Efe Obada “true sack score” ranked 9th in league

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, BringMetheHeadofLeonLett said:

If a team straight-out cuts a player they are responsible for the entirety of guaranteed monies and the cap hits which come with it.  To then re-sign the player you are adding new guaranteed monies to THAT total.  

 

Obviously.

 

But if you save $6M cutting a player and can then re-sign him for $2M you are ($6M-$2M) $4M to the good.

 

People get confused about the importance of dead money.........but that's a sunk cost either way.

 

Here is a real life example:

 

Cutting John Brown saved the Bills $8M..........he then signed with the Raiders for 1 year @ $3.75M.

 

Had the Bills signed him back for that amount they would have saved $4.25M by releasing him and re-signing him.

 

If a young, versatile DL like Efin'A Obada and a former second round pick coming off 16 starts like Forest Lamp signed one year deals with Buffalo for just $2M and $1M , respectively then the market for Addison and Butler coming off down years was no more than that.

 

But by just giving them all pay cuts Beane has both grossly overpaid them versus their market value.........and left them dissatisfied with management.

[cba fan]

On 6/19/2021 at 12:32 PM, YoloinOhio said:

It may allow Addison to play fewer reps, which could actually increase his productivity 

freshness is a big thing when rushing passer I agree 100%.

 

[Doc]

8 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Obviously.

 

But if you save $6M cutting a player and can then re-sign him for $2M you are ($6M-$2M) $4M to the good.

 

People get confused about the importance of dead money.........but that's a sunk cost either way.

 

Here is a real life example:

 

Cutting John Brown saved the Bills $8M..........he then signed with the Raiders for 1 year @ $3.75M.

 

Had the Bills signed him back for that amount they would have saved $4.25M by releasing him and re-signing him.

 

If a young, versatile DL like Efin'A Obada and a former second round pick coming off 16 starts like Forest Lamp signed one year deals with Buffalo for just $2M and $1M , respectively then the market for Addison and Butler coming off down years was no more than that.

 

But by just giving them all pay cuts Beane has both grossly overpaid them versus their market value.........and left them dissatisfied with management.

 

Do you think that Addison or Butler will go crazy or opt-out of the season?  Doubtful at best. 

Edited June 21, 2021 by Doc

[Aussie Joe]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Obviously.

 

But if you save $6M cutting a player and can then re-sign him for $2M you are ($6M-$2M) $4M to the good.

 

People get confused about the importance of dead money.........but that's a sunk cost either way.

 

Here is a real life example:

 

Cutting John Brown saved the Bills $8M..........he then signed with the Raiders for 1 year @ $3.75M.

 

Had the Bills signed him back for that amount they would have saved $4.25M by releasing him and re-signing him.

 

If a young, versatile DL like Efin'A Obada and a former second round pick coming off 16 starts like Forest Lamp signed one year deals with Buffalo for just $2M and $1M , respectively then the market for Addison and Butler coming off down years was no more than that.

 

But by just giving them all pay cuts Beane has both grossly overpaid them versus their market value.........and left them dissatisfied with management.

You haven’t mentioned Mitch Morse taking a pay cut… do you approve of that one?

[Mark Vader]

On 6/19/2021 at 10:52 AM, ColoradoBills said:

 

True but I see it more as a numbers game if he shows up really well in the summer.  If he makes to roster I see Addison as expendable.

Hughes

Addison

Epenesa

Obada

Rousseau

Basham

I can't see them keeping all 6 plus 4 DTs.  Then again maybe they do but it takes from another position group.

I'm seeing a total of 9 DL.

 

You think that Daryl Johnson will be cut?

[BringMetheHeadofLeonLett]

5 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Obviously.

 

But if you save $6M cutting a player and can then re-sign him for $2M you are ($6M-$2M) $4M to the good.

 

People get confused about the importance of dead money.........but that's a sunk cost either way.

 

Here is a real life example:

 

Cutting John Brown saved the Bills $8M..........he then signed with the Raiders for 1 year @ $3.75M.

 

Had the Bills signed him back for that amount they would have saved $4.25M by releasing him and re-signing him.

 

If a young, versatile DL like Efin'A Obada and a former second round pick coming off 16 starts like Forest Lamp signed one year deals with Buffalo for just $2M and $1M , respectively then the market for Addison and Butler coming off down years was no more than that.

