The Topics We're Talking about Show How Strong the Roster Is

[Jauronimo]

Just now, foreboding said:

 Hahahaha. I remember those days well. Just hoping some scrap heap QB would suddenly break out.

The offseason rationalization was the best.  If Fitz can throw for 3,000 yards, 25 TDs and cut the interceptions down to 12.5, and CJ/Fred runs for 2,500 yards, and the defense maintains a +11 turnover ratio.....we could very realistically be in the hunt going into December where we have 3 home games.

[RobbRiddick]

16 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Has anyone else noticed how little Bills football actually is being discussed on this forum, several days into the opening of training camp?

 

Look at the topics: financing the stadium, Stidham injury, charges dropped against Kraft, the Patriots QB's, Sunday ticket.   Even the threads actually about players and the team are about roster bubble players, like Kumerow.   There's a little free agent or trade talk - Ertz has been hammered to death, and there was something about Corey Peters.  Why is no one talking about the team, the heart of the team, the challenges the team faces?

 

Why is no one talking about it?   Because there's nothing much to say.   The starters are solid (TE is really the only position where it's possible the Bills won't be solid).  If the Bills have one or two or three young guys unexpectedly pop into the starting lineup, it will mean that a good player got beaten out by a better one.   No one is even talking about the perennially favorite topic - what backup QB can the Bills pick up when final cuts happen?  Got that covered.  Kicker?  Covered.  

 

The only question is whether they, 65 or so players and the coaches, collectively, can make themselves as good as they know they can be.  

 

Bills fans haven't been so calm for training camp since the Super Bowl years.  It's a strange feeling. 

I'm slowly reacclimatising myself to the Bills being good again. It was a shock last season, seeing them beating up on teams and reaching the championship game. 

 

It was a great season, so much fun, but for a while I felt like Al Bundy when he has a winning streak and convinces himself the Bundy Curse will soon make him pay for his good fortune. 

 

I've now reached the point where I expect them to win regularly

[foreboding]

4 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

I'm slowly reacclimatising myself to the Bills being good again. It was a shock last season, seeing them beating up on teams and reaching the championship game. 

 

It was a great season, so much fun, but for a while I felt like Al Bundy when he has a winning streak and convinces himself the Bundy Curse will soon make him pay for his good fortune. 

 

I've now reached the point where I expect them to win regularly

This was/is 100% me and probably alot of us long-time Bills fans.

Edited August 3, 2021 by foreboding

[Shaw66]

8 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Nah, there’s still plenty of football to be talked about. And people keep assuming Defensive End is set just because we addressed it in the draft. Sometimes that position takes years to develop and Hughes is going to hit a wall at some point. Will Allen follow up an MVP-type year? Will the line improve in run blocking? Can we beat KC? Will Edmunds & Oliver take that next Allen type step? Etc, etc etc.

 

I wish we had more board members that knew their X’s and O’s so we can dissect this stuff more. A lot of the threads are sensationalist hyperbole.

Well, yes, there's still plenty that could be discussed, but they're pretty small details, or they're speculative, like how long will Hughes play at a high level, what kind of impact can Rousseau or Basham have this season, etc.    But that's different from obvious holes left over from last season that needed to be filled.   That's what people in the past spent a lot of time talking about, but there are no holes like that this year.  There's TE, of course, but everyone already knows the answer to that question - Knox will take a step up, or he won't.  

 

There's not much discussion because everyone already knows the answer or it's speculative and not worth discussing until we see them on the field in September.   It's just a different attitude on the part of the fans here, and that different attitude is directly related to how the team has been built and how well they played last season. 

 

[HappyDays]

7 hours ago, Jauronimo said:

The offseason rationalization was the best.  If Fitz can throw for 3,000 yards, 25 TDs and cut the interceptions down to 12.5, and CJ/Fred runs for 2,500 yards, and the defense maintains a +11 turnover ratio.....we could very realistically be in the hunt going into December where we have 3 home games.

 

Plus Tom Brady is in his mid-30s now, this could be the year he falls off. The division is wide open.

