"Pittsburgh Confused Josh Allen" - Chris Simms

[Fan in Chicago]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

... they had a plan that was based on something but it didn't work and they struggled to adapt. 

Was Daboll stubborn and did not want to adapt per Pittsburgh's D strategy or did he know but didn't have the personnel to execute or he didn't know how to adapt?

I have no way to know. I would like honor his intelligence and believe that he knew how to counter but was stubborn enough to not change. 

McD has to step in mid-game and force Daboll to adjust. I really worry that such stubbornness may hurt us in the playoffs when it is win-or-go-home. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Fan in Chicago

[BigDingus]

Rewatching the game, can someone please just show Josh how to hold a ball if he's going to take off running? He's already fumble-prone when he's just scrambling to avoid a sack, but holding the ball away from your body with just one hand is asking for a strip. 

 

Anyway... I'm pretty sure he was just amped up too much. A lot of the supposed pressure was really him creating it for himself. His pocket presence wasn't great, and he stepped into defenders instead of away from them quite often. Also, Next-Gen stats basically has proven the most successful QB's get the ball out of their hands in under 3 seconds. If Josh holds onto the ball past 3 seconds, it's likely the pressure gets to him regardless of anything else. 

 

O-line needs to help him, but he needs to help them as well.

[Greg S]

If Pittsburgh's defense kicking the Bills O-line's ass means "Josh was confused" then alrighty then. Tampa Bay "confused" Mahomes in the Super Bowl by doing the same thing. Ditto the Giants twice vs Brady. See a theme here. If Manning who was one of the smartest QB's to ever play the game would have been "confused" with that kind of pressure as well. 

[GunnerBill]

13 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

Was Daboll stubborn and did not want to adapt per Pittsburgh's D strategy or did he know but didn't have the personnel to execute or he didn't know how to adapt?

I have no way to know. I would like honor his intelligence and believe that he knew how to counter but was stubborn enough to not change. 

McD has to step in mid-game and force Daboll to adjust. I really worry that such stubbornness may hurt us in the playoffs when it is win-or-go-home. 

 

I have no way of knowing either. They did have some success moving the ball when backed up but they struggled once they got to within 35-40 yards of the endzone. Wasn't like we were going 3 and out but we were struggling to sustain drives. Maybe that resulted in Daboll thinking if we can just tidy up execution at the end of drives it will click? I don't know. I do think the dreadfulness of the Oline did really limit the options for adjustments though. For example, it is okay saying throw screen passes, and they did try some bubble screens, but traditional running back screens still require your oline to execute at a high level. And they couldn't execute at even a mediocre level for the most part on Sunday. It was very frustrating and would be interesting to have that candid conversation with Daboll to understand what he was seeing and thinking as he was making his moves. 

[Orlando Tim]

My largest issue with the game was how often we went 4-5 wide and no short routes. I have no issue with the 5 wife's even with the great pass rush but we need a short crossing route on every play. I watched two plays where the recievers all went at least 9 yards down field before cutting. 

[colin]

a point i see in this: Simms points out correctly that we are running an offense based heavily on the old NE O.  does anyone remember brady getting huge credit for beating up on teams after they ran the ball effectively and then passed out of heavy formations to wide open guys?  or when they would spread, hit the quick hitter on first down a few times, and then mix in draws and just grind the d up?

 

 

dabo gets into insane ruts where he comes in with no balance at all, and it takes earth and heaven to move him off of his stubborn perch.  was it against KC or something we ran the ball like 1 time w an rb in the first half?  his choice to line up empty (4 and 5 wide, he just can't let a drive go without going empty) vs what is prolly the best 4 man rush in the nfl after it hasn't been working just shows he has an idea coming into the game, and it has nothing with taking advantage of the D on the pitch.

 

the 4th and 1 call was a great example of not doing anything to help your players out.  if we convert that we have a really good shot at winning the game, and that's with bad play all over the place otherwise.

 

i was wrong to stop bad mouthing him last year!

[snafu]

54 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

Confused 🤔 

 

hard to make decisions when the Line isn’t doing well.  

Yep, and on the other side of the ball it is real easy to defend when all you need are 4 linemen to create a mess in the backfield. 
 

[quinnearlysghost88]

He was probably confused as to why his offense line was a turnstile 

[EasternOHBillsFan]

7 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

This is my biggest problem with Daboll. He isn’t flexible because he doesn’t want to be flexible. It’s his game plan and he alone knows all. Pure arrogance. 

 

It wasn't just Daboll being arrogant... this team wasn't prepared enough and expected to win without maximum effort. Josh Allen looked off all damn game... his passes were not nearly as accurate as they were last season and it wasn't because of an amazing rush either. He had time to throw and guys open but his passes weren't getting there as they should.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

8 minutes ago, quinnearlysghost88 said:

He was probably confused as to why his offense line was a turnstile 

 

and why Daboll called the dumb 4th and 8 play.  

