Josh's Competitive Fire

[Scott7975]

Josh is going to play his game. That is what makes him special. He will be fine. People really need to relax. He isn’t going to change. 

[eball]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I think a lot of his take off decisions are in the moment. I think trying to get him to overthink those moments would take away from who he is.

 

100% accurate IMO.  On Kyle Brandt's podcast this week Josh made the definitive statement in this regard:

 

"I play the game one way.  My way."

 

 

Edited September 15, 2022 by eball

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, eball said:

 

100% accurate IMO.  On Kyle Brandt's podcast this week Josh made the definitive statement in this regard:

 

"I play the game one way.  My way."

 

 

Yep. It would be better for my heart if he'd slide a bit more but I just don't think that is him. He will run scrambles and he will change plays to call his own number at the line if he thinks that is the right play. Nothing McDermott or Daboll or Dorsey tells him is gonna take that out of him. And I suspect if they did you wouldn't have the same guy. 

[eball]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. It would be better for my heart if he'd slide a bit more but I just don't think that is him. He will run scrambles and he will change plays to call his own number at the line if he thinks that is the right play. Nothing McDermott or Daboll or Dorsey tells him is gonna take that out of him. And I suspect if they did you wouldn't have the same guy. 

 

I think the only thing they (the coaches) want is for Josh to be "smart" with his body.  I know there is a lot of talk about cumulative hits and whatnot, but I do believe Josh will continue to get better at protecting himself while still doing what he believes he needs to do to win football games.

 

[Scott7975]

8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. It would be better for my heart if he'd slide a bit more but I just don't think that is him. He will run scrambles and he will change plays to call his own number at the line if he thinks that is the right play. Nothing McDermott or Daboll or Dorsey tells him is gonna take that out of him. And I suspect if they did you wouldn't have the same guy. 

he did also say in that podcast that the one run he did slide but a touch late and he didn’t really get hit that play. 

[GoBills808]

8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. It would be better for my heart if he'd slide a bit more but I just don't think that is him. He will run scrambles and he will change plays to call his own number at the line if he thinks that is the right play. Nothing McDermott or Daboll or Dorsey tells him is gonna take that out of him. And I suspect if they did you wouldn't have the same guy. 

I think that's silly. He can change things about his game and still be the same dominant player, just with a longer career.

 

The guy redid his entire throwing motion. He's not just some big armed idiot savant out there at QB.

[GunnerBill]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

I think that's silly. He can change things about his game and still be the same dominant player, just with a longer career.

 

The guy redid his entire throwing motion. He's not just some big armed idiot savant out there at QB.

 

No but I don't think you are ever gonna take the dog out of him. If he thinks the way to get this first down is me calling my own number he is going to call his own number. 

[Mikie's Bills]

 

Starting to get more and more attention in the national media.

 

I think in the regular season they should do away with the designed runs. We can go without those 4-5 plays a game where it is basically a given he's going to get hit. Save that for the playoffs.

 

The scrambles I'm fine with unless they're up by 2-3 scores in the 4th (like they were in the first game). He's going to do this regardless so there's no point in trying to stop it. All we can do is hope he does his best to avoid big unnecessary hits as much as possible.

[Jauronimo]

The threat of Josh running should not be taken off the table.  He needs to be smarter about when and where that occurs and Dorsey can help.  

 

Josh should take off when there is room to run or when hes under pressure.  He needs to slide early or get out of bounds.

 

Josh keeps the ball and runs up the middle every time an RPO is called and winds up in heavy traffic where the big guys are.  Dorsey should stop calling RPOs and designed QB runs until the games are win or go home.

 

If Josh wants to stiff arm CBs and get to the boundary, no problem, but maybe lets not go one on one with Bobby Wagner for a week 1 TD when we're dominating game play.  Josh should never be calling his own number when up by 3 scores and his defense dominating*. 

 

And no more jumping over people.

 

*Unless Mahomes is watching from the sideline and its the post season.

[Alphadawg7]

3 hours ago, The Gravytrain said:

Obviously, Josh's competitive drive is what separates him from most other QBs and players in the league for that matter. That desire to win at no cost is the great intangible that teams can't defend against. As Josh even states, he'll do anything for his team to keep a drive going, score or win. Hurdle players, truck players or even drag a pile. 

 

If, as Josh says, he'll do anything to help the team win. Shouldn't that be running the ball less to help the team down the road? Obviously he does his team no good on the sidelines. There's 16 games left and if he keeps running the way he does, he's putting his team at risk.

 

So the big question, if Josh really wants to stick to his approach and really help the team, shouldn't he be running much less to help his team in the long run. I say this as a lifelong fan going back to the Ferguson days. Like a lot us, I've seen the dark days and am always worried something bad is going to happen. 

 

It's a bit of a conundrum, and ultimately Josh is going to do what he's going to do, but wouldn't really be helping the team by not putting himself at risk? 

 

 

No.

[Solomon Grundy]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

Just have to let him play his game. Honestly, the hits in the pocket can be a lot worse because you often are blindsided and can't protect yourself.

It kinds of irks me about the Cam comparisons. I distinctly remember all of the late hits Cam used to take from defensive players after throwing the ball from the pocket. Panthers sent letters to the league office complaining about it. Like Josh said, sometimes he do what he does is based on the flow of the game. He's a smart guy. 

