Bills vs Pats: “pound for pound” teams analysis

[78thealltimegreat]

 One other thing about the Pats they have had an incredibly favorable schedule as all their “hard” opponents have been at home.

Other then San Diego and no one knows what team shows up week to week there. They’ve played every major opponent in Foxboro. 

 This is really their first major road test of the entire season.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

18 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Nah mate. Tyler Bass is money. He is the only starting kicker in the league to be 100% on PATs. He and Folk have both missed 3 FGs (all long range), but Bass-o-matic has the edge on PATs.

oh please don’t…

[Sharky7337]

19 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Here we are ! After this last Pats win, i want to compare the Bills and the Pats in every aspect and see what you think about.

 

- HC: pats

- QB: Bills

- RB: pats (with Brida maybe even)

- OL: pats

- DL: bills

- WR corps: Bills

- CORNERS & SAFETIES: Bills

- KICKER: Bills

- SP TEAM: even ?

 

Maybe i forgot to consider some other aspect, if so feel free to add or correct me. That’s the way i see things in this next matchup. To me, the most important thing McDermott and Daboll have to do, is to find a way to give Josh more time to throw and involve Knox much more, because to me Knox is not at Gronk or Kelce level, but to me is a very good TE. 

 

Corners are def pats....

Rbs with Breida still Pats by a mile

DL Pats - barmore is a beast

[Jauronimo]

One thing is certain, Frazier will have the perfect game plan to stop K'Neal Harry and Agholor even if it means giving up 300 yards rushing.

[Beerball]

19 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

 

 

but the question I have is both D weakness is the run. The Pats will stick with it, will the Bills?  Today was an example how bad the Pats run D can be. 

Shriley you jest!

[P Riv]

16 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Dude, it’s “on you” to make a good argument and state it clearly.  If your argument is that their LBs have been playing lights-out this season and have a lot of experience in this system, that’s fine - but that’s not what you said (or reiterated above, in the form of “all the hardware on their fingers” - as someone on the SB years Steelers said “take those off and put them on the shelf, boys, they won’t help us this year”)

 

AS far as “number one scoring defense”, the Patriots are allowing an average of 15.3 PPG after today.  The Bills are allowing an average of 15.2 PPG.  🤷‍♂️

 

I’m puzzled by the reference to “individual stats”, since I did not mention individual stats.  Is this a pure straw man, or are you responding to someone else without the extra work of quoting them?

 

Defensive PPG, unless I'm missing something: https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/team-stats?season=2021&category=defense

Their Defense has been outstanding the last 2 months, they have players with fat resume's, lots of hardware, etc. that have been leading the way.  What I stated above involves a fair amount of implied information that anyone watching the sport and knowledgeable would acknowledge, rather than ask for it to be stated.... So dude, that part is "on you".   This is overly common on message boards, I prefer face to face over wings and beers.  

Cheers

[FilthyBeast]

19 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Here we are ! After this last Pats win, i want to compare the Bills and the Pats in every aspect and see what you think about.

 

- HC: pats

- QB: Bills

- RB: pats (with Brida maybe even)

- OL: pats

- DL: bills

- WR corps: Bills

- CORNERS & SAFETIES: Bills

- KICKER: Bills

- SP TEAM: even ?

 

Maybe i forgot to consider some other aspect, if so feel free to add or correct me. That’s the way i see things in this next matchup. To me, the most important thing McDermott and Daboll have to do, is to find a way to give Josh more time to throw and involve Knox much more, because to me Knox is not at Gronk or Kelce level, but to me is a very good TE. 

 

 

My disagreements:

 

QB - this is a push at best right now based on Jones play and stats during the 6 game win streak vs. Allen. Obviously if Allen can find consistency the rest of the season it's an advantage back to him.

DL - this is Pats easily if anything because they get actual sacks and in bunches.

DB/S - probably a push now with White out. Jackson is a star there and their safeties are nasty too.

K - I'd go with Folk because of his resume until Bass hits some big kicks to win a game which may have to happen in the next few weeks.

ST - Pats - another situation I'm concerned about coming up with our problems at kick returner.

 

This Pats team is just very strong across the board especially in the areas the Bills have the biggest weaknessess in in the trenches.

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

6 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

QB - this is a push at best right now

TBD : I bet FilthyBeast can't post anything that tops his past ridiculous, trolling, garbage!

 

FilthyBeast : Hold my beer...

Edited November 29, 2021 by HereComesTheReignAgain

[Italian Bills]

44 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

My disagreements:

 

QB - this is a push at best right now based on Jones play and stats during the 6 game win streak vs. Allen. Obviously if Allen can find consistency the rest of the season it's an advantage back to him.

DL - this is Pats easily if anything because they get actual sacks and in bunches.

DB/S - probably a push now with White out. Jackson is a star there and their safeties are nasty too.

K - I'd go with Folk because of his resume until Bass hits some big kicks to win a game which may have to happen in the next few weeks.

ST - Pats - another situation I'm concerned about coming up with our problems at kick returner.

 

This Pats team is just very strong across the board especially in the areas the Bills have the biggest weaknessess in in the trenches.

Ok… based on your lines it seem it will be a massacre… something like 40-10/17 Pats. 

[Hebert19]

20 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Over what time frame?

 

This season, he’s attempted 5 more FG than Bass.  He’s missed 2 vs 3 for Bass, giving him a slightly higher FG% at present.