[Greg S]

1 minute ago, EasternOHBillsFan said:

 

It wasn't just Daboll being arrogant... this team wasn't prepared enough and expected to win without maximum effort. Josh Allen looked off all damn game... his passes were not nearly as accurate as they were last season and it wasn't because of an amazing rush either. He had time to throw and guys open but his passes weren't getting there as they should.

 

Maybe next year McDermott will give the starters more preseason action then they got. The Steelers played their starters somewhat this preseason including Ben. I know last season their was no preseason but that was for everybody. This year some teams played their starters more than others. The Steelers certainly did over the Bills. That helps shake off the rust and gets players used to playing football again as opposed to not playing or playing very little.

[HeHateMe]

All things being equal if Allen hits Sanders on that TD pass, we win this game easily and our game plan worked...  A couple other times Allen stared down a WR when guys were running free.  

 

Now I do think they rely too much on the 5 wide set when Allen is off.  We need to mix in RB and TE more to give Allen another look and to settle in.

[dave mcbride]

7 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Wow....you couldn't have said it better. We can't just roll Josh out there every week and expect him to throw it 40+ times while running for his life behind a mediocre OL.  If Daboll doesn't better anticipate his opponents strategy and switch it up, he'll fail. And I don't want him to take Josh down with him.....

Yet Daboll did exactly this last year vs. both NE and Seattle. Both teams were flummoxed, first NE by the run heavy attack and then Seattle the next week by the pass-heavy attack. People have short memories around here. 

48 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Bubble screens also require your QB to make a good throw….. I think we ran a couple bubble/quick screens to the wide outs on Sunday and both times Josh either threw it in the dirt or threw a bad ball.

 

Daboll sucked but for whatever reason Josh seemed to feel a lot of pressure(not physically, mentally) on Sunday it was visibly seen in his reactions…. Reminded me of the Championship game a bit. He can still be a hot mess on the football field at times. 

Agreed, Allen missed plays that would have made Daboll look better. I thought Simms’ breakdown was fantastic. That was hardly the only play where Allen seemed confused.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

It was actually 4th and 1 which made it even dumber…. Daboll feels the need to call some sort’ve trick/unconventional play in a lot of 3rd or 4th and short downs… not sure why it’s so hard to just call a conventional play that tailors to the strength of your team. He tries to outsmart the opponent too much.

The only strength of our team in fourth and short is the qb sneak. The Bills always seem to fail on fourth and short rb runs (a play call i hate), partly because the interior of the line can’t force big bodies backward. But we have a qb who is a fumbler and also basically the entire team. He can’t get injured, and getting pummeled in a dog pile is a good way to get injured.

Honestly, if they’re not going to do a qb sneak, I just wish they’d run their regular offense in fourth and short situations and treat it like a regular play. More likely to succeed than a trick play or — even worse — a standard rb plunge that’s most likely to lose them a yard.

Edited September 16, 2021 by dave mcbride

[RoyBatty is alive]

8 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

This is my biggest problem with Daboll. He isn’t flexible because he doesn’t want to be flexible. It’s his game plan and he alone knows all. Pure arrogance. 

 

Just out of curiosity, how do you know this?  Or what makes you think that?

[SCBills]

Getting pressure from 4 aside, it seems if you dare Josh Allen to take the short stuff all game and aren't worried about your man beating you over the top.. you could probably force us into a really ugly game...

 

Until Josh Allen consistently takes the underneath stuff and connects with a higher frequency on the deep ball.

 

Just swarm the intermediate areas of the field.  We seemed lost without all those chunk 15-25 yard plays. 

[BuffaloBill]

I tend to believe KC figured out Buffalo’s “rules” last year in the AFC CG. Smart coaching will often win. Dabol needs to learn not to outsmart himself.

[Not at the table Karlos]

8 hours ago, Dr.Sack said:

I recall Tua being inserted into the National championship game over Hurts was a decision made by Saban. Perhaps General McD should tell his commander to mix it up?

I read something a while back that Daboll wanted tua to play all year because he had to scale back the playbook for hurts. Saban finally let the change happen in championship game and Daboll opened it up. 

[RoyBatty is alive]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

I tend to believe KC figured out Buffalo’s “rules” last year in the AFC CG. Smart coaching will often win. Dabol needs to learn not to outsmart himself.

KC didnt have to figure anything out last year, they beat us at the lines, dominated both sides of the ball.

[BADOLBILZ]

40 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

 

Agreed, Allen missed plays that would have made Daboll look better. I thought Simms’ breakdown was fantastic. That was hardly the only play where Allen seemed confused.

 

 

Yeah the people who think that the failure was all about the pressure put on Allen are incorrect..........the Steelers accurately predicted how they could confuse Josh Allen.   

 

@HappyDays was arguing with me about it yesterday wrt a play where the safety totally abandoned Sanders and Allen never looked......he locked on the receivers they expected him to.   The pressure was significant but as Cynthia Frelund on the Bills preseason broadcast mentioned recently.......Josh typically destroys teams when they pressure him.........the Steelers really had Daboll and Allen pegged.