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Here is my random if there is an expansion...  if we were forced to add more.  Idk bored

NFC West (Pacific) NFC North (Central) NFC East (Atlantic)
Seattle Seahawks Minnesota Vikings New York Giants
San Francisco 49ers Green Bay Packers Philadelphia Eagles
LA Rams Chicago Bears Baltimore Ravens
San Diego Chargers Detroit Lions Washington Commanders
Las Vegas Raiders Indianapolis Colts Carolina Panthers
Arizona Cardinals Cincinnati Bengals Atlanta Falcons

 

AFC South (Gulf) AFC Middle (Plains) AFC North (Northeast)
Houston Texans Denver Broncos Montreal Voyageurs
Mexico City Lobos Kansas City Chiefs New England Patriots
Jacksonville Jaguars Dallas Cowboys Buffalo Bills
Miami Dolphins Tennessee Titians New York Jets
Tampa Bay Buccaneers St Louis Spirit/Arches Cleveland Browns
New Orleans Saints San Antonio Stallions Pittsburg Steelers

 

My thought Process on new teams:

San Diego goes home so both "LA" teams can be in same division.

Mexico City Makes the most sense.  Large Market.  Go with Lobos as a Spanish name that can connect with local animal.

St Louis gets a team back after the lawsuit.  Call it Spirit after the plane or arches for being the gateway to the west.

San Antonio Stallions.  Everyone always says this is the next most likely place to get a team.  The heck with Jerry.  Why Stallions?  Did you know almost every team in there town starts with an S?

Montreal Voyageurs  Canada gets a team and isn't Toronto bc of the Bills or Vancouver bc of the Seahawks.  The name honors the French side and them being a place for explorer in colonial times.

 

Why separated this way?

Taking the NBA technique of keeping divisions close and similar lifestyles by area.  Want the people of the area to gain a passion for their divisions and hatred/rivalries with those close.

 

How Schedule would work?

Play the people in your division twice.  Then another division once.  That means you would play team once every 5 years.

 

Playoffs?

Top from each division and 4 wildcards for each side.  Only top record on you conference gets a bye

 

Sorry was bored

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9 hours ago, wjag said:

My sometimes outside the box, sometimes far fetched, okay things I would really like to see,  NFL prognostications:

 

4. Seattle will have the first pick in the 2023 draft

 

very smart.  

 

Follow up question:  they probably wont need to Tank to get there (especially in that Division), but with no QB on the team, they will have strong motive.  So, will they Tank?

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3 hours ago, Don Otreply said:

You are right it is going to happen, but there are already a bunch of, shall we say, not good teams, consisting of not good players, so who the heck is going to be playing on these new teams? Yes I already know the answer, more not very good players, oh well…,

It occurred to me when I was reading GunnerBill's comment on 36 teams.

 

I think this is why we see the free proliferation in QBs who are not prototypical pocket passers.  Because those are really really hard to find / develop.

 

There are plenty of bodies to fill 36 or 40 NFL teams, outside of QBs.  So if we cant grow more QBs, then lets morph the position (and fan expectations) to fit what we Do have.

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3 hours ago, Zerovoltz said:

One of my favorite topics.....

 

The NFL will NOT expand anytime soon.

 

The reason why is TV dollars.  

 

TV Ratings for NFL football games is pretty much the same in NFL markets as it is in NON NFL Markets.  The NFL has reached a point where adding teams does NOT ADD TV Viewers....so if you are one of 32 NFL owners...you have zero incentive to split the same TV contract money with more owners...it's a 32 piece pie right  now...the pie doesn't get bigger with more teams....no reason to split the same pie with 34 or 36 or 40 owners.

 

The same 32 owners are interested in expanding TV viewership in markets outside the US.  There are a few ways they could do that without expansion.

 

As mentioned..move an existing team...or two, to new markets outside the US....Jacksonville being the obvious one, to move to London.  There are quite a few legal hurdles to making that happen...not as simple as just moving the team...but if they could work that out...you get a ton more new TV eyes and money....and split with the same 32 clubs.  You might move a team to Mexico city or to Toronto and pick up some more TV dollars that way...but they'd probably be good with simply Jax to London....and NO domestic expansion.  Moving a team from one town to another is less likely now that teams can't point to LA is this vast open market...teams will be compelled to stay where they are....in general..saw some posts about Washington to Virgina...KC from Missouri to Kansas...those aren't "moves" they would still be in the exact same markets they are already in.

