SoCal Deek Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 12 hours ago, oldmanfan said: I be agree in general but Afghanistan appears to be a different beast. The Soviet Union lost there, we had 20 years to no avail. The Afghan people do not have the will to keep their country. All of that is true, but once again, we have a presence in all sorts of odd places around the globe. I’m not sure what everyone’s definition of a victory is but it could be defined as establishing another base in the Middle East and stemming the actions of terrorists on American soil….which we’ve done….for twenty years next month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 On 8/7/2021 at 11:02 AM, ComradeKayAdams said: Afghanistan is much more than a “piece of dirt!” It contains an enormous amount of untapped mineral resources that can be used for the electronics industry and for other various high-tech emerging industries. Historically, the land has also held an important trade position connecting the Chinese empire with the Persian empire. Nowadays, the United States can look at the country as a favorable geostrategic position from which to watch over her biggest adversaries: China, especially Iran, and Russia too. If you look at a complete map of U.S. military bases around the world, you will see something very interesting: we’re REALLY obsessed with surrounding Iran on all sides! I believe these are the most important reasons for our extended military occupation there. Spreading democracy, upholding international human rights, controlling the opium market, diverting oil pipelines, maintaining a high budget for the military industrial complex…all good answers, but I think they are secondary motivations. Seeking revenge for 9/11, dismantling the Taliban, and stopping Islamic terrorism were the main reasons for entering the war and certainly the main reasons why any American citizens continued supporting the war in its early stages. But now? At this point, it is indeed all about American imperialism. Afghanistan is only one of the more obvious examples of this deeply immoral and pervasive foreign policy, with Iraq being the most obvious one (Libya, Syria, and Saudi Arabia/Yemen are conspicuous as well. Cuba, Venezuela, Iran, Israel/Palestine, and countries involving military drones are perhaps a bit more subtle). As someone who is a strident non-interventionist, I am actually MORE concerned that we are (allegedly…) withdrawing our troops from Afghanistan. Why are we (allegedly…) abandoning this strategic military outpost?? My cynical suspicion is that we may soon see false flags somewhere in the Middle East (Syria?) that will get us into some form of a protracted war with Iran. And if I was a resource-rich South American country with a left-leaning government, I would be sleeping with one wary eye open northward. I agree with you on the original motives for entering the war. Living in NYC at the time even my furthest left friends were in support of the effort. People were scared and angry, and rightly so. But I think the shortsighted plan in Iraq is a large part of what has led to our overstay in Afghanistan. America desperately wants to look like the good guy/world police, and after the fiasco that became of Iraq, bailing out on Afghanistan wasn't a face that we wanted to show the world. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irv Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Demented Biden letting the Taliban overun Afghanistan quicker than Grant took Richmond. Dopey Joe forgot about them. What a mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Irv said: Demented Biden letting the Taliban overun Afghanistan quicker than Grant took Richmond. Dopey Joe forgot about them. What a mess. There's not much he can do about it. This was going to happen in the Trump presidency timeline too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) I’m of the opinion that this would have happened if we left 5 years ago or leave 5 years from now. These people can’t/won’t defend themselves from the Taliban. That said… NYT is reporting that we are asking for assurances from the Taliban to not attack us, so we can avoid evacuating our embassy. LOL…. What!? Begging OPEC for oil and pleading with the Taliban to not hurt our embassy workers.. Quite the ambitious foreign policy agenda today. Edited August 12, 2021 by SCBills 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 On 8/11/2021 at 8:25 PM, dpberr said: Kabul will be in Taliban control by 9/11. That's their push. At this point I think it's safe to say that every statement that came from the White House over the last 20 years about how we're building up Afghanistan and its people was a blatant falsehood. 20 hours ago, SCBills said: I’m of the opinion that this would have happened if we left 5 years ago or leave 5 years from now. These people can’t/won’t defend themselves from the Taliban. That said… NYT is reporting that we are asking for assurances from the Taliban to not attack us, so we can avoid evacuating our embassy. LOL…. What!? Begging OPEC for oil and pleading with the Taliban to not hurt our embassy workers.. Quite the ambitious foreign policy agenda today. What was it she said yesterday, the Taliban have to decide what role they want to play in the international community? Psaki you dumb B word you can't just summon them to HR they're a ***** terrorist army. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 The US trained 300,000 Afghan troops , well equipped with vehicles and aircraft at a massive cost. Now they are surrendering that equipment to make the Taliban unstoppable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irv Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Demented Joe does it again. Another absolute freakin' failure. Has this dithering old fool done anything right? Anything? Mushy brain and his Squad are ruining the country at warp speed. What a mess. https://www.longwarjournal.org/mapping-taliban-control-in-afghanistan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 On 8/11/2021 at 6:25 PM, dpberr said: Kabul will be in Taliban control by 9/11. That's their push. This makes sense to me. And for the USA: it looks like another fall of Saigon moment is coming. And this is very troubling. At least the military and foreign policy gurus were able to talk Trump down when he was agitating for full withdrawal. Since those people - the so-called Deep Staters - are presumably still around, it appears that Biden either: - stupidly ignored their advice, and really meant it when he said that the Afghan army was strong enough and motivated enough to withstand the obvious Taliban offensive lying in wait for our departure, or - heartlessly sacrificed our Afghan supporters and all women and girls of Afghanistan so that the USA can concentrate on his “foreign policy” agenda, namely, climate change initiatives, etc. Whichever one it is, it doesn’t reflect well on this administration. And yes, I am kind of the old school neocon (old enough to remember when “new” really meant “new”) when it comes to these matters. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Afghanistan has not been figured out by any country including the U.S., and in the U.S. multiple administrations have not been able to come up with a coherent strategy. I am an admitted war hawk; I believe our military is to be used for the defense of our country and to defend the values our country stands for. Thus, as the Taliban represents a real and present danger to the people of Afghanistan, with genocide of men, women, and children, I would go in with a huge, overwhelming force (and would get allies on board), and wipe the Taliban out once and for all. The free countries of the world should not allow genocide to occur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 The Taliban gathers young girls they call “spoils of war” with plans to marry them off or use as sex slaves. https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/military/taliban-going-door-to-door-for-girls-as-young-as-12-to-make-them-sex-slaves/news-story/0b94550ec02e02de92f179cc7aabdbbf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 K.T. McFarland: Afghanistan was always Mission Impossible. Biden's living in fantasyland with this endgame The tragedy of Afghanistan is that the Taliban were always going to prevail https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/afghanistan-mission-impossible-biden-fantasyland-endgame-k-t-mcfarland She summed it up well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 9 minutes ago, B-Man said: The Taliban gathers young girls they call “spoils of war” with plans to marry them off or use as sex slaves. https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/military/taliban-going-door-to-door-for-girls-as-young-as-12-to-make-them-sex-slaves/news-story/0b94550ec02e02de92f179cc7aabdbbf Fight for the US Military: get cuckolded by your wife while on deployment and watch as the USG gives her your pay, pension, and home. Fight for the Taliban: assigned a wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 "Brief us in 11 days..........no rush" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 This aged well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: Afghanistan has not been figured out by any country including the U.S., and in the U.S. multiple administrations have not been able to come up with a coherent strategy. I am an admitted war hawk; I believe our military is to be used for the defense of our country and to defend the values our country stands for. Thus, as the Taliban represents a real and present danger to the people of Afghanistan, with genocide of men, women, and children, I would go in with a huge, overwhelming force (and would get allies on board), and wipe the Taliban out once and for all. The free countries of the world should not allow genocide to occur. And how would you go about wiping out the Taliban once and for all? Cockroaches always come back after “extermination.” I always felt our presence was needed there and other Middle East shitholes to keep the terrorists occupied fighting us there instead of here. It’s a conundrum in my mind. 4 minutes ago, B-Man said: This aged well. No he’s not aged well at all! Oh…..you mean his statement Carry on…… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 36 minutes ago, Chef Jim said: And how would you go about wiping out the Taliban once and for all? Cockroaches always come back after “extermination.” I always felt our presence was needed there and other Middle East shitholes to keep the terrorists occupied fighting us there instead of here. It’s a conundrum in my mind. No he’s not aged well at all! Oh…..you mean his statement Carry on…… You could only fully eliminate the Taliban by cutting off their Pakistani and Saudi funding, help and safe harbor, and that would have required killing a lot of Pakistani and Saudi politicians, intelligence and military. 9/11 doesn't stop with the Saudis - it also includes the Pakistanis. Those two go way back. A little known story is that the Saudis and Pakistanis helped the Afghans in the 80s not out of goodwill towards their neighbor, but that the Soviets had their eye on invading Pakistan in 1981 and using Afghanistan as the base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Pentagon sends 3,000 troops BACK to Afghanistan to evacuate Americans and won't say whether US will stay past August 31: State Dept announces Kabul embassy drawdown as Taliban captures 12 cities by Morgan Phillips & Chris Pleasance https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9887967/Biden-administration-pleads-Taliban-terrorists-advance-Kabul.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Well done Joe! Another total disaster. Myself and others criticized Trump for not pulling out, but it turns out Trump was right to listen to his advisors. As many have said, Joe Biden has been on the wrong side of virtually every foreign policy decision his entire career in Washington. In this particular case, the phrase fits....WHAT A MESS! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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