[Shaw66]

Think about it from the players' point of view.  All those years, the players set for themselves a goal - win the Super Bowl - knowing that Fitz and Fred and Mario all have to have career years, plus Brady has to fall off, plus, plus, plus.  Still the goal is to win the Super Bowl. 

 

Now, same goal, but they're all thinking, "If we all do what we're supposed to do, we actually can win the Super Bowl."   Wonderful new time to be a Bills fan. 

[Comebackkid]

14 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

For sure. Depth of roster the Bills are top 3 in the NFL. They are among the teams with fewest glaring weaknesses. To surpass (maybe even to repeat?) last season I think the Bills need a 4th true elite player to emerge to join the three you mention. Dawkins and Poyer are the 4th and 5th best players on the team in my view, but I think both of those are guys playing close to their existing ceiling. The likely candidates to make that jump into elite company are much more Edmunds, Oliver, maybe a Gabe Davis or as a long shot maybe Cody Ford suddenly pops at guard. 

What do you think about Obada?   obviously he isnt a rook but he is new talent to the Bills and other reports have been glowing.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

19 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

For sure. Depth of roster the Bills are top 3 in the NFL. They are among the teams with fewest glaring weaknesses. To surpass (maybe even to repeat?) last season I think the Bills need a 4th true elite player to emerge to join the three you mention. Dawkins and Poyer are the 4th and 5th best players on the team in my view, but I think both of those are guys playing close to their existing ceiling. The likely candidates to make that jump into elite company are much more Edmunds, Oliver, maybe a Gabe Davis or as a long shot maybe Cody Ford suddenly pops at guard. 

Interesting take.  I would agree Dawkins and Poyer are 4 and 5.  Dawkins is not truly elite but he is a top 10 LT.  

My feelings on Edmunds are well documented.  He has the physical tools to be even more dominant than White.  I hope he emerges this year.  

I've never been sold on Oliver and wanted the other Josh Allen or Hockenson in that draft.  But he played well last year, DT takes a long time to develop, and he should get more 1:1 pass rush situations this year with a more athletic group of DL. 

 

I have two other candidates for elite status.  Tyler Bass.  He has an elite leg and he got better as the year went on.  He could be an All-Pro next year.  And then there is Knox.  I think more of him than most on this board, but the board is correct that he lacks consistency.  

[Boxcar]

On 8/2/2021 at 6:00 PM, SCBills said:

I largely agree, but would counter with the “high end talent” vs “deep roster” argument.  
 

To me, that is the only real debate.  Do we have enough difference makers to beat the Chiefs?    
 

Certainly there’s a bunch of guys who could join the ranks of Allen, Diggs and White on this team. 

 

We won’t know that until the season starts to play out though. 
 

Our DL is better this year and the Chieves are starting two rookies on the OL. Trey Smith will prove to not be the steal of the draft. We'll have healthy Milano hopefully all year and I think Epenesa will be a monster. Plus Star will help control the run game.

 

I'm not using the AFCCG as a barometer for anything when literally the entire receiving corps was suffering from non-insignificant injuries. The defense was on the field a lot and looked gassed. I am looking forward to the rematch.

[GunnerBill]

6 hours ago, Comebackkid said:

What do you think about Obada?   obviously he isnt a rook but he is new talent to the Bills and other reports have been glowing.  

 

Obada could make the team and he has value as a situational pass rusher. I don't see him as a candidate to make the jump into elite company though.

[Thurman#1]

That's really a good point, Shaw. Hadn't thought of it that way, but now that you say that, I think you're right on target. There just aren't the usual number of niggling details and problems and worries.

[Shaw66]

6 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Obada could make the team and he has value as a situational pass rusher. I don't see him as a candidate to make the jump into elite company though.

I really know very little about him and haven't seen him, but at least his history suggests that he may have more upside than the typical player his age.   He's played a lot less football in good competition than the typical player. 

 

Still, the most we can hope for is what you say. 

