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All-22 Grades for Bills/Dolphins (The Athletic)


HappyDays
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5 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

I'll never understand the Saffold signing. Some fans thought this was a great move because of his name but there's a reason why the Titans were quick to dump him and that's because he's about done in this league.

 

Almost wondering if not letting Bates go to the Vikings was a mistake too.

 

Granted it's early, but aside from Dawkins and Morse there are still way too many question marks right now and even Spencer Brown looks to be headed down that dreaded Bills sophmore slump.

 

You can argue we've faced 3 great defensive lines so far to start the year but you still need to perform and time is going to run out soon if this oline can't get it together.

 

 

I totally agree that they have to get things together on the OL. But I have a lot of sympathy for them with how very little time they had in training camp playing together as a unit. With injuries and problems, there was very little time to gel

 

They will need more time to get it together. If they manage to do that. It's not a given.

 

3 hours ago, JohnNord said:


The offensive line was probably the reason the Bills lost the game on Sunday.  I know there were 3 backups in but they looked like trash.  I really think that this could be their undoing this season…but it seems like when all 5 starters are healthy and in the lineup, they do ok.  I’m hoping they can get their act together next week 

 

 

Not only were there three backups, but two of them were playing out of position.

 

 

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It is sad that some of these are not giving credit for the Miami defense for playing lights out.  They dominated that it did not matter whether our OL played well or not.  

 

The Bills are not a bad team..they had a bad day at the office...and in spite of that they were a play away from winning the game.   It happened last year and it will happen this year.  It is the NFL

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2 hours ago, ganesh said:

It is sad that some of these are not giving credit for the Miami defense for playing lights out.  They dominated that it did not matter whether our OL played well or not.  

 

The Bills are not a bad team..they had a bad day at the office...and in spite of that they were a play away from winning the game.   It happened last year and it will happen this year.  It is the NFL


I don’t think they did play lights out though. If it wasn’t for our own mistakes we would have had at least an additional 13 points (Josh bounce throw, Davis drop, Bass FG miss - this assuming Bass missed the extra points and deducting the safety as that wouldn’t have happened without the Davis drop IIRC). That would have taken us up to 30 excluding the Milano dropped pick six against their offense.

 

Also, I’ve heard some people say the Dolphins were great because they kept our offense on the field, dinking and dunking, and let them burn out. I don’t buy that for a moment - why be happy with keeping our strongest part of the team on the field for the longest amount of time? Surely you’d want quick turnovers and three & outs in order to face our depleted defense as much as possible?

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9 hours ago, gobills404 said:

In the full clip it looks more like Dawkins just got smoked

 

 

There was clearly confusion as to what the protection scheme was. That is where Mitch Morse really is missed, but yea Dion got beat. 

 

In terms of Devin that whole series was strange two runs with Moss leaving your best runner on the sideline then a pass from your own 14 and you take out Moss who is your best pass protecting back. Very odd. 

 

7 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

I'll never understand the Saffold signing. Some fans thought this was a great move because of his name but there's a reason why the Titans were quick to dump him and that's because he's about done in this league.

 

Almost wondering if not letting Bates go to the Vikings was a mistake too.

 

Granted it's early, but aside from Dawkins and Morse there are still way too many question marks right now and even Spencer Brown looks to be headed down that dreaded Bills sophmore slump.

 

You can argue we've faced 3 great defensive lines so far to start the year but you still need to perform and time is going to run out soon if this oline can't get it together.

 

It was the Bears not the Vikings. But I don't disagree otherwise. 

 

I criticised the Saffold signing from the off and while I understood bringing Bates back it was a lot of money basically gambling that the 6 decent games we saw at the end of last season from an until that point career backup was the sign of a breakout. 

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Three minor quibbles from me on Joe this week.

 

1. Elam was one of our best 5 players without a single shadow of a doubt to me. It may be one of those circumstances that he wasn't targeted much and so Joe doesn't give as much credit (a problem PFF's grades often have with corners guys don't throw at) but there was a reason Tua only targeted Elam twice. He had good coverage almost all day despite often drawing Hill as a responsibility. 

 

2. How can Josh Allen not be in our top 5 grades? Okay bad miss at the end to McKenzie game on the line and a mistake with the center at the end of the first half but he was literally freelancing on about 75% of our offensive snaps because the protection in front of him was so horrific. The number of plays where Josh could drop back, get through his progressions and fire was countable on your two hands. To produce as much offense as we did given that and no run game was a remarkable effort on his part. Even if we struggled in the redzone. 

 

3. D- is still too generous for Saffold. What comes after E? Give him that.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

 

Dawkins and Singletary both did horrible on this play. Forgive Dawkins sometimes cam be bad but usly does more good.

It was 8 pass rushers vs 7 blockers. You can’t blame the blockers when the outside pressure gets the sack. It’s 100% on the QB to recognize what’s happening and get the ball out.

 

The Dolphins timed the blitz perfectly. The DL head up on Dawkins slow plays it to give Holland that extra step needed.

 

I’m not sure Allen expected an all out blitz. They had 3 WRs in routes but everything was beyond the 1st down. Nothing quick. It’s almost like Miami knew the play and they’d be safe. Because you have Diggs, Crowder, and Davis all in 1v1. A completion and missed tackle is a TD.

 

Holland got there quick, no time for Allen to make a play after his drop. He got fooled pre snap. I guarantee Allen would take responsibility for that sack.

Edited by Buffalo_Stampede
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11 hours ago, whorlnut said:

Time to spend high picks on the oline. 

I think that's the plan with the need to stagger contracts. I think if Morse can't go at any time in the future, Bates is the best fit for center and I think they elevate Alec Anderson to play RG. I think he will be a good guard. I was hoping they'd stay at 25 this past draft and take Zion Johnson. I wonder how he's doing.

