McDermott not in Top 10 of NFL coaches per PFF.

[Augie]

6 hours ago, FireChans said:

You wouldn’t have hired Reid after he got fired from Philly because he was “another head coach fired for failing”

 

 

Here’s a great idea…..do not try to think for me. 

 

It just drags out your tiresome act. 

6 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

Look how long it took Reid before he finally won a Super Bowl. The Bills can't wait that long if they want to win one with Allen. He will be 30 soon. Still has plenty of time but the clock is ticking. I will say it again that McDermott is a good coach who turned the Bills around from a losing organization to a winning one. But I have my doubts he will win a championship here.

 

Sure, time is of the essence and we are very close, so let’s start over. We can agree to disagree. 

 

 

.

Edited July 3 by Augie

[Royale with Cheese]

29 minutes ago, FireChans said:

You said over the last 5 years, so since 2020. Yeah, I think Allen is that good. 
 

I never said they could have turned around the drought era Bills.

lol so I should just lie to myself and say I believe in McD.

 

It’s a take. I could be wrong. I hope I am. But it’s what I think. I think you will be wrong. And I think the shift to “McD is a good coach, let’s just stay to course” to “fire this guy already holy crap” is coming.

 

You doubled down on the Adam Gase thing lol.  Wow.

 

Here's something to think about.

Adam Gase had Ryan Tannehill in Miami.  Adam Gase was fired because the Dolphins were going backwards.

Tannehill who was considered done after his stint with Gase, was traded to the Titans for a 6th round pick.  

 

Tannehill under Vrabel, won Offensive Comeback Player of the Year Award, won the division multiple times, signed a big contract extension etc....after he got away from Gase.

 

Lets take a look at Sam Darnold.  His first year under Bowles, showed promise.  The great Adam Gase took over and got Sam Darnold by year two.

The Jets drop to 31st in scoring lol.    

Year 2 under Gase.  Jets go 2-14 but improve to 26th in scoring lol.  Gase was fired.

Darnold was in the MVP race last year and signed and signed a $100 million dollar contract with Seattle lol.  Darnold's first two coaches were Gase and Matt Rhule.  Gee...wonder why he struggled.

 

But yes, Adam Gases regime would have developed Allen as well as McDermott's regime.  Wow.

 

https://jetswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/jets/2021/01/26/chris-harris-says-peyton-manning-taught-adam-gase-broncos-offense-jets-dolphins/79823934007/

 

 

[FireChans]

7 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

But yes, Adam Gases regime would have developed Allen as well as McDermott's regime

I didn’t say that. This is weird gotcha. I’m out.

21 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

would the Bills have won 5 straight division titles with Adam Gase or Nathaniel Hackett with the same roster as McDermott?

Very odd thing to lie about.

[Nihilarian]

The ONLY NFL head coach with a better win record over the last five seasons has been KC HC Andy Reid.

 

McD has done better than any NFC HC and IMO the biggest reason Reid have done so well is because he is an ...offensive genius...he has Mahomes as his QB. he currently has two ex NFL head coaches as his OC, DC.  Reid has 26 years NFL experience as a head coach and his teams have been #1 in their division for 15 of those years and 6x as the #2 team. so, in 21 out of 26 seasons his teams have either been first or second in his teams division. 

 

" Sean Payton has the seventh-best career win percentage (.615) in the league. 

The only coaches above Payton are Jim Harbaugh (.688), Matt LaFleur (.656), Nick Sirianni (.643), Andy Reid (.639), Sean McDermott (.624) and Mike Tomlin (.621). 

 

https://broncoswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/broncos/2024/06/06/nfl-head-coaches-active-winning-percentage-rankings/79049540007/

 

In my view McD is the #2 HC.

[GoBills808]

18 hours ago, FireChans said:

Are you under the impression I have wanted McDermott fired for a decade? I thought he did well in 2023. I engaged in maybe pursuing BB as the only active coach that I would take over McD after the 2023 season on that cycle, but that was it.

 

I said it wasn't McD's fault he had AJ Klein out there to cover Kelce. 

 

However, in 2024, his defense was still mediocre and our season still ended at the hands of KC after an MVP year by our QB, for the fourth time, and that was the final straw. 

 

I was willing to change my view given new information, and I did. That doesn't make me inflexible or a hater.

 

I'm hopeful that he will be fired if he goes 0-5 vs KC because to me its criminal to run it back for a 6th straight time, but ultimately, he probably won't lose his job until its far too late. I've made my peace with that. 

It's already too late

 

We'd have been right there w the Chiefs in terms of success. I'm convinced of it.

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

It's already too late

 

We'd have been right there w the Chiefs in terms of success. I'm convinced of it.

I don’t know if I’d go that far. 
 