Two counter points, in favor of expansion:

 

1) more teams means more games.  More televised games.  So maybe the ratings wont change, but we'll get that TV money more times

 

2) gambling.  As the NFL gambling revenue stream increases, that will be the next frontier.  Not TV $$.  More games to bet on = mo munny, mo munny, mo munny

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4 hours ago, Zerovoltz said:

 

 

....and if you wanted to encourage competing, and discourage tanking.....all you need to do is reverse the draft order starting at pick 18.  18 is the BEST team that missed the playoffs...have that team draft first...and then 17, go 2nd and so on..so that the worst team ends up with the 18th pick.  You have every reason to go for it to the end because your reward for trying hard is the first pick.  Tanking gets you nothing.....want a higher pick?  Try and make the playoffs!  

 

This is an even worse idea than expansion!

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12 hours ago, MPL said:

Here's a bold prediction...

 

The NFL and the USFL will form a Premier League style alliance and every year, the worst NFL teams will get demoted to the USFL and the best USFL teams will get promoted to the NFL. 

This is honestly what I hope for.

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4 hours ago, maddenboy said:

Two counter points, in favor of expansion:

 

1) more teams means more games.  More televised games.  So maybe the ratings wont change, but we'll get that TV money more times

 

2) gambling.  As the NFL gambling revenue stream increases, that will be the next frontier.  Not TV $$.  More games to bet on = mo munny, mo munny, mo munny

 

On point 1.......the only way they could squeeze more TV money out of the current situation is if they started to have Saturday, and Tuesday games..to go with Sunday,  Monday and Thursday games...that would be new time slots not currently occupied by NFL games and therefore new spots where networks could sell commercial time....the NFLPA would object....

 

On point 2..... I think you might have something there but we'd all need to see a breakdown of how much gambling revenue each team generates...VS how much more you'd get if you added a couple teams...that would be interesting, and if the pie was made larger...that could be an impetus to expand.  

 

I wouldn't mind expansion to a few more teams....I only argue against it from an owner view point..as a fan, I'd love London, Toronto, and two more domestic teams added.

 

Going off the idea the domestic TV dollars dont get better...it doens't have to be the biggest TV markets..but probably would be.

 

As others have mentioned....San Antonio...has long been trying to get a team and deserve it...it's a good NFL market.

 

I'd put the other team in Portland or Salt Lake City.....with Portland being the preferred destination...but those poeple probalby have no appetite for publicly financing a stadium.  

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15 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

In what sense? More players coming out early? 

I suppose. Perhaps even earlier departures (sophs & freshmen leaving school)?  Four more teams is a 12 1/2% increase and this would seem to have some impact on the overall talent pool, no?

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I would love to see the Chargers go back to San Diego the LA Chargers just doesn't sound right & i hate it for the fans that were left with out a team especially seeing as the Bills were always talked about as being that team .

 

I can't even imagine what it would be like to see the Bills in a different city that would RIP my heart out being a life long Bills fan so i feel for those folks in San Diego .

 

I hope there are no more additions as far as expansion teams because right now every thing is going good even with the thoughts of the schedules going to 18 games i just think that the NFL could go the way of MLB & Nascar if they start saturating fans with to much football .

 

If it ain't broke don't fix it but the NFL greed will more than likely over rule that sentiment .

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12 hours ago, Zerovoltz said:

The NFL will NOT expand anytime soon.

 

The reason why is TV dollars.  

 

TV Ratings for NFL football games is pretty much the same in NFL markets as it is in NON NFL Markets.  The NFL has reached a point where adding teams does NOT ADD TV Viewers....so if you are one of 32 NFL owners...you have zero incentive to split the same TV contract money with more owners...it's a 32 piece pie right  now...the pie doesn't get bigger with more teams....no reason to split the same pie with 34 or 36 or 40 owners.

 

The NFL wants more games / longer season and NFLPA objects but one way to do it and expand market is to add teams and byes.  By adding byes players get more rest during season and the NFL can counteract the holes caused by this by having more games playing with extra teams.   NFL will look for places to put smaller stadiums which will not be difficult to sell PSLs, box seats and other more expensive add-ons. 

 

Teams, even bad teams like Jacksonville and WTF Commandos, generate fan gear sales and while there are fans as an example in San Antonio who buy gear from teams which already exist fans tend to buy more gear if a local team and more gear is available in local shops if there is a local team.  This was seen when NFL returned to LA (not great for attending parades but lots of Rams gear sold) and Baltimore.

