Could CRT bring about a race war?

[Orlando Tim]

It will not start a race war in this country though it might make liberal cities the worst places to live for a little while. It is easier to succeed in this country for any race the "right" way then it is to go through that. 

[Orlando Tim]

9 hours ago, Motorin' said:

 

I think most white people benefited from racism. Most through no fault of their own. 

 

And I think you guys either intentionally or unwittingly conflate that idea with the claim that all white people are racist. They are not the same thing. 

 

Your defense for CRT is that you are generally unaware of it. If you say minorities are being oppressed you have to say someone is the oppressor, and the official NEA push for CRT states 

,"anti-Blackness, anti-Indigeneity, racism, patriarchy, cisheteropatriarchy, capitalism, ableism, anthropocentrism, and other forms of power and oppression at the intersections of our society." 

 

 

 

 

[Frat-Train]

Anyone who has sat through it and holds any value towards the teachings of Dr King, will not be swayed by its teachings.  The problem only begins when one side views the others of “not being swayed by the theory “ as “racist”.  Unfortunately, CRT teaches that very thing, that anyone who does not agree is an enemy.  And if the person is white, that enemy is only an enemy because of their skin color.  There’s also no room for Christian thinking and CRT, as CRT does not allow it.  
 

We are in a paradox, that our country doesn’t want discussed, but should.  We’ve overcome the inherent wrong regarding supremacy of races, yet are finding our way back into that very thinking by catering to the assumption that there’s anything relative between a person’s skin color and the kind of person they are.  That’s why people of color who come out an denounce it, are themselves denounced.  
 

I subscribe to the teaching that you can not drive out hate with hate.  CRT is rooted in rewiring your thinking to allow certain hatreds to be validated.  That is simply stated, dangerous.  
 

And I think anyone who has an opinion on it (that goes either way), without having read or taken part of the curriculum is just as dangerous as the curriculum itself.  We need honesty on the subject, but these days, honesty is only a measure of partisanship.  
 

I’ve honestly seen it, sat through and witnessed it.  I’m defined in America as a POC as well.  I am not better or more defined before God because of those two facts.  The world has got itself entangled by the notion we must always see color.  There was far too much bloodshed and growth to let the muscle memory of hatred fall back to its old place.  

[SoCal Deek]

Correction: The war is between collectivism and individualism. This latest CRT squabble is nothing more than a meaningless blip in a much, much more destructive war. 

[oldmanfan]

First, racism still exists in this country.  It is useless to deny that.  We're a lot better than we were a generation ago, but it's still there. I tend to believe Chief Justice Roberts (a good former Buffalo guy!): to paraphrase, we get rid of racism in this country when we decide to actually treat all people the same.  We are not there yet unfortunately.   Second, I have talked to my niece who teaches elementary school in a Buffalo suburb, as well as a number of elementary and secondary school teachers where I live, and they all tell me that CRT is not being taught in their schools.  My niece tells me that they do not come close to the CRT theory with 3rd graders, only that they should respect their classmates regardless of who they are and how they look.  In my community parents are going on and on about getting rid of CRT in the schools, even though they have been told specifically and repeatedly by the superintendent that it is not part of the curriculum.  What IS taught is diversity, equity, and inclusion, and the recent hiring of a DEI officer for our school system (hired in response to incidents of racism, bullying, etc.) has been conflated into the schools teaching CRT.  They are not, but it is being used as a political pawn. 

 

My view is that we should be honest about the past.  Our ancestors did some horrible things to African-Americans, native Americans immigrants of all kinds including my Irish ancestors when they first arrived.  That can and should be taught at a junior high/senior high level.  And along with that the message should be that we cannot change the past, but learn from it for now and the future (a reason why I am decidedly not in favor of paying reparations now for sins committed centuries ago).  CRT is a theory, and to me should be kept at a collegiate or graduate school level for discussion and debate.

[All_Pro_Bills]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

First, racism still exists in this country.  It is useless to deny that.  We're a lot better than we were a generation ago, but it's still there. I tend to believe Chief Justice Roberts (a good former Buffalo guy!): to paraphrase, we get rid of racism in this country when we decide to actually treat all people the same.  We are not there yet unfortunately.   Second, I have talked to my niece who teaches elementary school in a Buffalo suburb, as well as a number of elementary and secondary school teachers where I live, and they all tell me that CRT is not being taught in their schools.  My niece tells me that they do not come close to the CRT theory with 3rd graders, only that they should respect their classmates regardless of who they are and how they look.  In my community parents are going on and on about getting rid of CRT in the schools, even though they have been told specifically and repeatedly by the superintendent that it is not part of the curriculum.  What IS taught is diversity, equity, and inclusion, and the recent hiring of a DEI officer for our school system (hired in response to incidents of racism, bullying, etc.) has been conflated into the schools teaching CRT.  They are not, but it is being used as a political pawn. 