Mahomes had such a great roster and coaching advantage from the jump. 
 

Even if you play the “what if” game about getting a new HC in 2022 or in 2023 or even back in 2017, I think you’d be hard-pressed to find a coach who could hold his own vs Reid in the postseason consistently. And the further you go back, the less chance Allen is who he is today for the Buffalo Bills.

 

I don’t think there’s any reality that like Daboll (not saying you’d want him, but whatever HC candidate you like) is our HC from 22 on and we are beating the Chiefs consistently in the playoffs. Or even .500. Shanny or McVay weren’t available but I think even if they were, the scoreboard would be heavily tilted to KC imo. 

 

Just really crappy luck. Curse of Bambino esque.

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

I don’t know if I’d go that far. 
 

Mahomes had such a great roster and coaching advantage from the jump. 
 

Even if you play the “what if” game about getting a new HC in 2022 or in 2023 or even back in 2017, I think you’d be hard-pressed to find a coach who could hold his own vs Reid in the postseason consistently. And the further you go back, the less chance Allen is who he is today for the Buffalo Bills.

 

I don’t think there’s any reality that like Daboll (not saying you’d want him, but whatever HC candidate you like) is our HC from 22 on and we are beating the Chiefs consistently in the playoffs. Or even .500. Shanny or McVay weren’t available but I think even if they were, the scoreboard would be heavily tilted to KC imo. 

 

Just really crappy luck. Curse of Bambino esque.

You don't need to beat them consistently in the playoffs is the point. Just hold serve and we have simultaneously improved our chances and ended their season at least 40% of the time. 

[Royale with Cheese]

31 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I didn’t say that. This is weird gotcha. I’m out.

Very odd thing to lie about.

 

Remember "Saving receipts"?

 

You make it very clear Allen is the only reason for McDermott's success which is why you think Hackett and Gase would have also won 5 straight AFCE titles too.

So basically replace McDermott with the above and results would be the same.

And you're denying it.

 

21 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

The fact that you're bringing up what Hackett and Gase did as OC's and not what they did as HC's.

Don't beat around the bush....would the Bills have won 5 straight division titles with Adam Gase or Nathaniel Hackett with the same roster as McDermott?

 

21 hours ago, FireChans said:

Yes. They would.

 

We have seen what Adam and Nat Hackett were able to do with elite QBs.  Oversee elite offenses and MVP seasons. That wins you lots of division titles, especially with the other crappy QBs in the conference.

 

[FireChans]

9 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Remember "Saving receipts"?

 

You make it very clear Allen is the only reason for McDermott's success which is why you think Hackett and Gase would have also won 5 straight AFCE titles too.

So basically replace McDermott with the above and results would be the same.

And you're denying it.

 

 

 

I think there’s lots of coaches, including them, who could have won 5 straight division titles from 2020 to 2024. That’s when we won 5 straight division titles. 
 

I don’t think they could have turned around the drought-era Bills like McDermott did. I think McD and co deserve a lot of credit for turning the entire organization around, and that includes drafting and developing Allen. I have never wavered on that. It’s why I agree he would get a job in 2 seconds if he was available for a sad sack organization. He has proven he can turn things around and that makes him a good coach, but not a great one imo. 

 

However, NOW, that Allen is great, I think you could replace McD with a lot of other coaches and basically get the same result. 

My opinion of McD is that he’s a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. And now Allen is holding up the floor by being maybe the best QB in football. We don’t need that anymore. I have been very consistent on this in this entire thread.
 

Weird gotcha isn’t fun man, let go of the bone. There’s no scoreboard. You aren’t gonna twist my arm and make me say uncle. 

[FireChans]

27 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

You don't need to beat them consistently in the playoffs is the point. Just hold serve and we have simultaneously improved our chances and ended their season at least 40% of the time. 

I suppose that’s true.

 

But even still, after 2018, I don’t think was ever a chance that we have more or equal SB appearances to KC. Maybe something like KC has 2 rings and we have 1? 
 

I just kinda look at the SB matchups outside of KC. I don’t know if we are beating that 2020 Bucs team or that 2023 Niners team. Maybe we beat the 2022 Eagles. I don’t think we are beating the 2024 Eagles.

 

I guess the point is, even if we ended KCs season 40% of the time, are we convinced we win the AFCCGs or SBs they won? Or that they lost?

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I suppose that’s true.

 

But even still, after 2018, I don’t think was ever a chance that we have more or equal SB appearances to KC. Maybe something like KC has 2 rings and we have 1? 
 

I just kinda look at the SB matchups outside of KC. I don’t know if we are beating that 2020 Bucs team or that 2023 Niners team. Maybe we beat the 2022 Eagles. I don’t think we are beating the 2024 Eagles.

