Can you imagine being Allen last night?

[Billz4ever]

32 minutes ago, FireChans said:

 

Don't need to be a coach to tell you "don't throw this ball" lmao.

If I remember, Allen's explanation for that was the rusher at the top of the screen that was being blocked and later broke free to get closer to Allen blocked his view and he never saw the defender there.  Either way, yeah, not a good ball.  He should've recognized the coverage.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Billz4ever

[Big Turk]

8 minutes ago, FireChans said:

The Chiefs didn't stop the Eagles for a single second bro. Jalen Hurts just dropped the ball. They didn't return it for a TD because of Spags.  That's insane.

 

They actually did when it mattered in the 2nd half. That's what helped give them the lead, a key stop on 3rd down, a bad punt and a return to the 5 yard line.

[CincyBillsFan]

15 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

Have to wonder how they've worked that one out.

My guess is that they factored in that Allen was 3rd in the voting this season so right there he should be a top 5 candidate.  Then they considered Allen's elite skill set and that bumped him into the top 3.  Then they look at the Bills and asked the question "where do they have to get better"? and the logical answer is on the O line and in the number of play makers.  In other words Allen is going to get more help.

 

 

[HappyDays]

8 minutes ago, FireChans said:

The Chiefs didn't stop the Eagles for a single second bro. Jalen Hurts just dropped the ball. They didn't return it for a TD because of Spags.  That's insane.

 

No I get that, but they weren't going to stop them no matter what they did. The Eagles offense is much more talented than the Chiefs defense. So they blitzed a lot and took some chances. They got some hits in on Hurts, made him as uncomfortable as possible, and when the moment came for a game changing play they were there for it. Compared to what the Eagles did where they let Mahomes on a bad ankle stand there comfortable the whole game and pick them apart. I know which game plan I prefer.

[Radar]

53 minutes ago, McBean said:

Beane has no choice? Lol, you mean McDermott.

 

Beane looks at the books and the cap. McDermott runs this entire organization.

What evidence do we really have to make such a definitive statement. I'm not saying that McDermott doesn't have input as most any head coach I expect does but that doesn't mean he runs the entire organization.

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

No I get that, but they weren't going to stop them no matter what they did. The Eagles offense is much more talented than the Chiefs defense. So they blitzed a lot and took some chances. They got some hits in on Hurts, made him as uncomfortable as possible, and when the moment came for a game changing play they were there for it. Compared to what the Eagles did where they let Mahomes on a bad ankle stand there comfortable the whole game and pick them apart. I know which game plan I prefer.

On the TD to Skyy Moore, the Eagles blitzed up the middle and the Chiefs had the perfect counter called.  The blitz came and Mahomes simply tossed it to a wide-open Moore.

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

No I get that, but they weren't going to stop them no matter what they did. The Eagles offense is much more talented than the Chiefs defense. So they blitzed a lot and took some chances. They got some hits in on Hurts, made him as uncomfortable as possible, and when the moment came for a game changing play they were there for it. Compared to what the Eagles did where they let Mahomes on a bad ankle stand there comfortable the whole game and pick them apart. I know which game plan I prefer.

What? 

 

The Eagles hit Mahomes 5 times. The Chiefs hit Hurts twice.  You are trying to force a narrative with the wrong data. The Chiefs game plan was just as terrible as the Eagles. Mahomes just didn't drop the ball randomly. That's it.  

 

Jalen Hurts had 370 yards and 4 TD's.  That's not "picking them apart?"  11 of 18 on first down.  10 more minutes TOP. 72 offensive plays.

 

I understand this is your "Leslie Frazier lost the Super Bowl for the Eagles magnum opus" but come on bro.

Edited February 13, 2023 by FireChans

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

I thought this would be about Hurts Fumble TD, which hasn't been discussed enough and one of the worst plays I've ever seen.

 

If that was Allen people would lose it about his issues "holding on to the ball". 

That would be because Allen, like it or not has ball security issues…, 

which would get better if he had an above average O-line, which he doesn’t….,

Edited February 13, 2023 by Don Otreply

[HappyDays]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

On the TD to Skyy Moore, the Eagles blitzed up the middle and the Chiefs had the perfect counter called.  The blitz came and Mahomes simply tossed it to a wide-open Moore.

 

The Eagles have apparently been susceptible to pre-snap motions all year long and Andy Reid clearly knew that. On that and the TD to Toney, whoever was supposed to cover them got confused and abandoned their man. I don't think the blitz had anything to do with it. They went into man coverage which they had barely done the rest of the game and got confused.

[McBean]

3 minutes ago, Radar said:

What evidence do we really have to make such a definitive statement. I'm not saying that McDermott doesn't have input as most any head coach I expect does but that doesn't mean he runs the entire organization.

Evidence?

 

Ran the first draft that was a disaster.

 

He then hand picked Beane after draft.

 

Beane is a puppet. McDermott is the Czar.

[Brand J]

Quote

The Chiefs were not statistically terrible on defense this season. They ranked 18th in defensive EPA and were young in key spots. Kansas City’s No. 32 ranking in special-teams EPA accounts for the No. 29 ranking in combined EPA in the two phases Mahomes cannot control.

 

The “Quarterback Betrayal Index” we published before the season showed only five established starting quarterbacks over the previous decade getting less support from their own defense/special teams than Mahomes had gotten from his. Drew Brees, Justin Herbert, Tony Romo, Matt Ryan and Aaron Rodgerscombined for zero Super Bowl victories over that 10-year run from 2012-21. Mahomes had won one, and now he has another.