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11 hours ago, H2o said:

The bottom 5 are all OL. Shocking.

I wonder if it was a mistake to cut Ford. Anyone hear how he's doing in Arizona? That would be rich, the Bills struggling at guard after cutting two good guards in Wyatt and Ford. (Although I noticed I had a hard time writing the word "good" so soon after typing Ford's name.)

 

If Saffold continues his poor play, the Bills might consider putting Bates back at his more natural left guard position and put...uh... someone at right guard. 

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8 minutes ago, finn said:

I wonder if it was a mistake to cut Ford. Anyone hear how he's doing in Arizona? That would be rich, the Bills struggling at guard after cutting two good guards in Wyatt and Ford. (Although I noticed I had a hard time writing the word "good" so soon after typing Ford's name.)

 

If Saffold continues his poor play, the Bills might consider putting Bates back at his more natural left guard position and put...uh... someone at right guard. 

Ford is on IR. The reason he was traded is because he wasn't that good and his athletic profile did not fit what we were trying to do on offense. 

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3 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Holland got there quick, no time for Allen to make a play after his drop. He got fooled pre snap. I guarantee Allen would take responsibility for that sack.

 

Allen was half a second away from a big completion down field. He just needed Dawkins or Singletary to not whiff on their block. It's possible to beat an all out blitz without throwing a short hot route, if it wasn't then every team would always call an all out blitz on 3rd and long.

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17 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Allen was half a second away from a big completion down field. He just needed Dawkins or Singletary to not whiff on their block. It's possible to beat an all out blitz without throwing a short hot route, if it wasn't then every team would always call an all out blitz on 3rd and long.

Allen drifts over towards Holland in his drop because he thought the pressure was coming front side, which it was as well. It was everywhere. He drops right into Holland. A straight drop and he releases the ball.
 

You’re correct if they get a piece of Holland it’s a big play but it’s nearly impossible when it’s 8v7. They have to protect inside 1st. 

 

It is possible Allen thought it would be blocked up backside based on the OL sliding left and Allen also drifting left in his drop. He obviously thought the pressure would be in his face. 

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9 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

You’re correct if they get a piece of Holland it’s a big play but it’s nearly impossible when it’s 8v7. They have to protect inside 1st. 

 

It wasn't impossible... Dawkins is right there. Singletary also had a chance of getting a piece of him. They had all the blocking assignments ready to give Allen the 2.5 seconds he needed to load up and fire down field to an open receiver with no one in front of him. Allen recognized the all out blitz and the single coverage and had the right read. The IOL blocked their guys long enough despite not having the numbers. Spencer Brown got his guy. Dawson Knox executed his block perfectly. But Dawkins whiffed so the play was killed.

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12 hours ago, uninja said:


Big O was saying though that the center was totally tipping the snap count. DL was teeing off. They knew it was a pass play and literally timed the jump. Dawkins and Singletary got smoked, because their assignments were in the backfield before the ball even made it into Allen’s hands. 

 

I was thinking during the game that I can't remember a worse center performance than what Van Roten was pulling off, and questioning why is Bates not in at center and literally anybody else at guard, even Van Rotten where at least he isn't mishandling the ball every other snap.

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15 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

It wasn't impossible... Dawkins is right there. Singletary also had a chance of getting a piece of him. They had all the blocking assignments ready to give Allen the 2.5 seconds he needed to load up and fire down field to an open receiver with no one in front of him. Allen recognized the all out blitz and the single coverage and had the right read. The IOL blocked their guys long enough despite not having the numbers. Spencer Brown got his guy. Dawson Knox executed his block perfectly. But Dawkins whiffed so the play was killed.

Allen drops into Holland for whatever reason. Watch his feet. Takes the ball on the hash and ends up way left at the end of his drop. Allen’s drop alone gives him less time.

 

It’s a tough block for Dawkins and Singletary due to the numbers. 8v7, they have to peak inside 1st. As I said Allen doesn’t help them either dropping directly into Holland’s rush.

 

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The inability to evaluate and draft/hire O linemen has been a consistent problem for Beane since he got here.  It's weird because he's so good at everything else.  Maybe he needs someone on his staff to handle this area.  Or maybe he HAS someone on the staff for this area, and that person can't get it right.

 

Brown was AWFUL from the get-go on Sunday.  He was exposed over and over, and when Quessenberry replaced him I figured it was for poor play and not heat problems.  I think the Bills figure he's immense and so will make a good road-grader for the run game, and maybe that will work out, but what the Bills need is a really good pass-protect O line.  

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17 minutes ago, Utah John said:

The inability to evaluate and draft/hire O linemen has been a consistent problem for Beane since he got here.  It's weird because he's so good at everything else.  Maybe he needs someone on his staff to handle this area.  Or maybe he HAS someone on the staff for this area, and that person can't get it right.

 

Brown was AWFUL from the get-go on Sunday.  He was exposed over and over, and when Quessenberry replaced him I figured it was for poor play and not heat problems.  I think the Bills figure he's immense and so will make a good road-grader for the run game, and maybe that will work out, but what the Bills need is a really good pass-protect O line.  


I think Brown’s back is still messed up. He was messing with it during the Titans game and Quessenberry replaced him during that game as well at some point. 
 

He might be on a pitch count still and/or working his way back. His pass pro is still definitely undeveloped and needs work. Having Bates next to him (who also has pass pro issues) instead of an established vet like Willliams is probably also causing issues and breakdowns in communication. 


So much of OL is about working as a unit and weak links in the line make the entire line look bad. I think that Bates’s shortcomings last year were hidden because Morse and Dawkins are good, and made sure that Bates was doing the right thing. That may be impacted now that Bates is in a different spot and next to a pretty green right tackle who doesn’t see the rush as well.  

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