but I also thought that they'd be able to gather enough talent to overcome the issue.

I'm no longer sure I believe that.

[folz]

Week 4 vs. New Orleans. Offense went dead in the 2nd quarter and then came back. Won the game.

 

Week 5 vs. New England. Offense was bad for the entire first half.

 

Week 6 vs. Atlanta. After opening drive TD, offense was bad the rest of the game.

 

[Week 7 we beat Carolina 40-9; Week 8 we beat K.C. 28-21.]

 

Week 10 vs. Miami. Offense never gets going, bad all game.

 

It seems strange that the slump happens around two big wins. Is this a second slump, or a delayed reaction? Is it more team attitude and intensity? The slump has been spotty, with 11 bad offensive quarters of the last 24 quarters (almost half).

 

It is so hard to know exactly what the problem is with so many factors and with us not having any inside info. But, I obviously do not think that it is one thing only. I mean, has anyone looked at how those six teams played us defensively? Did the four that had more success do anything differently? That could be another factor.

 

I'm just guessing like everyone else here, but the two things that I keep leaning towards is:

 

1. Has Brady become a bit too predictable over the last 6 weeks or so (with the screens, dump offs, not taking a lot of downfield shots, etc.). Could it be less about the receivers not getting separation and more about them just not getting their numbers called or Josh being coached to take the underneath stuff? I don't watch closely enough to see if defenses have changed against us. Have they been getting more out of their shell defenses and coming up closer to the line to defend the run and short passes? If so, you need to start going over them to back them off again. There is something to be said for the "we do what we do well, and we are just going to out execute you doing it" type of offense. The 90s Bills were that type of a team. But I feel that Brady needs to get back more to game-planning (and changing things up) per each opponent specifically (and making better in-game adjustments , obviously). I'm not opposed to the McD philosophy of how he wants his offense run overall (bigger, ball control, run game, etc.), I mean, look at what having a smaller, more finesse, more open offense got us come late-season and playoffs. Nothing. But, they need to be able to open it up when called upon. Which they haven't been able to do consistently this year. As Mikie2times said, it's hard to just pull it out late in a game (when a defense can pin their ears back), if it isn't really part of your overall identity anymore. And I think they have to be careful with this philosophy that they don't make Josh feel stifled. I'm not saying we need to change the offense or completely open it up, we just need to be more multiple (to completely oversimplify with a football cliche).

 

2. Which leads to the second point. We know that over the years, it has been tough for Josh to reign things in, stay patient and just take what the defense gives you. He has done it very well for stretches of his career, but he always seems to fall back out of it at some point. I don't think it is ego, he just wants to play ball the way he has always played ball...gunslinger mentality. It seems that this year (even as opposed to last year), Brady has reigned the offense in even more (everything closer to the line of scrimmage, much fewer designed QB runs, way more screens, etc.). Almost as if the team was saying, if we just don't make mistakes, we'll coast thru the regular season, keep Josh safe for playoffs, etc. And between that and Cook going off, taking a lot of carries, has it just been less fun for Josh? Has he just been a little less enthused about game plans, etc. feeling more like a game manager than "the guy"? Josh is a big kid, he needs to be having fun out there. Now how much it is personal (off the field) and how much is football (Xs and Os) is anyone's guess.

 

As I said, it's all total speculation on my part. And obviously it didn't help that Cook was on a bum ankle and Josh was missing Kincaid and Palmer for Miami too. Plus the heat, maybe a letdown after beating the Chiefs in a big one, etc. Like I said, so many factors...which makes it hard to pinpoint how to fix it.

 

I'm not saying we couldn't have used some improvement to our WR corps. But, I'm just not convinced that they are the main problem. Nor do I think Josh or the team were depressed about the trade deadline passing with no new help. Josh and Brady have plenty of weapons to work with overall (some that they aren't even using as well as last year: Ty Johnson for one). But Josh isn't the type of guy to be down on his teammates, I think he has the mentality that he can win with anyone and always supports the guys that he does have. And if Josh is on his game, he should be elevating the receivers' play. Our WRs suck seems like too easy an answer, imo, for what is going on with the offense right now. But, I'm not discounting other factors that have been raised in this thread as possibilities as well. It is almost never just one thing.

 

Josh and McD have pulled out of slumps before, hopefully they can figure things out and do it again. Not a lot of room left for error this year if we want a decent seed (not because of our record, but because of the records of the rest of the AFC: Pats, Denver, Colts, Chargers). As things stand at he moment, we would be the #6 seed and headed to a road wild card game in New England vs. the Pats.

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, MasterStrategist said:

But if you ask who can flip a switch and get back to MVP form, its obviously Josh.  He did it vs Chiefs, we just need to see it more consistently.