 

The biggest issue is not more teams but how to expand seasons for owners. They do not want to expand before Labor Day due to issue in past due to sales/ratings previous years that weekend but that may be less of a factor now with additional ways to watch games when traveling especially if they go to mobile games available.  Part of the issue with expansion of season is that if season starts earlier some stadiums (i.e. Florida) are unbearably hot and weather gets worse in North further into winter you go and dome does not solve all of those problems like parking and roads.

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16 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

Unless of course the sue the owner of the Rams for deception like city of St Louis did.

Highly unlikely given that it was the Chargers and the league that initiated the action leading to the move and a shared stadium.  From everything I read at the time, the Rams weren't excited about sharing the market with another team and had to be convinced by the league.

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53 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

The NFL wants more games / longer season and NFLPA objects but one way to do it and expand market is to add teams and byes.  By adding byes players get more rest during season and the NFL can counteract the holes caused by this by having more games playing with extra teams.   NFL will look for places to put smaller stadiums which will not be difficult to sell PSLs, box seats and other more expensive add-ons. 

 

Teams, even bad teams like Jacksonville and WTF Commandos, generate fan gear sales and while there are fans as an example in San Antonio who buy gear from teams which already exist fans tend to buy more gear if a local team and more gear is available in local shops if there is a local team.  This was seen when NFL returned to LA (not great for attending parades but lots of Rams gear sold) and Baltimore.

 

The biggest issue is not more teams but how to expand seasons for owners. They do not want to expand before Labor Day due to issue in past due to sales/ratings previous years that weekend but that may be less of a factor now with additional ways to watch games when traveling especially if they go to mobile games available.  Part of the issue with expansion of season is that if season starts earlier some stadiums (i.e. Florida) are unbearably hot and weather gets worse in North further into winter you go and dome does not solve all of those problems like parking and roads.

 

I guess you would have to (Im sure the NFL owners have calculations) on what the value of a new 'brand' within the NFL is worth for the collective.  How much an expansion fee would net each owner.  How much in the way of free public money will be given to the league for a new stadium.  

Zerovolt does have a very strong point though about a likely reluctance to water down that sweet television money pool.  

 

I do think there has got to be appetite to tap new frontiers to bolster their footprint.  The USA frontier is probably fairly maxed out from a market standpoint and putting a team in San Antonio or Portland probably will not have a huge correlation to increasing domestic TV deals.  The focus would likely be more on delivery/logistics/technology as opposed to putting teams in US markets.

 

But a team in Canada or the UK could be a lot of new eyeballs on new telecom companies.  I do know that Canada already consumes a good deal of the NFL, but a home team would take it to another level IMO, and with 1 team, most of Canada would accept it as they do the Blue Jays.  As mentioned, I could see Cincinnati moving to London is Mike Brown passes away coinciding with their lease.  Khan would buy them and sell the Jaguars to some other billionaire.  Not sure how that would work out logistically.  

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9 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

The NFL wants more games / longer season and NFLPA objects but one way to do it and expand market is to add teams and byes.  By adding byes players get more rest during season and the NFL can counteract the holes caused by this by having more games playing with extra teams.   NFL will look for places to put smaller stadiums which will not be difficult to sell PSLs, box seats and other more expensive add-ons. 

 

Teams, even bad teams like Jacksonville and WTF Commandos, generate fan gear sales and while there are fans as an example in San Antonio who buy gear from teams which already exist fans tend to buy more gear if a local team and more gear is available in local shops if there is a local team.  This was seen when NFL returned to LA (not great for attending parades but lots of Rams gear sold) and Baltimore.

 

The biggest issue is not more teams but how to expand seasons for owners. They do not want to expand before Labor Day due to issue in past due to sales/ratings previous years that weekend but that may be less of a factor now with additional ways to watch games when traveling especially if they go to mobile games available.  Part of the issue with expansion of season is that if season starts earlier some stadiums (i.e. Florida) are unbearably hot and weather gets worse in North further into winter you go and dome does not solve all of those problems like parking and roads.

 

I disagree with this....the TV money is where most of the revenue comes from......I stand by my point...the ratings are already just as stong in NON NFL markets as they are in NFL markets...you can not get more eyes on TV's by expansion....all that does is bring on more owners that have to split the same TV money pie.  Any revenues generated by the extras like merch etc...is dwarfed by the TV deals.  Unless you are talking about making that TV pie a big enough pie that the current owners slices are bigger than what they already get..they aren't gonig to be interested.