[Shaw66]

8 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Interesting take.  I would agree Dawkins and Poyer are 4 and 5.  Dawkins is not truly elite but he is a top 10 LT.  

My feelings on Edmunds are well documented.  He has the physical tools to be even more dominant than White.  I hope he emerges this year.  

I've never been sold on Oliver and wanted the other Josh Allen or Hockenson in that draft.  But he played well last year, DT takes a long time to develop, and he should get more 1:1 pass rush situations this year with a more athletic group of DL. 

 

I have two other candidates for elite status.  Tyler Bass.  He has an elite leg and he got better as the year went on.  He could be an All-Pro next year.  And then there is Knox.  I think more of him than most on this board, but the board is correct that he lacks consistency.  

I think when you're talking elite, you're really talking elite out of the 22.  Yes, Bass could emerge as one of the best kickers in the league, but there's a reason kickers don't get paid huge dollars, and that's because they can't have huge impact on the game.  Yes, it helps a lot if the guy has distance and accuracy on field goals and can place the ball on kickoffs, but that's just doing your job at a high level.  Elite guys make game-changing plays.  

 

I have trouble seeing Knox ever being that guy, but I'll certainly be happy if he steps up.   Rousseau is a guy who could step up.   Rousseau has unusual gifts, and DE is one of those positions where a rookie with special skills can make a big impact.  Stevenson is the other rookie who could surprise people.  Guys with speed sometimes make immediate impact. 

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I really know very little about him and haven't seen him, but at least his history suggests that he may have more upside than the typical player his age.   He's played a lot less football in good competition than the typical player. 

 

Still, the most we can hope for is what you say. 

 

Yea it is absolutely fair to assume that there is still some untapped potential, but he has been playing football since 2014 and originally bounced around practice squads for a few years before the International Pathway gave him a chance to stick in Carolina. He has fewer miles on the clock and is less beat up than your typical 29 year old defensive end that is for sure. I'd really like to see him stick on the team because I think he is the closest to a fast twitchy rusher that we have outside of Jerry but the number game at defensive end is intriguing. There are 7 candidates for 4 or 5 spots: Hughes, Addison, Obada, Epenesa, Johnson, Rousseau, Basham. 

[Comebackkid]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Obada could make the team and he has value as a situational pass rusher. I don't see him as a candidate to make the jump into elite company though.

thanks 

[Comebackkid]

53 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea it is absolutely fair to assume that there is still some untapped potential, but he has been playing football since 2014 and originally bounced around practice squads for a few years before the International Pathway gave him a chance to stick in Carolina. He has fewer miles on the clock and is less beat up than your typical 29 year old defensive end that is for sure. I'd really like to see him stick on the team because I think he is the closest to a fast twitchy rusher that we have outside of Jerry but the number game at defensive end is intriguing. There are 7 candidates for 4 or 5 spots: Hughes, Addison, Obada, Epenesa, Johnson, Rousseau, Basham. 

Addison did say that he hoped both Rooks could step up and be starters.   he said at his age he just wanted to sub in as a pass rush specialist and then get

back on the sideline.  not sure how much of a difference that makes since most of the line subs in and out anyway.  

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

My guess is Johnson gets cut 

 

I think that is likely. But I think you'd still need to lose one more.

[FilthyBeast]

I'm still very concerned about the DB position but other than that yes it's nice to have one of more loaded rosters in the NFL and there are going to be some damn good footplayers cut or traded at multiple positions that will end up starting or playing a significant role on other teams this yera.

[HappyDays]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think that is likely. But I think you'd still need to lose one more.

 

They kept 6 DEs last year, I think they will do it again this year.

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

They kept 6 DEs last year, I think they will do it again this year.

 

I'd count Jefferson more as a DT to be honest but I suppose you can take the view they kept 10 DL last year and will do so again - which would mean cutting one (likely Zimmer) at DT to keep 6 ends. Certainly they have guys who can kick inside in pass downs. I haven't actually sat down and tried to pick a 53 yet. I might have a go this evening and see if I can fit 10 DL in!