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Schefter; Herbert is "lock" for HOF, Mahomes / Herbert best young QBs in NFL


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3 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

https://thespun.com/nfl/afc-west/los-angeles-chargers/nfl-world-reacts-to-adam-schefters-bold-justin-herbert-comment

 

Schefter made this pronouncement in the pregame commentary when the start of the game was delayed 30 minutes for a thunder storm.  (A $5 BILLION dome stadium and they can't play in it during a thunder storm?  What the h*ll?)

 

He also said during the same soliloquy that Mahomes and Herbert were the two best young QBs in the NFL and would be the choices of any NFL GM looking to start a franchise.

 

I'm not here to put down Mahomes or Herbert, I agree with Schefty that they are amazing young QBs.   I don't need to put them down to believe that Josh is fantastic too.  Was Schefty just throwing a hot take out there on the fly and just overlooked Allen, or does he really put Mahomes and Herbert in a different tier than Allen? 

 

I think Allen legitimately deserves to be in the conversation for best young NFL QB.  I would put Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, and Watson all in that group.  Watson obviously has some issues that could derail his career, and I could see some people leaving him out of that conversation right now because of it.  I'm not going to get mad about someone believing that Allen isn't the best of the three, but for Josh to not even earn an honorable mention is a bit strange.

 

For my money, I wouldn't trade Allen for either of them.  That's not a knock on Mahomes or Herbert, I just have a huge amount of faith in Josh and believe he has the traits to be an all-time great QB.  I also believe Josh's DNA fits Buffalo far better than either of the other two guys would.  

 

 

 

 

Who cares if Josh deserves to be mentioned off hand by an NFL reporter during a rain delay?

 

what are we talking about here

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9 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Who cares if Josh deserves to be mentioned off hand by an NFL reporter during a rain delay?

 

what are we talking about here

 

Stuff you talk about on a no-news Tuesday during the regular season.

 

Carry on.

 

😉

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3 hours ago, SCBills said:

They mentioned Josh Allen a few minutes later, and Schefter clarified that Josh Allen belongs there too, but they were discussing young QB's that came onto the scene firing on all cylinders - whereas Josh was developed into the guy he is now. 

Thanks. This completely changes this conversation and might prevent Schefter being burned in effigy…

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3 hours ago, 2003Contenders said:

I saw the piece. It was Steve Young who chimed in a few minutes later about Josh Allen -- and he clarified that he would place Allen in a different category than Herbert or Mahomes because both of them were outstanding right away, whereas everyone knew that Allen came into the league so raw. Young said Josh has grown by leaps and bounds and that he will continue to do so -- essentially said that he has a limitless ceiling.

 

I think Allen and Jackson are both in that category.  Jackson has really improved as a passer this year. 

 

 

3 hours ago, 2003Contenders said:

I saw the piece. It was Steve Young who chimed in a few minutes later about Josh Allen -- and he clarified that he would place Allen in a different category than Herbert or Mahomes because both of them were outstanding right away, whereas everyone knew that Allen came into the league so raw. Young said Josh has grown by leaps and bounds and that he will continue to do so -- essentially said that he has a limitless ceiling.

 

was it Young or Schffner?  Who do we burn in effigy??.   Both are kind of boring, IMhO.  

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36 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

I think Allen and Jackson are both in that category.  Jackson has really improved as a passer this year. 

 

 

 

was it Young or Schffner?  Who do we burn in effigy??.   Both are kind of boring, IMhO.  

 

Jackson seems the same to me.  He is up there in yardage but only has 75 completions which is second last to Mayfield of full time starters.  He also has a terrible TD/INT ratio 4 TDs 3 INTS.  Jacksons completion is 60.5%. which is 4% lower than last season.  What is the improvement in?  

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About 5 years ago I predicted that the star NFL QB would become extinct after guys like Brady, Brees, Rogers, Big Ben retired.  My logic was that the spread offenses and read option offenses that QBs run in college would never translate to the NFL game.  
 

Anyone surprised I’m not an NFL GM?

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I'm willing to bet that even Herbert would laugh at the comment from Shefter.  He doesn't seem like the type of person to get that full of himself, especially at this stage of his career.

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7 hours ago, SCBills said:

They mentioned Josh Allen a few minutes later, and Schefter clarified that Josh Allen belongs there too, but they were discussing young QB's that came onto the scene firing on all cylinders - whereas Josh was developed into the guy he is now. 

Josh Allen's career trajectory would likely have been far different if he started for three years at a major university like both Hebert and Mahomes, or if he'd had the luxury of sitting behind a quality starter for a year as an NFL rookie like Mahomes.