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13 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

I suppose. Perhaps even earlier departures (sophs & freshmen leaving school)?  Four more teams is a 12 1/2% increase and this would seem to have some impact on the overall talent pool, no?

 

But…..half of them would be leaving Alabama, and a quarter from OSU, so who really cares?        :)

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On 4/11/2022 at 11:57 PM, Mr Wild said:

Here is my random if there is an expansion...  if we were forced to add more.  Idk bored

NFC West (Pacific) NFC North (Central) NFC East (Atlantic)
Seattle Seahawks Minnesota Vikings New York Giants
San Francisco 49ers Green Bay Packers Philadelphia Eagles
LA Rams Chicago Bears Baltimore Ravens
San Diego Chargers Detroit Lions Washington Commanders
Las Vegas Raiders Indianapolis Colts Carolina Panthers
Arizona Cardinals Cincinnati Bengals Atlanta Falcons

 

AFC South (Gulf) AFC Middle (Plains) AFC North (Northeast)
Houston Texans Denver Broncos Montreal Voyageurs
Mexico City Lobos Kansas City Chiefs New England Patriots
Jacksonville Jaguars Dallas Cowboys Buffalo Bills
Miami Dolphins Tennessee Titians New York Jets
Tampa Bay Buccaneers St Louis Spirit/Arches Cleveland Browns
New Orleans Saints San Antonio Stallions Pittsburg Steelers

 

My thought Process on new teams:

San Diego goes home so both "LA" teams can be in same division.

Mexico City Makes the most sense.  Large Market.  Go with Lobos as a Spanish name that can connect with local animal.

St Louis gets a team back after the lawsuit.  Call it Spirit after the plane or arches for being the gateway to the west.

San Antonio Stallions.  Everyone always says this is the next most likely place to get a team.  The heck with Jerry.  Why Stallions?  Did you know almost every team in there town starts with an S?

Montreal Voyageurs  Canada gets a team and isn't Toronto bc of the Bills or Vancouver bc of the Seahawks.  The name honors the French side and them being a place for explorer in colonial times.

 

Why separated this way?

Taking the NBA technique of keeping divisions close and similar lifestyles by area.  Want the people of the area to gain a passion for their divisions and hatred/rivalries with those close.

 

How Schedule would work?

Play the people in your division twice.  Then another division once.  That means you would play team once every 5 years.

 

Playoffs?

Top from each division and 4 wildcards for each side.  Only top record on you conference gets a bye

 

Sorry was bored

 

The Cowboys won't leave the NFCE even though they are in Texas. The rivalries with those three teams are really strong. The league will also keep the Steelers and Ravens in the same division.  That has probably been the best rivalry in the NFL over the last 20 years or so.

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9 hours ago, Greg S said:

 

The Cowboys won't leave the NFCE even though they are in Texas. The rivalries with those three teams are really strong. The league will also keep the Steelers and Ravens in the same division.  That has probably been the best rivalry in the NFL over the last 20 years or so.

 

Yea I more or less ignored rivalries like that bc new ones will form.  I think especially in the new "Frontier" division.  All Midwest teams that went with manifest destiny.  All their names are associated with the wild west. Minus Titans but they came from Houston so close enough? 

 

My arguement for the Ravens steelers is remember when 15 years ago that was Colts Patriots and Steelers Patriots?  It was must watch when Brady big Ben and Manning were facing.  Does anyone care now if the Pats and Colts play?  Times change.

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On 4/11/2022 at 6:42 PM, MiltonWaddams said:

Elon Musk has entered the conversation.

There is a 0% chance that Vancouver or Montreal ever get an NFL franchise. Vancouver is way too close to Seattle and makes up a massive share of their ticket sales and merchandise sales. It’s very similar to what Toronto has with the Bills. Montreal is a great hockey market, but proved it’s lack of value in supporting other major league sports with the Expos. I’m not sure if Canadian expansion is something we will see in our lifetime. Every person on this board should hope the Toronto never sniffs an NFL franchise. That’s a lot of money coming in to Buffalo every Sunday.

 

Montreal supported the Expos until the 94 strike and then owners trading the stars away. I saw my first game at Jerry Parc and then they moved to Olympic stadium which sucked. Give them decent owners and stadium MLB will be back

 

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