Morse and Basham Out For Chicago Game

[HOUSE]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

Banged my head. Bad headache. Decoder is in your wallet.

Lol, very good 

[JerseyBills]

17 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

If Bates can go at center, we will be fine I actually like him a lot as a center.

And Ike should be back so we should be good.  Brown is really the biggest weakness imo. He's very inconsistent and was the reason Mia got the strip sack 

[Mr. WEO]

So how many Pro Bowlers does that leave us??

[BlazinBill]

Yeah my biggest concern right now after last weeks horrible tackling display against a team not known for running is dline. I'm just hoping Phillips can play,with being thin at DE as well. I do think Boogie is a complete liability so I'm not even sure he will be missed but AJ doesn't do such a good job with contain. The thought of him and Mike Love on the field as a tandem is scary - and not in a good way.

 

 I'm wondering if we play more 3 LB sets. I feel like Klein has been huge in situations in the past. 

 

With the Bears style of play and the weather I am choosing to billieve Frazier is going to put some unique personal groupings out there Saturday and will be more than prepared.

Edited December 23, 2022 by BlazinBill

[BlazinBill]

16 hours ago, wjag said:

Heard today that KC has the 3rd best OL as rated by PFF.  Buffalo is 28th...  ooof..

After they got blown up in the Superbowl - KC focused on their Online. I really hope we do the same this coming off-season. Can you imagine JA with a consistent pocket to pass from. 

[BlazinBill]

15 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

I think PFF ratings are to be taken with a box of Morton's (when it rains, it pours)

 

Consider:

Bills currently have the #4 offense on points (trailing Dallas by 9 points now), #2 for yards, #3 for Y/Play

Top-10 for pass Y/A, AY/A, NY/A

#8 for rush yards, #3 for rush Y/A

 

Does it pass the "logic test" that the Bills could achieve all that as an offense, even with Josh Allen being the Alien Creature we all know him to be, if our OL were actually 28th in the league?

 

I'll go with Greg Cosell, who uses the old-fashioned eyeball: our OL is average or a bit better than average, no more.  Josh Allen makes up for a lot of flaws.  But he doesn't allow for the Bills to have a top-10, even top-5 offense with a bottom-of-the-league line.

 

That, My Martian Friend, would be an "Earth Shattering Ka-Boom"

Gonna have to disagree here. While I understand the logic statement, I'm taking away your saying no way offense can be that good if the line is that bad. This is one of those rare occasions that logic looses and you just have to accept Aliens exist and there is more happening than Logic can explain 

 

Josh is that good- period. The dude is straight superman and constantly extends plays. He makes the offensive line look average because he evades and just uses pure will.

 

I feel like outside of Mahomes any QB you stick in this offense would look like Zac Wilson and Zac Wilson in this offense would be one of Mike Whites broken ribs

[SoCal Deek]

Is Basham out due to a serious bout of extreme apathy? 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

19 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

If Bates can go at center, we will be fine I actually like him a lot as a center.

But will they play him at center? I like him in the pivot too but so far this season they have been reluctant to move him there. Correct me if I am wrong even in Miami they did not move him to center when they were down to the third string. 

[Nextmanup]

20 hours ago, PetermansRedemption said:

Morse out hurts a lot. Guy is the lynchpin of the line. I think center has to be an extremely high off season priority. 

I would go so far to say that other than ALLEN, Morse being out hurts the team more than any single player.

 

I would MUCH rather have Morse than Von Miller, for example.

 

Well, maybe DIGGS too....that would be bad.

 

But we are going to have PROBLEMS ALL GAME LONG b/c of Morse's absence.

 

Watch!

 

 

[SCBills]

18 hours ago, wjag said:

Heard today that KC has the 3rd best OL as rated by PFF.  Buffalo is 28th...  ooof..

Its interesting because when we played them, Mahomes was under more pressure than Allen.  
 

Even without Von, we have a better DL, and they don’t have much outside Chris Jones, so I guess in a head to head, it evens out. 
 

That said … yea, love hearing how Mahomes doesn’t have a WR1 anymore and how Allen has Diggs, and Burrow has multiple guys, and same with Herbert … ok, cool … Mahomes has the best TE, perhaps ever, a heavily invested in OL a handful of WR2/3’s and the greatest offensive mind of the current era leading that team. 
 

How doesssss he do it!!??

[BuffaloBillsGospel2014]

3 hours ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

If I'm reading this right, it says you found your wallet, but there's no money in it.😱🤣🤣🤣

 

Dude come on, it says.... drink more OVALTINE! 

 

 

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, BlazinBill said:

Gonna have to disagree here. While I understand the logic statement, I'm taking away your saying no way offense can be that good if the line is that bad. This is one of those rare occasions that logic looses and you just have to accept Aliens exist and there is more happening than Logic can explain 

 

Josh is that good- period. The dude is straight superman and constantly extends plays. He makes the offensive line look average because he evades and just uses pure will.