 

My view is that we should be honest about the past.  Our ancestors did some horrible things to African-Americans, native Americans immigrants of all kinds including my Irish ancestors when they first arrived.  That can and should be taught at a junior high/senior high level.  And along with that the message should be that we cannot change the past, but learn from it for now and the future (a reason why I am decidedly not in favor of paying reparations now for sins committed centuries ago).  CRT is a theory, and to me should be kept at a collegiate or graduate school level for discussion and debate.

I think you're right here. 

 

But my ancestors didn't do anything to harm African-Americans.  In fact my family being active in the labor and civil rights movements starting in the 1960's and into the late 20th century actually helped African-Americans and others secure rights and good paying jobs.  My ancestors were Southern Europeans that immigrated to the US in the early 1900's,  They were subject to persecution by the Ottoman's in their homeland.  They came here and worked hard with one-set of grandparents owning a farm in Niagara county and then moving to California during the Great Depression.  My other grandparents stayed in WNY and raised a family there.  Family members fought during WW2.  Others served and continue to serve. 

 

When I was young I was teased and taunted because I had a "funny" last name compared to the "Smith" and "Jones" white English names.  While this lead to a lot of skirmishes some of which I won and most of which I lost it all taught me a valuable lesson to be tolerant of others.  Something unknown to me for a long time was that my mother told my wife that growing up I was always the person sticking up for the kids that everyone else picked on.  It is something I grew up not realizing.  As an adult I've acquired friends and acquaintances that could fill out the spectrum of diversity.  And treat them all as I wish people would have treated me growing up.  My experiences and lessons molded the person I am and continue to be. 

 

But when somebody slots me into some collective group and tells me I'm a racist just because I share the skin color of that group I take exception.  They can call it crap like "white rage" or anything thing they want.  But it is crap.  They know absolutely nothing about me or my experiences and they are simply out of line making accusations like that or telling me I'm some kind of oppressor.  Who the hell are they to judge me?   

 

The only way to stop discriminating against people because of race is to stop thinking of and judging people in the context of race.  They are individuals with unique qualities and unique experiences.  Some good, some bad, but all unique to be judged and noted for their own qualities and behaviors.  

[Tiberius]

If the next election is actually stolen, like the GOP seems intent on doing, then ya, who knows 

2 hours ago, Frat-Train said:

Anyone who has sat through it and holds any value towards the teachings of Dr King, will not be swayed by its teachings.  The problem only begins when one side views the others of “not being swayed by the theory “ as “racist”.  Unfortunately, CRT teaches that very thing, that anyone who does not agree is an enemy.  And if the person is white, that enemy is only an enemy because of their skin color.  There’s also no room for Christian thinking and CRT, as CRT does not allow it.  

 

Can you show us where that is written in CRT writings? Like how you toss the Christian thing in there, lol. 

[Governor]

12 hours ago, Motorin' said:

 

That is a really really stupid description. The only people that believe any of that drivel are angry white people who think they are oppressed by double reverse racism. 

 

CRT is the new Gay Marriage to the unreasonable right. 

 

 

Lol. That’s exactly right. It makes me sad.

[Motorin']

14 minutes ago, Governor said:

Lol. That’s exactly right. It makes me sad.

 

If they think the school systems have been poisoned by communist infiltrated flourid in the water system, I would be all for a national conversation on the legacy of racism. 

 

Let's do it. Arguing over OJ Simpson, welfare and Rodney King doesn't count. It is long over due. 

 

But most white people can't have the conversation because their emotions are too fragile and they revert to base human behavior as if the conversation is a threat to their existance. So you end up getting an angry diatribe about welfare and crime when the topic is about the legacy of racism.

[Tiberius]

2 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

If they think the school systems have been poisoned by communist infiltrated flourid in the water system, I would be all for a national conversation on the legacy of racism. 

 

Let's do it. Arguing over OJ Simpson, welfare and Rodney King doesn't count. It is long over due. 

 

But most white people can't have the conversation because their emotions are too fragile and they revert to base human behavior as if the conversation is a threat to their existance. So you end up getting an angry diatribe about welfare and crime when the topic is about the legacy of racism.

Do you agree that racism in the past, slavery, Jim Crow, etc, is the main factor in the high black poverty rates today? 

 

 

1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

I think you're right here. 

 

But my ancestors didn't do anything to harm African-Americans.  

Mine either. But I do know that my family got set to the head of the line for access to jobs, capital and education. 

[Wacka]

MLK would be chased out of town today by BlM and the rest of the left. How dare he takes a person's character over their skin color.

5 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Do you agree that racism in the past, slavery, Jim Crow, etc, is the main factor in the high black poverty rates today? 

 

All backed ny Democrats.

[All_Pro_Bills]

9 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Do you agree that racism in the past, slavery, Jim Crow, etc, is the main factor in the high black poverty rates today? 

 

 

Mine either. But I do know that my family got set to the head of the line for access to jobs, capital and education. 

My family did not.  My paternal grandparents lost their farm during the depression and my maternal grand father worked hard and died in his 50's leaving his wife and 4 grown children.  So I am completely free of any guilt or complicity in any oppression.