From The Athletic. This is interesting, because to me the Chiefs defense has proven time and time again to step up and make the plays when needed. I’m not sure what this Betrayal Index is, but I’m positive it’d list Allen as one who has the most help from his defense/ST, yet look which unit consistently folds when it matters… We need a Spagnuolo/Anarumo type of DC.

[HappyDays]

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

What? 

 

The Eagles hit Mahomes 5 times. The Chiefs hit Hurts twice.  You are trying to force a narrative with the wrong data. The Chiefs game plan was just as terrible as the Eagles. Mahomes just didn't drop the ball randomly. That's it.  

 

Jalen Hurts had 370 yards and 4 TD's.  That's not "picking them apart?"

 

I understand this is your "Leslie Frazier lost the Super Bowl for the Eagles magnum opus" but come on bro.

 

From a talent perspective the Eagles are more talented than the Chiefs. I don't think the Chiefs could have really done anything to stop them. Maybe the Chiefs versus the Bengals is a better analog. They took some chances and slowed them down.

 

But the Eagles gameplan against the Chiefs I will stand by my assertion that it was a historically bad defensive game plan in the Super Bowl.

[Big Blitz]

I have never been lower on Beane.  
 

This team is Allen and Diggs and a defense that still was great because of moves made in 2017 and 2018.  
 

Absolutely unacceptable 

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

From a talent perspective the Eagles are more talented than the Chiefs. I don't think the Chiefs could have really done anything to stop them. Maybe the Chiefs versus the Bengals is a better analog. They took some chances and slowed them down.

 

But the Eagles gameplan against the Chiefs I will stand by my assertion that it was a historically bad defensive game plan in the Super Bowl.

The Eagles got burned when they blitzed. They got burned when they dropped.

 

They had a front 5 that had 56 sacks on the year. They had a league leading 70 sacks. None of them got home.

 

Relying on your players that got you there and were terrorizing opposing teams all year is not a bad gameplan lol.

[UKBillFan]

13 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

My guess is that they factored in that Allen was 3rd in the voting this season so right there he should be a top 5 candidate.  Then they considered Allen's elite skill set and that bumped him into the top 3.  Then they look at the Bills and asked the question "where do they have to get better"? and the logical answer is on the O line and in the number of play makers.  In other words Allen is going to get more help.

 

 

That’s logical. They have more faith in McBeane being logical than I have at this early stage.

[Billsfan1972]

9 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

That would be because Allen, like it or not has ball security issues…, 

which would get better if he had an above average O-line, which he doesn’t….,

That was one of the worst turnovers I've ever seen (in running with butt fumble) and on the biggest stage and was glossed over.

[Gregg]

1 minute ago, McBean said:

Evidence?

 

Ran the first draft that was a disaster.

 

He then hand picked Beane after draft.

 

Beane is a puppet. McDermott is the Czar.

 

I would hope this wouldn't be the case. Preparing for the draft starts in September when CFB starts. Beane has his scouts covering all the conferences. Beane can split his time between the Bills and college football. McDermott really can't since he is focused on the Bills season. For all we know Beane probably travels to some CFB games if a Bills scout tells him come to see a specific player and then flies back to where the Bills are playing that Sunday. My point is Beane and his scouts have been paying to attention to these players in college all season long. They are the ones who put together the Bills draft board based on what they have seen. Why should McDermott run the draft when he hasn't focused on CFB like Beane and the scouts have. I hope Terry tells McDermott that Beane has the final say on who the Bills draft. That way McDermott can't do anything about it. Terry is the real Czar in Bills land.

[Don Otreply]

3 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

That was one of the worst turnovers I've ever seen (in running with butt fumble) and on the biggest stage and was glossed over.

How  Does this change the fact that Josh has been a bit sloppy over his career as to ball security? Earning that rep…,

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, Real McNasty said:

Mahomes had 17

Thanks. Took it from here; did they overlook Mahomes’ fumbles? 0 did look low!
https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/nfl-qb-most-turnovers-2022

[Mango]

55 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Favre was a 3 time NFL MVP in 3 straight years between 1995-1997, are you claiming the voting was rigged or something.  C'mon man, let's stop pretending he wasn't among the best of his time. This sounds really revisionist.

 

It feels like @FireChans is saying one thing and you are taking it and running too far with it. 

Favre is great. Had a great career. Belongs in the pantheon of QB folklore. But nobody is mistaking Favre for a top 5 QB. If you gave Belichick Favre, they would be a really good team still, and Favre might have a better career, but he still wouldn't be better than Brady That is what the comparison to Mahomes and Allen is. Allen is great. Love him. Love it. But ultimately Mahomes is the better QB by a wide margin, even in comparison to other great QB's.

I think if Mahomes ended his career tomorrow he is likely a first ballot HoF'er. Allen would not be close. Part of that is environment, and part of that is the player. 

55 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Last night Super Bowl should solidify for anyone, our FO included, that Offense wins Championships.  
 

You couldn’t have told me who had an average defense and who had an elite defense last night.  They both looked the same.  
 

Eagles invested more than us even, in that Defense .. and it didn’t matter when they played an elite offense.  
 

You need an average defense with some playmakers.. which we have with Von, Milano and hopefully Tre/Hyde. 
 

Yet we’ll justify re-signing Edmunds and keeping Oliver around … 24M in cap allocated to excess Defensive talent that doesn’t protect or help our QB.  
 

 

 

The current version of Hurts is going to hold the Eagles back once he gets his big deal. He puts his receivers in too many difficult positions. He has a lot of talent around him that makes up for that, but once he gets paid he will have to make due with less. Nothing I saw last night tells me he is capable of that.