But then, he’s 26 of 30 on XP attempts whereas so far so good, Bass is 34 of 34 on XPs 

 

I wouldn’t mind calling it a push

Bass has 3 misses.  2 from 50 plus and one from 49. All in bad weather/wind

[Scott7975]

21 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

CB/Safety is even maybe Pats with your top CB out.

 

Kicker — again I’d go even Folk been amazing..

 

RB — Pats even w Brieda.

 

but the question I have is both D weakness is the run. The Pats will stick with it, will the Bills?  Today was an example how bad the Pats run D can be. 

 

There is a difference of sticking with the run when running is being effective and when its not.  If you're down two scores and running the football has left you in third and long all day... Do you still stick with the run?  I think not.

[SCBills]

20 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I mean isn't that just that the Pats have asked him to try more? Basically they are both guaranteed from inside the 50. Folk has been a top 5 kicker this year. Bass has been the best in the NFL. 

 

The oline isn't "edge" Patriots. That is a landslide Patriots. 

 

Can we wait to see how they look with Brown back, or do we need to judge our OL missing it’s starting LG and RT?

 

Feliciano is a slight upgrade, but Brown is massive in what he does for two positions.  
 

HC - Pats

 

QB - Bills

 

OL - Pats

RB - Even

TE - Even

WR - Bills

 

DL - Even

LB - Bills

CB - Pats

S - Bills

ST - Even

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by SCBills

[Hapless Bills Fan]

13 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

There is a difference of sticking with the run when running is being effective and when its not.  If you're down two scores and running the football has left you in third and long all day... Do you still stick with the run?  I think not.

 

Well, that's basically Daboll's philosophy.  We'll try to run and if it doesn't work we'll pass

 

The point that Dungy and Simms and others are making is that you need to keep trying, because if you keep trying teams keep defending it.

 

Objectively, the Bills run game was not that effective against NO - we ran 32 times for 113 yds or 3.5 ypa - there was a point during the game where it was 2.9 ypa!!!!

But the point is - because we kept trying, NO had to keep defending it.

 

They couldn't say "Ha!  They won't run!" and pin their ears back showing 7 rushers then dropping 3 into coverage but overloading the R side of the line with 4.

 

Just like teams will keep showing Blitz0 until we beat it with either a deep throw to the center of the field or an effective screen - teams will keep trying those stunts and twists where they overload one side of the line and leave the other side looking to work - but if they overload the R side and leave the L side open and we run for 14 yds up the L side - oh then whups we can't do that.

 

 

 

 

[Ghost_002!]

14 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Can we wait to see how they look with Brown back, or do we need to judge our OL missing it’s starting LG and RT?

 

Feliciano is a slight upgrade, but Brown is massive in what he does for two positions.  
 

HC - Pats

 

QB - Bills

 

OL - Pats

RB - Even

TE - Even

WR - Bills

 

DL - Even

LB - Bills

CB - Pats

S - Bills

ST - Even

 

 

 

I think this is pretty accurate, but i think New England's backs are better. 

[Scott7975]

41 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well, that's basically Daboll's philosophy.  We'll try to run and if it doesn't work we'll pass

 

The point that Dungy and Simms and others are making is that you need to keep trying, because if you keep trying teams keep defending it.

 

Objectively, the Bills run game was not that effective against NO - we ran 32 times for 113 yds or 3.5 ypa - there was a point during the game where it was 2.9 ypa!!!!

But the point is - because we kept trying, NO had to keep defending it.

 

They couldn't say "Ha!  They won't run!" and pin their ears back showing 7 rushers then dropping 3 into coverage but overloading the R side of the line with 4.

 

Just like teams will keep showing Blitz0 until we beat it with either a deep throw to the center of the field or an effective screen - teams will keep trying those stunts and twists where they overload one side of the line and leave the other side looking to work - but if they overload the R side and leave the L side open and we run for 14 yds up the L side - oh then whups we can't do that.

 

 

 

 

 

I agree but its different when you keep trying and you are down two scores compared to when you are even or up two scores.  There are other things you can do to keep a defense guessing then just straight up trying to run the football to go along with that.

 

If the Bills were banging the football on first down every down and they barely got a yard each time... I don't want them to keep doing that just to do it.

 

Mostly my problem with Daboll is he doesn't mix well usually.  Its usually a case of hey this worked so keep doing it until it doesn't.  There wasn't any surprise most of the time.  I liked mostly of what I seen in the NO game though.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Scott7975

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

21 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

No but he has hit 10 more FG than your kicker.. thus why I said even. 

 

so in other words NE is bad in the red zone  

[PatsFanNH]

10 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

so in other words NE is bad in the red zone  

Well we do have a rookie QB. I rather he throw it away and get 3 than try squeeze it in and get a pick. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

16 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

so in other words NE is bad in the red zone  

 

Well, it would be nice if the Bills had a few more FG and a few less picks from within FG range or close to it

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well, it would be nice if the Bills had a few more FG and a few less picks from within FG range or close to it

 

That is true.  Other than last week technically none were in the red zone.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

16 hours ago, Maine-iac said:

SP TEAMS when was the last time the Pats had a punt blocked for a TD or fumbled a kickoff?

 

Fumbled kickoff IDK, but Gunnar Olzewski fumbled a punt vs Carolina (he recovered)

Jake Bailey (punter) had punts blocked against NOR and Dallas. 

New Orleans got into short FG range but no good.

Dallas got into the endzone, but the refs overturned the TD

 

Does the block only count if it leads to a TD and the fumble only count if it's a kickoff?