 

But by just giving them all pay cuts Beane has both grossly overpaid them versus their market value.........and left them dissatisfied with management.

Very good, Ralph- you've just saved your company millions in out-of-pocket expenses, but you haven't reduced the cap hit one microbe by cutting the player.  
 

Now you propose to re-hire the player, adding to that cap hit you took ZERO cents off of.  
 

Do you think there's a reason why you never see that happen??

[BringMetheHeadofLeonLett]

Any normal team is trying to better their roster, occasional misguided millions is just part of the business on the way to making much more than that.  
 

The salary cap 'should be' just a guidepost for the team owners- where you build your desire-able product is maneuvering within that cap.  
 

Except for Ralph.  Always a ba-jillionairre, playing with this team as if those extra 200 bucks were going to ruin everything.  
 

Do you know how much talent he let go, and how much avoidable heartache we've had to endure because of miserly thinking you embrace as, brilliant??

 

When a player takes a reduced salary, they're doing it because they haven't lived up to expectations, are probably targeted as a potential cut, but believe they can do better and get a good payday in the future.  This is not complicated.  
 

The team gets a cap break, and the player has a better chance to live to fight another day.  

[eball]

8 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Obviously.

 

But if you save $6M cutting a player and can then re-sign him for $2M you are ($6M-$2M) $4M to the good.

 

People get confused about the importance of dead money.........but that's a sunk cost either way.

 

Here is a real life example:

 

Cutting John Brown saved the Bills $8M..........he then signed with the Raiders for 1 year @ $3.75M.

 

Had the Bills signed him back for that amount they would have saved $4.25M by releasing him and re-signing him.

 

If a young, versatile DL like Efin'A Obada and a former second round pick coming off 16 starts like Forest Lamp signed one year deals with Buffalo for just $2M and $1M , respectively then the market for Addison and Butler coming off down years was no more than that.

 

But by just giving them all pay cuts Beane has both grossly overpaid them versus their market value.........and left them dissatisfied with management.

 

LOL, yes, you need to teach Beane how to GM.  Effin’ hilarious.  And that last sentence is a beaut.  Two players who are being “grossly overpaid versus market value” are supposedly now “dissatisfied with management” for grossly overpaying them.  Brilliant!

 

[TC in St. Louis]

Obada has not been brought up in discussions about the improvements in our DL.  It's like he's being ignored a bit.  He may just be the X factor this team needed.  He sounds like a beast, and he did a lot of damage in 39% of the snaps in Carolina.  I see him as being disruptive and dangerous.  I am looking forward to watching him knock people over on the way to the QB.  

[MrSarcasm]

9 hours ago, Mark Vader said:

You think that Daryl Johnson will be cut?

DJ gets traded. The guy has value.

[BADOLBILZ]

11 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

You haven’t mentioned Mitch Morse taking a pay cut… do you approve of that one?

 

Not a fan of the pay cuts.

 

Of course it's not a given that they will all turn out as badly as they have in the recent past for Beane but it's not a good plan, IMO.

 

Some players are realistic about their situation.........but being highly competitive people by nature to reach the NFL.......you can assume that many are not.

 

I would have been fine with Morse being released and going with Feliciano and Bates as the center options.

 

Prior to the switch to regularly running outside zone I thought Feliciano had clearly been the better center when given the opportunity and when you factor in the concussion issues for Morse I thought he might be on his way out in 2021.

 

Morse is a good fit in outside zone but I think Feliciano gives them more scheme versatility if they decide to run more of the power run game that they did in 2019 when Singletary averaged over 5 yards per carry.   

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

10 hours ago, Mark Vader said:

You think that Daryl Johnson will be cut?

yes.

[BADOLBILZ]

6 hours ago, BringMetheHeadofLeonLett said:

Very good, Ralph- you've just saved your company millions in out-of-pocket expenses, but you haven't reduced the cap hit one microbe by cutting the player.  
 

Now you propose to re-hire the player, adding to that cap hit you took ZERO cents off of.  
 

Do you think there's a reason why you never see that happen??

