Hopkins released by Arizona (7/16: signed by Titans)

[boyst]

14 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Not a chance their core is better on paper than most in the league. Really not even close…. They are middle of the pack at best as it stands now. 
 

Your referencing Harty who has flashed here and there and Sherfield… two guys who have amounted to mostly nothing in their NFL careers… Kincaid has potential for sure, but have to see how that plays out considering Knox disappeared time to time. 
 

But this is exactly what many fans were saying last off-season around this time about the Bills WR corps(which I was lambasted for suggesting they weren’t a good unit😅) so it’s no surprise.

The drop off in WR3 to WR4 isn't that much across the league. They're all about mediocre. Few teams have talent at their third WR. Higgins, Chase, Boyd is among, if not the best. And there are plenty of people on the Bengals boards and fanbase that don't appreciate Boyd.

 

We have no viable options behind WR1 (Diggs) as it stands now. Knox was inconsistent if not invisible in '23. Davis did not step up at WR and we cannot believe he will in '23. Harry, Sherfield, and Shakir are not legitimate threats on an NFL roster. We cannot blindly put faith in Kincaid being an answer when we had struggled so mightly to use TE1 in '22. Our backfield isn't going to drastically contribute, either.

 

When all is said and done the McBeane era will be defined by their inability to develop their drafted DL talent, their inability to find WR's, their wastefulness on OL, with the highlights being the big gamble on Josh, the development of the DB's and the change in character of this organization.

[Goin Breakdown]

95 pages + 282

Were all counting the closed thread when we come this thread right?

 

 

 

Right?

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

1. McKenzie wasn't a literal example.   It was an example of a newly created thread which asked a question that I had long ago answered in great detail.......with great accuracy........with a thread I started last season.  And in numerous posts ever since.   Point being that if you dismiss my takes out of hand you would have missed the Lil' Dummy takes.

 

2. You didn't tag me in the post.  This is tagging: @Alphadawg7 .   You added the emoji to make it seem "T-I-C" like 5 hours ago........after my response.......when you edited it.    So not it wasn't tongue in cheek at the time.   That doesn't bother me one way or the other.   The truth is what it is important......Beane spent a ton of money on garbage in UFA in 2018.......trying to dismiss that fact because you want to discredit the messenger is just perpetuating ignorance.  

You’re a bit off the rails here, lmao.  And I added the emoticon to make it more clear it was more tongue in cheek cuz you clearly went to some dark place with it and well over your head lmao.  Although your responses since are right on brand I must say.  

 

And spare me your glowing yelp reviews about your own posts, nobody cares what you think of your own posts 😂
 

The fact you are on here in 2023 pissing and moaning about a FA class of a first year GM 5 years ago before he started the rebuild is already pointless.  So I won’t even bother addressing your over the top take on it.  

[boyst]

28 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

95 pages + 282

Were all counting the closed thread when we come this thread right?

 

 

 

Right?

I vote @Simon when all is said and done combined these threads and puts a tombstone on it at the end and declare it  DeAndre Hopkins Thread (RIP 1/10/23-xx/xx/xx).

[78thealltimegreat]

4 hours ago, boyst said:

I vote @Simon when all is said and done combined these threads and puts a tombstone on it at the end and declare it  DeAndre Hopkins Thread (RIP 1/10/23-xx/xx/xx).

I’m in agreement it seems DHop is going to the highest bidder might as well lockdown this thread and move on  

[Einstein]

8 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

That's why we paid what we paid and with that contract comes obviously a plan of usage.

 

I see you’re new to this team

 

We draft and sign players all the time that we barely use.

 

I still laugh when I think about all the fans who thought we were going to use Breida’s speed to open up the offense. Dude was inactive for much of the year lol.

 

8 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

A 2 year 9.5m dollar contract is not a "flyer". 

 

Sure it is.

 

It is essentially a 1 year deal with a team option for a second.

 

Bills could cut him after this season for only a $1.3M deal cap.

 

He is barely in the top 70 of WR contracts. All the players around him (dollar wise) are played on their rookie deal.

 

 

[Chandler#81]

8 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Not a chance their core is better on paper than most in the league. Really not even close…. They are middle of the pack at best as it stands now. 
 

Your referencing Harty who has flashed here and there and Sherfield… two guys who have amounted to mostly nothing in their NFL careers… Kincaid has potential for sure, but have to see how that plays out considering Knox disappeared time to time. 
 

But this is exactly what many fans were saying last off-season around this time about the Bills WR corps(which I was lambasted for suggesting they weren’t a good unit😅) so it’s no surprise.