 

I thought the reads were much cleaner against KC to be honest. It's not like Allen had the stats he did in that game because he was dumping a 2 yard pass to Coleman with three defenders leveraged over top. The whole offensive structure around him was much better in that game. The run game was working, the pass protection was better. We managed to create four 20+ yard completions to Kincaid (x2), Moore, and Knox on time and in rhythm, and all four of our TDs happened on those drives. We played with a lead for most of the game which is the position our offense is designed to play from.

 

So I don't think the difference between the KC offensive performance vs the Miami performance was because of the QB play. It's because all of the things that worked against KC didn't work against Miami. They shut down the run, OL played their worst game of the season, after Kincaid's injury Allen had no targets he could trust downfield, Brady fell back into predictable play calling. All of that plus the defense wasn't anywhere near as effective as they were against KC so everything just kind of snowballed.

 

Edited 1 hour ago by HappyDays

[BillsVet]

I am not a gambler and stats alone cannot explain everything wrong with a team.  Nor am I a huge Sharp fan, but this article is as relevant today as it was 2 years ago:

 

https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/analysis/sean-mcdermott-buffalo-bills-ken-dorsey/

 

[Coach Tuesday]

I haven’t read all 14 pages but my hope is that Josh is in between two stages of his career but is still ascending.  Progress is not linear in most professions and aspects of life generally.  Maybe he’s transforming into an elite pocket passer but needs to do it his particular way.

 

That is my hope at least.  

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

3 hours ago, extrahammer said:

 

Ooof. Bad take. Just shows you and your friends don't know football. What, 5+ years of great play and then now suddenly he's a fraud? Very bad take. A lot of people?? LOL. Such a bad take. You sound like a trolling Bucs fans. 

There are video reels on the interwebs consisting solely of Josh’s flops on minor contact.  As bills fans, we laugh, but I guarantee a completely different reaction if the flop videos were of Kermit. The narrative is out there, whether you like it or not 

2 hours ago, DapperCam said:

If people think Allen is playing very poorly, they should take a look around the league. He’s still top-5 or top-10 in most interesting stats. Going into this past week he still had the #1 odds for MVP.

 

If your QB has to play at an MVP level to win games then something is screwed up.

He had good “stats” last Sunday in Miami too … are you going to tell us he played well? 

[st pete gogolak]

1 hour ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

 

As I posted after the Miami loss (and I know it seems like I'm being dramatic):

 

I believe this is the first week in the McBeane Era where a majority of Bills fans are now skeptical and doubtful that they can deliver a Super Bowl victory.

 

I hope McBeane can prove the doubters wrong but in the court of public opinion, for the first time, I believe the majority of Bills fans are no longer unequivocally in support of this administration.

 

No. No, it’s not.  It was 13 seconds.  Deep down in places you don’t talk about at parties, you knew we would never make the Super Bowl after that game with McDermott as HC.

[Low Positive]

46 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

The fear has always been that 13 seconds was our best chance and that we've not progressed since then.

 

Like I said, I really hope I'm wrong and that the Bills circle the wagons and show us that they can rise up another level or two.

 

Go Bills!

I’ll keep arguing this point if I have to scream it. The 2021 Bills were 7-6 at one point and almost missed the playoffs. The 13 seconds was a divisional round game. They still would have had to host Joe Burrow, Ja’Marr Chase, and the Bengals in the AFC CG the next week. We would have lost that game, just like the Chiefs lost it. The closest the Bills got to winning a SB was last season, when they were a spot away from taking a lead in the CG. But the best Bills team was the 2020 team, and they blew their best chance at greatness by not being ready for the moment in KC.

[Jrb1979]

1 hour ago, Freak-O said:

A top 3 player only playing at a top 10 level means he’s underperforming. We need him to play like one of the three best QB’s in the league for this team to be great. 

That tells you how bad this team really is.   

That also says that Allen isn't the only reason this team is 2-3 in their last 5 games.  

 

It's quite possible that due to lack of talent that this a 10-11 win team at best. 

 

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

For now … another season or two of this could change his tune 

Only people who have been beaten down syndrome and think that Buffalo Bills fans can't have any nice would believe that 

 

I don't think Josh is leaving before he's 40 if he's even playing at that time

 

Philip Rivers stayed in San Diego and won a lot less for over 15 years

Edited 30 minutes ago by Buffalo716

[BeastMaster]

Josh needs an elite coach to reinvigorate him and get the best from him

 

Our current coaches are sucking the enjoyment out of football for him

[Low Positive]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

Only people who have been beaten down syndrome and think that Buffalo Bills fans can't have any nice would believe that 

 

I don't think Josh is leaving before he's 40 if he's even playing at that time

The Ryan Miller and Dominik Hasek trade demands caused some pretty deep scars with Buffalo sports fans. We just assume that the other shoe is going to drop at any moment and that the fall will be catastrophic.