 

I feel like outside of Mahomes any QB you stick in this offense would look like Zac Wilson and Zac Wilson in this offense would be one of Mike Whites broken ribs

 

I understand where you're coming from, but some counter points:

-1182 of the Bills rush yards are from ball carriers other than Allen, and clearly the OL is involved in those

-I can not find stats on how many of Josh's rush yards are designed QB runs, but it's not inconsiderable; contrary to what some think, he has not gained 706 rush yards entirely on broken play scrambles.  The OL blocks and breaks him lose on a number of them, or at least draws the defense off in another direction.

-On a number of key throws in games, Allen has had superb protection

-On watching all-22 film, it can be seen that on a number of passing plays where Allen extends and buys time, he had an option (or more than one option) underneath that would have gotten the ball out while the OL protection still held

-When Allen does extend plays or scramble, the OL continues to block for him, adjusting to where he has moved.

 

I believe @BarleyNY critiqued this stat and had a better source, but pro-football-reference gives the Bills the 6th most "pocket time" in the league at 2.5 seconds.  They define Pocket Time as "average time the QB had in the pocket between the snap and throwing the ball or pressure collapses the pocket, in seconds"

 

Football is, and will always be, a team game.  Allen is a special player, and regularly makes plays only 1 or 2 other guys can, but there is just no way Allen (or any footballer) creates an entire winning gamefull of plays all on his lonesome without help from the OL.

 

 

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

But will they play him at center? I like him in the pivot too but so far this season they have been reluctant to move him there. Correct me if I am wrong even in Miami they did not move him to center when they were down to the third string. 

 

Pretty sure, but not positive, that's not quite correct. 

 

Morse has missed 2 games entirely (1st Miami game and Detroit game) and parts of 2 others (Tennessee, Pittsburgh, and part of 2nd Miami).  Two of those games were 4th Q starter pulls - entire 4Q vs Tennessee and most of 4Q vs Pittsburgh, but Morse missed more of the game due to the injury that kept him out of Miami.

 

I believe vs. Tennessee, Van Roten took over for Morse at Center white Bates stayed at guard, and the results were not pretty.

Bates missed almost half the first Miami game himself (47% of the snaps) and Morse was out going into the game, which is why you saw a lot of Van Roten at center.  I don't remember if Van Roten played at C  going into the game, but for half the game there was no choice.

 

2nd Miami game, Bates was out going into the game, which is why you saw Van Roten at center. 

 

Pretty sure vs. Detroit, the other game Morse missed, when Bates was available, he played C and Van Roten guard.  I think that's the Bills preference, when both are available.

 

 

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

I would go so far to say that other than ALLEN, Morse being out hurts the team more than any single player.

 

I would MUCH rather have Morse than Von Miller, for example.

 

Well, maybe DIGGS too....that would be bad.

 

But we are going to have PROBLEMS ALL GAME LONG b/c of Morse's absence.

 

Watch!

 

You sound very definitive on this point - ALL CAPS

 

Morse missed the entire Detroit game.  I believe Bates played C and Van Roten G, but either way, Morse was out.  He's definitely one of our best OLmen and we'll miss him, but as far as PROBLEMS ALL GAME LONG, would you care to comment on the PROBLEMS you saw in the Detroit game where the Bills gained 163 yds on the ground and 253 yds passing, and explain how you feel they'll translate against the Bears?

 

Josh did have 1 fumble (on a scramble) and 1 INT (on a deflected pass, I believe).  No problems on the C-Q exchange.

 

Given your screen name, your apparent conviction that the "next man up" can not in fact do a credible job appears a bit ironic.

Edited December 23, 2022 by Beck Water

[Don Otreply]

On 12/22/2022 at 5:19 PM, Airseven said:

This is going to hurt in a tough weather game. Morse has been the stalwart. It seems there’s much “overlooking” going on this week…

Like clockwork as usual, 

[Dr. Who]

21 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

You sound very definitive on this point - ALL CAPS

 

Morse missed the entire Detroit game.  I believe Bates played C and Van Roten G, but either way, Morse was out.  He's definitely one of our best OLmen and we'll miss him, but as far as PROBLEMS ALL GAME LONG, would you care to comment on the PROBLEMS you saw in the Detroit game where the Bills gained 163 yds on the ground and 253 yds passing, and explain how you feel they'll translate against the Bears?

 

Josh did have 1 fumble (on a scramble) and 1 INT (on a deflected pass, I believe).  No problems on the C-Q exchange.

 

Given your screen name, your apparent conviction that the "next man up" can not in fact do a credible job appears a bit ironic.

@MrEpsYtown is the fella on this board who seems to know oline pretty well. He thinks Bates is a superior C and that is his natural position long term. Of course, if he's replacing Morse, you need someone to step in at G.