 

I guess the point is, even if we ended KCs season 40% of the time, are we convinced we win the AFCCGs or SBs they won? Or that they lost?

I think we could have won at least one of the SBs they won and 50/50 on one of the ones they lost

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

I think there’s lots of coaches, including them, who could have won 5 straight division titles from 2020 to 2024. That’s when we won 5 straight division titles. 
 

I don’t think they could have turned around the drought-era Bills like McDermott did. I think McD and co deserve a lot of credit for turning the entire organization around, and that includes drafting and developing Allen. I have never wavered on that. It’s why I agree he would get a job in 2 seconds if he was available for a sad sack organization. He has proven he can turn things around and that makes him a good coach, but not a great one imo. 

 

However, NOW, that Allen is great, I think you could replace McD with a lot of other coaches and basically get the same result. 

My opinion of McD is that he’s a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. And now Allen is holding up the floor by being maybe the best QB in football. We don’t need that anymore. I have been very consistent on this in this entire thread.
 

Weird gotcha isn’t fun man, let go of the bone. There’s no scoreboard. You aren’t gonna twist my arm and make me say uncle. 

 

You have not been consistent.  I'm not the only one reacting negatively to your posts.

You have argued out of both sides of your mouth lol. 

 

[FireChans]

9 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You have not been consistent.  I'm not the only one reacting negatively to your posts.

You have argued out of both sides of your mouth lol. 

 

Well, I've laid out my thoughts as concisely as possible a few times and I have far too many posts in this thread. Have a nice holiday!

[Doc Brown]

If you get a similar result next postseason where the defense shrinks against the Chiefs/Ravens/Bengals and the offense keeps it close again than I think it's time to move on from McDermott.  A six year sample size is enough.  You just can't keep banging your head against the wall.  I'd prefer just to promote Joe Brady to head coach to hopefully keep most of the staff together.  A lot can happen in a year though.

 

However, there's this problem...........  Which is why Terry would never do it so this 24 page thread is pretty much useless.

 

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, Doc Brown said:

If you get a similar result next postseason where the defense shrinks against the Chiefs/Ravens/Bengals and the offense keeps it close again than I think it's time to move on from McDermott.  A six year sample size is enough.  You just can't keep banging your head against the wall.  I'd prefer just to promote Joe Brady to head coach to hopefully keep most of the staff together.  A lot can happen in a year though.

 

However, there's this problem...........  Which is why Terry would never do it so this 24 page thread is pretty much useless.

 

'chatGPT make me a picture of 3guys who have never held a shovel in their lives'

[Billsfed1]

One thing i’ll give McDermott is he rarely gets “beat”. When the Ravens beat us last year, it was a rare occurrence in terms of getting blown out.
 

If i’m not mistaken you could see the look on Seans face after the first Ravens score like he knew the rare beat down was coming.  

 

But also at the same time, you saw the look of fire that assuredly rolled through the players.

 

That’s the stern look that had held down the standard.

 

 

Edited July 4 by Billsfed1

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

BUMP

 

Here's a different ranking that has McD outside the top 10. 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2025-nfl-head-coach-rankings-eagles-nick-sirianni-lions-dan-campbell-make-leaps-behind-chiefs-andy-reid/

 

 He made the top tier, but was in last place of that tier at 12th overall. 

 

I think that's pretty fair

 

[RochesterLifer]

On 7/3/2025 at 9:38 AM, GoBills808 said:

It's already too late

 

We'd have been right there w the Chiefs in terms of success. I'm convinced of it.

😩 We're all gonna die!

[Gunsgoodtime]

15 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

BUMP

 

Here's a different ranking that has McD outside the top 10. 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2025-nfl-head-coach-rankings-eagles-nick-sirianni-lions-dan-campbell-make-leaps-behind-chiefs-andy-reid/

 

 He made the top tier, but was in last place of that tier at 12th overall. 

 

I think that's pretty fair

 

I agree, that's about where he should be.  He don't deserve top 10 with having Josh Allen as his qb and not even making it to 1 Superbowl. I think the only people that think Mcd is a great coach is the Homer fans.  He is a good coach, nowhere near great.  This is also why I think he should have been fired years ago, replacing his results would be nowhere near as difficult as some on here make it out to be

Edited 15 hours ago by Gunsgoodtime

[Special K]

5 hours ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

BUMP

 

Here's a different ranking that has McD outside the top 10. 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2025-nfl-head-coach-rankings-eagles-nick-sirianni-lions-dan-campbell-make-leaps-behind-chiefs-andy-reid/

 

 He made the top tier, but was in last place of that tier at 12th overall. 

 

I think that's pretty fair

 

 

Mina Kimes seems to like McDermott a little more than that:

 

(Love how she takes the opportunity to crap on the Fins at the very end!!)

 

Edited 9 hours ago by Special K