[JaCrispy]

5 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Do you agree that racism in the past, slavery, Jim Crow, etc, is the main factor in the high black poverty rates today? 

 

 

Mine either. But I do know that my family got set to the head of the line for access to jobs, capital and education. 

No...I attribute poverty to culture, not race...why? because there are plenty of educated blacks, who live a more civilized culture, and are very successful...then there are the gang banging, or low educated, drug dealing thugs that terrorize urban communities...

 

And that goes for white people too...not all whites are successful just for being white...there is a red neck culture that holds them back too...no difference

[Tiberius]

1 minute ago, JaCrispy said:

No...I attribute poverty to culture, not race...why? because there are plenty of educated blacks, who live a more civilized culture, and are very successful...then there are the gang banging, or low educated, drug dealing thugs that terrorize urban communities...

 

And that goes for white people too...not all whites are successful just for being white...there is a red neck culture that holds them back too...no difference

Yes, I agree. Poverty and culture. You are getting it. Now, who was forced to live in dire poverty in this nation for centuries? Get it now? 

[billsfan89]

8 minutes ago, Wacka said:

MLK would be chased out of town today by BlM and the rest of the left. How dare he takes a person's character over their skin color.

All backed ny Democrats.

 

The conservatives of the 1960's called MLK a communist/marxist radical who was tearing away at the fabric of the country. There was many attempts to assassinate his character by the conservative political forces at the time. He was also very much against the Vietnam war and mostly considered a radical by many. Similar to how BLM and other civil rights leaders throughout the decades are torn down MLK was given that same treatment. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/04/martin-luther-king-cornel-west-legacy

[Westside]

1 minute ago, Tiberius said:

Yes, I agree. Poverty and culture. You are getting it. Now, who was forced to live in dire poverty in this nation for centuries? Get it now? 

Have you given up everything you own to some poor oppressed POC of your choosing yet?

If not, why not? You admit to oppressing POC to get what you have.

[Tiberius]

1 minute ago, Bidens_basement said:

Have you given up everything you own to some poor oppressed POC of your choosing yet?

If not, why not? You admit to oppressing POC to get what you have.

. 

2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The conservatives of the 1960's called MLK a communist/marxist radical who was tearing away at the fabric of the country. There was many attempts to assassinate his character by the conservative political forces at the time. He was also very much against the Vietnam war and mostly considered a radical by many. Similar to how BLM and other civil rights leaders throughout the decades are torn down MLK was given that same treatment. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/04/martin-luther-king-cornel-west-legacy

Same as it ever was.

[Frat-Train]

49 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

If the next election is actually stolen, like the GOP seems intent on doing, then ya, who knows 

Can you show us where that is written in CRT writings? Like how you toss the Christian thing in there, lol. 

You’re here arguing that people are misrepresenting CRT.  I’ve seen you and others throughout, refuting what others have said.  But then suddenly, you ask me if I can show you where it’s written…

 

Have you yourself not seen or been through it, because with all due respect, you’re speaking with an authority you don’t really have.  If you sat through the teaching (not the high-level overview from the website) The flaws of the white Protestant and evangelist are heavily covered in the second, third and fifth entries, before converting into the solution of breaking western indoctrination and the bonds of white Christian oppression.  And so you’re better educated going forward, both corporate and scholastic versions hold the same ideal, as the historic use of religion is seen to further racial division and a means of control.

 

Thus dispelling everything Dr King spoke and stood for.   Still think your ignorance has you on the right side of this argument?

[Tiberius]

8 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

My family did not.  My paternal grandparents lost their farm during the depression and my maternal grand father worked hard and died in his 50's leaving his wife and 4 grown children.  So I am completely free of any guilt or complicity in any oppression.

You have no reason to be guilty, never said you should. Just saying your skin color did entitle your ancestors to privilidges 

1 minute ago, Frat-Train said:

You’re here arguing that people are misrepresenting CRT.  I’ve seen you and others throughout, refuting what others have said.  But then suddenly, you ask me if I can show you where it’s written…

 

Have you yourself not seen or been through it, because with all due respect, you’re speaking with an authority you don’t really have.  If you sat through the teaching (not the high-level overview from the website) The flaws of the white Protestant and evangelist are heavily covered in the second, third and fifth entries, before converting into the solution of breaking western indoctrination and the bonds of white Christian oppression.  And so you’re better educated going forward, both corporate and scholastic versions hold the same ideal, as the historic use of religion is seen to further racial division and a means of control.

 

Thus dispelling everything Dr King spoke and stood for.   Still think your ignorance has you on the right side of this argument?

You just make up stuff about how a theory doesn’t allow people things. It’s silly. Your argument makes no sense. 

 

Show me teachers that have been forced to teach whites are evil. Let’s see it 

[Frat-Train]

2 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

. 

Same as it ever was.

So you’re trolling, got it.  You’re not here to learn what you don’t know.  You’re here to stir it up.  How billstime of you.