My biggest issue with the rookies is ole #22, Sean McDingleberry. His arcane propensity for simply NOT playing rookies is maddening, yet it continues. So even counting on them is foolish. Ergo, with the exception of a couple FA OL, there is no realistic reason to think this team will be better. I have no delusions of grandeur that we’ll be in the SB this season.
 

btw, #22 is too high, imo.

[The Red King]

If Davis would stop making critical drops at key times a number of people here would feel far more secure about the WR room atm.  Hopkins is clutch.  ATM, Davis is not.

[JohnBonhamRocks]

4 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

My biggest issue with the rookies is ole #22, Sean McDingleberry. His arcane propensity for simply NOT playing rookies is maddening, yet it continues. So even counting on them is foolish. Ergo, with the exception of a couple FA OL, there is no realistic reason to think this team will be better. I have no delusions of grandeur that we’ll be in the SB this season.
 

btw, #22 is too high, imo.

I think fixing the IOL will improve all players on offense. Less Allen running for his life, better holes for RBs, and more time for pass catchers to get open. 

[mrags]

5 hours ago, The Red King said:

If Davis would stop making critical drops at key times a number of people here would feel far more secure about the WR room atm.  Hopkins is clutch.  ATM, Davis is not.

The odd thing is he was absolutely opposite his first few years in the league from what he was last season. Too much pressure, injury, having a new role. It all could have played a factor. We’ll see how it goes this year. Hopefully he’s a little more healthy and a little more comfortable there. there’s no guarantee this will happen and I’m aware of it. 
 

 

on a side note, this is the first I’m really seeing this thread since the early pages. Man oh man. What could have been if we just continued this in the original Hopkins thread. This thing would reach epic proportions. 
 

 

[BuffaloBillyG]

5 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

My biggest issue with the rookies is ole #22, Sean McDingleberry. His arcane propensity for simply NOT playing rookies is maddening, yet it continues. So even counting on them is foolish. Ergo, with the exception of a couple FA OL, there is no realistic reason to think this team will be better. I have no delusions of grandeur that we’ll be in the SB this season.
 

btw, #22 is too high, imo.

I believe this is one of the more overblown narratives on this board. 

 

2017 Draft class included:

White

Dawkins

Zay Jones

Milano

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies.

 

2018:

Allen

Edmunds

Phillips

Taron 

Robert Foster

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies

 

2019:

Oliver

Ford

Singletary

Knox

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies

 

2020:

AJE

Moss

Gabe Davis

 

All saw reasonable snap time

 

2021:

Groot

Brown

Both ended season as starters and saw significant playtime throughout the year.

 

So most of the top end higher picks have seen significant playtime their rookie year. Some worked in a bit slower and some started right off the bus. The mid to lower picks saw less time...and that's actually a result of the Bills taking guys that are a bit more raw with bigger upside than it is anything else IMO. Not handing guys playtime off draft status is actually a good thing. Make them earn it.

 

Also notice that as the years go on and the roster gets deeper with more talent the rookies get less playtime. Believe it or not that's actually a POSITIVE thing.

 

The drumbeat for this narrative has been growing louder since last year because fans want to see Shakir more. While I believe Shakir has the tools to be good he flat out wasn't ready last year. He showed some splashes. He just wasn't where he needed to be.  The simple fact that they would play McKenzie over him (a guy they have tried for years to replace) and brought Cole Beasley back off the basketball court is a solid sign that Shakir just didn't impress the staff enough. And that's ok for a 5th rounder. He'll get there.

 

There are a lot of things that are easy to target McD on with questions (challenge flag usage for example). However rookie playtime just isn't one of them.

Edited June 3, 2023 by BuffaloBillyG

[Beast]

5 hours ago, The Red King said:

If Davis would stop making critical drops at key times a number of people here would feel far more secure about the WR room atm.  Hopkins is clutch.  ATM, Davis is not.

This time last year, Davis was looked upon as being extremely clutch.

Edited June 3, 2023 by Beast

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, Beast said:

This time last year, Davis was looked upon as being extremely clutch.

That may have been the majority opinion, but before the 2022 draft there were some including myself and others @BADOLBILZ who argued for drafting a WR early (in a draft with more high end talent at the position than 2023) because Davis was inconsistent. So it just isn't true that the narrative only started after this past year. 

[SCBills]

My biggest concern with Davis is that I haven’t seen him show the skill set of a WR2 in a pass heavy offense. 

 

He’s a big body deep threat who is excellent at working back to the QB when he’s out of the pocket.   Also an elite blocker as a WR. 
 

A legit WR2 needs to be able to have a much more fuller, effective, route tree than that. 
 