[MJS]

2 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

It kinds of irks me about the Cam comparisons. I distinctly remember all of the late hits Cam used to take from defensive players after throwing the ball from the pocket. Panthers sent letters to the league office complaining about it. Like Josh said, sometimes he do what he does is based on the flow of the game. He's a smart guy. 

Yes. Cam was beaten up in the pocket and on roll outs. I'm sure the hits he took while running didn't help, but I only remember the vicious hits he took as a QB, not as a runner.

[GunnerBill]

I just put it in the shoutbox but will repeat here.... Josh was credited with 10 runs on Thursday. Was actually 9 and a kneel down. 

 

The remaining 9 broke down as:

 

5 scrambles

3 read option plays that Josh kept

1 called QB run

 

The called QB run came with the Bills up 14, so that clearly has to go. Unnecessary. The 3 read option plays were on the first two drives of the second half (both touchdown drives). One of which was in the redzone (and the Rams played it well) another of which was the one where he had one leg up in the air as he was being hit - ugly looking play.

 

I think the coaching staff can help by dialling down the read option plays outside of the redzone (save for the really big games). Josh can help by not scrambling and diving into two tacklers as he did on that final run in the 4th quarter when the team is already up 21. That was a designed pass play - a waggle - the Rams defended it well, took the receiver away and Josh has to know the scoreboard there and just throw that into the stand and be happy to punt the ball. That is where his competitiveness gets him in trouble. 

[Bruffalo]

Allen, the Bills' sports scientists, and the coaching staff know a lot better about Allen's exposure to taking hits than you do.

 

This post is barely a notch above the average postgame WGR call, but only because I can't hear you burping as you type it.  

 

 

[Scott7975]

18 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I just put it in the shoutbox but will repeat here.... Josh was credited with 10 runs on Thursday. Was actually 9 and a kneel down. 

 

The remaining 9 broke down as:

 

5 scrambles

3 read option plays that Josh kept

1 called QB run

 

The called QB run came with the Bills up 14, so that clearly has to go. Unnecessary. The 3 read option plays were on the first two drives of the second half (both touchdown drives). One of which was in the redzone (and the Rams played it well) another of which was the one where he had one leg up in the air as he was being hit - ugly looking play.

 

I think the coaching staff can help by dialling down the read option plays outside of the redzone (save for the really big games). Josh can help by not scrambling and diving into two tacklers as he did on that final run in the 4th quarter when the team is already up 21. That was a designed pass play - a waggle - the Rams defended it well, took the receiver away and Josh has to know the scoreboard there and just throw that into the stand and be happy to punt the ball. That is where his competitiveness gets him in trouble. 

 

This was the play Josh was referring to in the podcast.  He said that it was a playaction pass and Gabe got open late but he already tucked the ball to run. He said that he went to slide but was late on it and he didn't really get hit.  Josh also said that he would rather take a sack there then throw the ball away because the goal was to keep the clock running.  That is what his mindset is.  

Edited September 15, 2022 by Scott7975

[Ga boy]

5 hours ago, Rampage said:

I think there’s a lot of overreaction to the first game of the season, in front of the world on Thursday night against the champs.

 

Josh’s adrenaline was pumping all night and he was a freight train because of it. He’s still going to run, that’s what makes him so lethal, but I expect the type of runs he makes and hits he takes will be minimized compared to what we saw last week.

I totally agree.  Nobody was/is more competitive than Tommy boy, but he knew the best way to help his team was to minimize hits.  Yes he gets the whiner trophy, but he has several SB trophies too.  Go Bills 🏈🦬

[GunnerBill]

31 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

This was the play Josh was referring to in the podcast.  He said that it was a playaction pass and Gabe got open late but he already tucked the ball to run. He said that he went to slide but was late on it and he didn't really get hit.  Josh also said that he would rather take a sack there then throw the ball away because the goal was to keep the clock running.  That is what his mindset is.  

 

It is a fair point about the time but we were up 21 with 5 minutes to play. If you are thinking abiut time (and McDermott did say they told the offense before that drive time mattered more than yards) then take the sack. Take the loss of yardage. Give yourself up. 

 

But Josh isn't gonna give up on plays. That is just who he is. 

 

I don't love the idea that the coaching staff is now considering taking any movement plays off the board in that situation for fear that Josh decides to run though. They are often good plays when defenses are loading up to stop you running down their throat at the end of games.

1 hour ago, MJS said:

Yes. Cam was beaten up in the pocket and on roll outs. I'm sure the hits he took while running didn't help, but I only remember the vicious hits he took as a QB, not as a runner.

 

Cam did not get the protection he deserved from refs. Why that was is a whole other debate.

[uninja]

The Josh Allen Experience:

"Oh ***** what's he doing? *****! Be careful! Holy ***** that was awesome...***** is he ok...? He's ok! That was sick don't do it again!".

[Malazan]

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Yes, he needs to take fewer hits.

 

This is the NFL. It adds up.

Curious, who took more hits last season, Allen or Burrow?

Edited September 15, 2022 by Malazan

[gobills404]

If it’s 3rd/4th and short or on the goal line then I’m fine with him doing what it takes to pick the yards necessary. Other than that I hope he slides every single time.