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7 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Someone needs to remind Shefter that Mahomes got to sit for an entire year. :thumbsup:

Exactly he also had a solidified oline and playmakers all over the place to make his transition to the nfl a little easier… give rookie Patrick Zay Jones, Charles Clay, Robert Foster, and Kelvin Benjamin and see how he does 

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1st.  It's kind of a waste of time debating who is the better QB among Mahomes, Allen and a few others.....to do so misses the bigger point which is that the Bills HAVE a franchise level QB capable of winning in the post season, and certainly one more than capable of guiding a team to a championship.  Too wich degree Mahomes, Allen, Russell and others....are the best etc...doesn't matter.  What matters is Teddy Bridgewater isn't your QB.  The Bills will be a contender for as long as Allen is healthy and able....

 

OK....so reading through here....I see a few more posts perpetuating the myth that Mahomes being good was due in some large or small part to "sitting for a year"

 

8 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Someone needs to remind Shefter that Mahomes got to sit for an entire year. :thumbsup:

 

5 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Appreciate the clarification, but shame on Schefty if so:  Mahomes sat his entire rookie season, then was handed the keys to an offense that was 6th in points, 5th in yards, 7th in passing yards his rookie season (while he sat on the bench and watched Smith run it). 

 

Did KC's offense take a big step forward with Mahomes 2nd season (the first season he played)?  Absolutely!  He was amazing his rookie year! 

 

But we'll never know if he "came onto the scene firing on all cylinders" because he spent his first year in the NFL on the bench.

 

 

The Chiefs keep getting praised for making a big mistake.  By all accounts Mahomes was ready to go by week 6 of his 2017 rookie season.  He would have been fine starting from week 1.

 

If you look at it in reverse....you have to ask....what happend while he sat, that caused him to come and out go 5000/50 in 2018?  the answer is NOTHING.  Are you telling me that had he not sat he'd only have gone 4000/40 in 2018?  That's rubbish.  

 

Some guys.....like Mahomes or Herbert....are ready to go out of the box, and land in good spots with a good roster, good coaches etc...Marino is another...

 

Some guys need time to get used to the NFL speed and learn some.  And Some need to do that AND need the roster around them to improve as they do.  Peyton Manning...Josh Allen come to mind.  

 

I didn't see the Schefter comments, but as it relates to Allen.....does it really matter his rookie year was spend developing with a very bad roster around him?  He is a great QB now.  The roster is better around him now.  He is a contender now.  HE developed EXACTLY like the leadership said he would when he was drafted as a raw, but super tools QB.  

 

Don't worry about Herbert or Mahomes etc....You've got a top tier QB...

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6 minutes ago, Zerovoltz said:

The Chiefs keep getting praised for making a big mistake.  By all accounts Mahomes was ready to go by week 6 of his 2017 rookie season.  He would have been fine starting from week 1.

 

If you look at it in reverse....you have to ask....what happend while he sat, that caused him to come and out go 5000/50 in 2018?  the answer is NOTHING.  Are you telling me that had he not sat he'd only have gone 4000/40 in 2018?  That's rubbish. 

 

Well, some people have said that he worked on his game a lot that offseason, and came back a much better QB his 2nd camp.

I don't remember who it was - Chiefs player, seems like more than one.

 

I'll look.

Hmmm....Tyreek Hill for one

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/patrick-mahomes-hilariously-reacts-to-tyreek-hill-s-trash-talk-about-him/ar-BB1bz7Wx

 

You sound as though it's incredible to think something took place in the offseason but as Josh said about the 2020 off season "I got a lot better at football"

 

Whether he was ready right out of the gate or not ready right out of the gate, the point is, he didn't get to play right out of the gate so we'll never know if he was or not.

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3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well, some people have said that he worked on his game a lot that offseason, and came back a much better QB his 2nd camp.

I don't remember who it was - Chiefs player, seems like more than one.

 

I'll look.

Hmmm....Tyreek Hill for one

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/patrick-mahomes-hilariously-reacts-to-tyreek-hill-s-trash-talk-about-him/ar-BB1bz7Wx

 

You sound as though it's incredible to think something took place in the offseason but as Josh said about the 2020 off season "I got a lot better at football"

I have a hard time believing that Mahomes wouldn't have been at 5000/50 if he had played more in 2017.  

 

I'm not even saying that he couldn't have taken a big leap from 17 to 18....but to say NOT playing in 17 is the reason......if you reversed that....would you say then that if Mhaomes had started the final 8 games of 2017, that he would be worse than 500/50 in 2018?   

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