People will point to the ankle injury, and there may be validity to that, but Gabe has dealt with ankle injuries on and off since his time at UCF. 

 

Im open to a healthy Gabe showing he can be a top tier WR2, but it’s a lot of hope for a guy who’s shown to be more of a WR3 capable of big games here and there. 
 

 

Edited June 3, 2023 by SCBills

[Einstein's Dog]

22 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

That may have been the majority opinion, but before the 2022 draft there were some including myself and others @BADOLBILZ who argued for drafting a WR early (in a draft with more high end talent at the position than 2023) because Davis was inconsistent. So it just isn't true that the narrative only started after this past year. 

You seem to be confusing consistency with clutch.  It was Davis' clutch play in the playoffs, coupled with his upward trend that gave many hope that he would be a fine WR2.  Didn't really happen, but it had solid reasoning behind it.

[The Red King]

40 minutes ago, Beast said:

This time last year, Davis was looked upon as being extremely clutch.

 

And?  Doesn't excuse his imconsistant play last season, and does not put my faith in him for this one.  The Jets game still haunts me, and that was just one key drop.

 

Now Hopkins here, on the other hand, I kinda remember him making a clutch catch, in a ton of traffic, to win a game that looked lost, but I can't quite seem to recall... 🤔

[julian]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I believe this is one of the more overblown narratives on this board. 

 

2017 Draft class included:

White

Dawkins

Zay Jones

Milano

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies.

 

2018:

Allen

Edmunds

Phillips

Taron 

Robert Foster

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies

 

2019:

Oliver

Ford

Singletary

Knox

 

All saw significant snaps as rookies

 

2020:

AJE

Moss

Gabe Davis

 

All saw reasonable snap time

 

2021:

Groot

Brown

Both ended season as starters and saw significant playtime throughout the year.

 

So most of the top end higher picks have seen significant playtime their rookie year. Some worked in a bit slower and some started right off the bus. The mid to lower picks saw less time...and that's actually a result of the Bills taking guys that are a bit more raw with bigger upside than it is anything else IMO. Not handing guys playtime off draft status is actually a good thing. Make them earn it.

 

Also notice that as the years go on and the roster gets deeper with more talent the rookies get less playtime. Believe it or not that's actually a POSITIVE thing.

 

The drumbeat for this narrative has been growing louder since last year because fans want to see Shakir more. While I believe Shakir has the tools to be good he flat out wasn't ready last year. He showed some splashes. He just wasn't where he needed to be.  The simple fact that they would play McKenzie over him (a guy they have tried for years to replace) and brought Cole Beasley back off the basketball court is a solid sign that Shakir just didn't impress the staff enough. And that's ok for a 5th rounder. He'll get there.

 

There are a lot of things that are easy to target McD on with questions (challenge flag usage for example). However rookie playtime just isn't one of them.

Elam and Cook needed to be on the field more, that was a failure IMHO. Shakir was a much less important piece of the puzzle.

 

 If people are saying McDermott has a long history of mishandling rookies that’s obviously incorrect.

[Dr. Who]

1 hour ago, Einstein's Dog said:

You seem to be confusing consistency with clutch.  It was Davis' clutch play in the playoffs, coupled with his upward trend that gave many hope that he would be a fine WR2.  Didn't really happen, but it had solid reasoning behind it.

He had one outstanding game against the Chiefs that truly was responsible for the inflated expectations. If you are not consistent, you're not reliably clutch in my view, but if you want to quibble on semantics I grant he has had good games. His entire body of work is subpar for a WR2, though there are quite a few on the board who think otherwise.

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, Einstein's Dog said:

You seem to be confusing consistency with clutch.  It was Davis' clutch play in the playoffs, coupled with his upward trend that gave many hope that he would be a fine WR2.  Didn't really happen, but it had solid reasoning behind it.

 

It's impossible to be "clutch" if you're not consistent.

 

It's an oxymoron.

 

Brady was clutch because he was so consistently good at the end of games.

[BillsFan619]

7 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

My biggest issue with the rookies is ole #22, Sean McDingleberry. His arcane propensity for simply NOT playing rookies is maddening, yet it continues. So even counting on them is foolish. Ergo, with the exception of a couple FA OL, there is no realistic reason to think this team will be better. I have no delusions of grandeur that we’ll be in the SB this season.
 

btw, #22 is too high, imo.

Chandler, while you’re hard on some posters, you typically have a positive outlook on all things Bills. I realize positivity doesn’t mean no critique, but these comments seem out of character for you. You’re usually one of the ones keeping very negative posters at bay.

 

What’s the reason for the change in outlook?

Edited June 3, 2023 by BillsFan619