Coach Tuesday Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I’m really curious about their pro personnel evaluation process, including their own self-scouting - who is in charge of it, whether the coaches have input (and how much), etc. They have a really tough time getting it right at a variety of key positions (but not others, like cornerback). They need to figure out why and effing fix it. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 6 minutes ago, prissythecat said: is Saffold’s grade really low because he was emotionally exhausted this year ? It's very trying putting a up low 40s grade on PFF! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearNorth Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said: Image if we had a couple of all pro linemen how much Allen would destroy the league. We had one on the board, Creed Humphrey top rated center in the draft 1300 snaps in 2022, was drafted second round pick 63 in 2021. We drafted Boogie 2 spots earlier. I know they feel loyalty to Morse, but this is a head slapper. Makes you wonder about our scouting dept. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmonkillebrew Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 9 hours ago, Dick_Cheney said: Good lord, I knew it was bad but this is brutal. A testament to Allen and the rest of the offense for doing as much as they did in spite of this. Agree Dick. We need to add two starting caliber Linemen in UFA and draft some depth at G/C. Time for an overhaul. It's a train wreck and only a matter of time until this lack of investment in the line results in a serious injury to Allen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said: Honestly, if we walk away from this draft with less than 2 WR and 3 O-linemen, I will be very disappointed. And Hodgins looked great playing for the Giants. Honestly makes me wonder. You’ll be very disappointed again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said: Honestly, if we walk away from this draft with less than 2 WR and 3 O-linemen, I will be very disappointed. And Hodgins looked great playing for the Giants. Honestly makes me wonder. And everyone knew Hodgins looked good this year in preseason and deserved a roster spot over Kumerow. But special teams. And then Kumerow ends up missing half the season anyway. At least with Teller nobody really knew if he was good or not when we let him go. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearNorth Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 2 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said: And everyone knew Hodgins looked good this year in preseason and deserved a roster spot over Kumerow. But special teams. And then Kumerow ends up missing half the season anyway. At least with Teller nobody really knew if he was good or not when we let him go. Our special teams weren't even relevant against Cinci. You need to have an O-line that protects the QB, WR's that can win one-on-one's, and DB's that can cover. We had none of these, and Cinci was playing with backups at both CB spots and 3 of the O-LIne. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) The grades are pretty consistent with many posters' thoughts that the LG and RT positions need to be upgraded in a significant way. Saffold has no business being on the team at all. At best, Brown needs to be a backup/swing tackle. Even though Morse graded out reasonably well, due to his age and concussion history, the team needs to seriously consider making long term plans at the Center position too. The good news is that finding a solution at LG and RT should not break the bank as reinforcements can be found in free agency and the early-to-middle rounds of the draft. Additional prospects can also be found in the later rounds. However, the front office is going to need to do a better job in both pro and college scouting to avoid making Saffold-type errors again. If I were the one making the decisions, I would move Bates back to LG, where he played well in the past. Then bring in a solid veteran (not a castoff like Quisenberry) to play RT and invest a 1st or 2nd round draft pick on someone who can play RG (AND pick up other interior options in FA as well). Should also draft a couple more linemen in the middle/late rounds for competition/depth too. Edited January 27, 2023 by 2003Contenders Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCbillsfan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 24 minutes ago, BearNorth said: We had one on the board, Creed Humphrey top rated center in the draft 1300 snaps in 2022, was drafted second round pick 63 in 2021. We drafted Boogie 2 spots earlier. I know they feel loyalty to Morse, but this is a head slapper. Makes you wonder about our scouting dept. They could have drafted Humphrey and have him play guard for awhile. The Bills oline situation is so annoying. One dumb move after another. Hey let's sign an old broken down OL for one year for $6+ million. ***** 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdmoreRyno Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, 78thealltimegreat said: D. Dawkins: 73.5 R. Saffold: 43.7 M. Morse: 61.4 R. Bates: 61.8 S. Brown: 51.4 For reference a solid NFL starter has a 70 grade…a pro bowl player has an 80ish grade…an all pro has a high 80s to low 90s grade..Trent Williams has the highest at 93.7 Josh Allen had over 5000 yards of offense and 42 touchdowns and had a PFF grade of 91.6 the highest of any QB with this line which graded out 26th blocking for him. Posted about this Monday... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said: Image if we had a couple of all pro linemen how much Allen would destroy the league. We saw that in 2020 when Williams was playing for a contract and was solid at RT and Feliciano was still a heavyweight. Josh was 2nd in MVP voting and hit 69% of his pssses. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 10 hours ago, 78thealltimegreat said: D. Dawkins: 73.5 R. Saffold: 43.7 M. Morse: 61.4 R. Bates: 61.8 S. Brown: 51.4 For reference a solid NFL starter has a 70 grade…a pro bowl player has an 80ish grade…an all pro has a high 80s to low 90s grade..Trent Williams has the highest at 93.7 Josh Allen had over 5000 yards of offense and 42 touchdowns and had a PFF grade of 91.6 the highest of any QB with this line which graded out 26th blocking for him. Thanks for the post. This is what I’ve been saying: one good starter, two marginally acceptable starters (who really should be backups, including Morse at this stage of his career), 2 sub-replacement level players who amazingly continued to start all season long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Did Saffold’s grade factor in being exhausted and out of gas? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostbitmic Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Dawkins and Morse had one thing in common that held their grades back ,,, They both line up next to Saffold. Saffold is the weakest link and needs to be replaced, preferably by a 1st or 2nd round rookie. Brown needs to have some serious competition for his starting job as well. Time to protect Josh and replace the turnstyles. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostbite Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 WRT Teller, he's a mauler best suited for run blocking. The run heavy scheme in Clev fits his strengths perfectly. I'd still take him any day over what we have, just dont think he'd grade out as strongly here. Rd 1 we take best available IOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 3 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I don't think you can draft one at end of the 1st. Agreed. That is why I am open to trading. And actually older left tackles sliding into guard rather than going to RT isn't all that rare. Brandon Albert and Jason Peters being the two that spring straight to mind. It is generally what you do with guys who are struggling a little bit keeping themselves at their "tackle" weight and Dion fits into that. We need a reliable and guaranteed upgrade all along the line no doubt. But Dion is getting moved from LT to G it isn’t happening even though it would be ideal. On the Bills he’s going to play tackle next season 17 minutes ago, LabattBlue said: Did Saffold’s grade factor in being exhausted and out of gas? Needs to eat more Mexican next year to avoid running out of gas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearNorth Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, DCbillsfan said: They could have drafted Humphrey and have him play guard for awhile. The Bills oline situation is so annoying. One dumb move after another. Hey let's sign an old broken down OL for one year for $6+ million. ***** This makes me think that Bills need to look at how they are evaluating college OL. OL has been a constant need since Beane arrived. Pos Player TM 2022RK Dr Yr RD Pick Bills Pick Center Linderbaum,Tyler BLT 6 2022 1 25 Kair Elam Center Humphrey,Creed KC 1 2021 2 63 Boogie Basham Guard Meinerz,Quinn DEN 6 2021 3 99 Spencer Brown Guard Smith,Trey KC 11 2021 6 227 Damar Hamlin Guard Onwenu,Michael NE 4 2020 6 182 Tyler Bass Guard Cleveland,Ezra MN 9 2020 2 58 AJ Epenesa Tackle McGary,Kaleb ATL 4 2019 1 31 Ed Oliver [9th] 2022 Rank is from PFF Edited January 27, 2023 by BearNorth 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 11 hours ago, Airseven said: Stick with how bad the OL was - how Beane got duped by Saffold and how he paid/promoted Bates perhaps prematurely. This doesn’t need to always wind up a backhanded compliment (excuse?) for Allen. Why not? Allen's performance this season given the reality of the O line was nothing short of miraculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 3 hours ago, PatsFanNH said: I would love see the stats for the time they gave Allen to throw. Was it average of 4 seconds or 2 seconds etc. A lot of OLine look bad because some (not saying Allen) QBs take forever to throw the ball, while others look good, like TB, because the QB throws it in 2 seconds or less. The time to throw stat can be deeply misleading. Allen is a wizard at extending plays and adding seconds to that time. My guess is what you're looking for are pressures and I assume that this was included in the PFF grading. For perspective in the last game Allen was pressured on nearly half his drop backs. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 12 hours ago, Airseven said: Stick with how bad the OL was - how Beane got duped by Saffold and how he paid/promoted Bates perhaps prematurely. This doesn’t need to always wind up a backhanded compliment (excuse?) for Allen. Pretty sure you were trashing Beane when it looked like Bates might leave. Then again.. you're a broken record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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