 

 

 

 

Cutting John Brown saved the team $8M in cap room..........they replaced him with Emmanuel Sanders with a total cap hit of $6M(though 1.3 of that is pushed into 2022)............so if you think cutting John Brown and replacing him with Sanders didn't "reduce the cap hit one microbe" then you are just embarrassingly bad at basic arithmetic. 😆

 

 

[BringMetheHeadofLeonLett]

14 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

 

Cutting John Brown saved the team $8M in cap room..........they replaced him with Emmanuel Sanders with a total cap hit of $6M(though 1.3 of that is pushed into 2022)............so if you think cutting John Brown and replacing him with Sanders didn't "reduce the cap hit one microbe" then you are just embarrassingly bad at basic arithmetic. 😆

 

 

Stop playing 4-D chess with me.  I can't handle all these amazing concepts. 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, eball said:

 

LOL, yes, you need to teach Beane how to GM.  Effin’ hilarious.  And that last sentence is a beaut.  Two players who are being “grossly overpaid versus market value” are supposedly now “dissatisfied with management” for grossly overpaying them.  Brilliant!

 

 

 

I don't expect a trophy-husband like you to be smart at arithmetic so I will forgive you for being wrong about this.

 

@Royale with Cheese though.........he has so many withholdings on his weekly paycheck to dispute that I would expect that his math would be sharper than this by now.   What gives RwC?

 

The math is not that difficult...........the dead money is a sunk cost..........if you can cut a player and create more cap space than adding an equal or better player will cost........then it's a net positive wrt to cap space.

 

Beane knows this.......he just seems to want to try to make more people happy than he realistically can.   

  

[ColoradoBills]

10 hours ago, Mark Vader said:

You think that Daryl Johnson will be cut?

 

He's definitely on the outside looking in.  Others have speculated there could be a trade coming up and DJ may have some late round

value.  If he doesn't find another team he could end up on the PS.  Barring injuries there are just too many DLs so something has to give.

[billybrew1]

16 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Us not having WR's who were making a difference in the playoffs had way more to do with injuries than a lack of quality at the position. John Brown was snake bitten all season with his hamstring. When we had him, he was 50% at best. Cole was playing on a broken fibula. Diggs was playing on a torn oblique. Gabe Davis had an ankle injury he was playing through. Essentially, our ENTIRE WR core was injured and toughing it out.

 

So it's not that we don't have the guys. It's just that we were extremely unlucky in the timing of their injuries. Most teams around the league don't have a core as solid as Diggs, Cole, Emmanuel, Gabe Davis, and McKenzie. Most teams around the league are lucky to have 2 studs. The way, I see it - we have 4. If that were to become 3 for whatever reason, I'd feel comfortable (as long as it wasn't Diggs we lost). Especially if we added Ertz. I'd rather do that than add another WR like Golden Tate (who imo is probably the best available WR).

Yes, of course it was Injuries but Smoke was old and frail, Beasley is tiny, Diggs is small, etc. so what do you do to combat that?

Get more receivers. You just don't hope it doesn't happen again.

I wanted Sanders, Ertz AND another drafted WR.I guess I have to settle for Hodgins and Stevenson; two low-round guys, one a rookie, the other, still wearing a red no contact jersey. I'm not holding my breath.....Maybe Stevenson shocks us around November, he has a decent size/speed ratio I think. (Very fast and not tiny.) Hodgins has the great length and leaping ability, maybe he can do something when (not if) we run into injury problems.... Diggs - Sanders - Beasley - Davis - McKenzie.... I gotta admit that's an impressive top five but I think Davis and McKenzie thrive because of the top two or three drawing so much attention and Daboll's being a fantastic OC. This top three can readily beat man to man. Davis might end up being another guy.....sometimes he runs that post and seems to beat man, other times he looks helpless trying to beat man. Simply not so with Diggs and Sanders. I think Beasley is less valuable because he can only play the slot but he is unwatchable in man from the slot t. I don't know why we don throw more to him probably because he is just do small. I've seen him doubled though. One player takes short inside, the other long outside. He can't beat that but at least takes up two defenders.

[Mark Vader]

30 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

He's definitely on the outside looking in.  Others have speculated there could be a trade coming up and DJ may have some late round

value.  If he doesn't find another team he could end up on the PS.  Barring injuries there are just too many DLs so something has to give.

Daryl Johnson has become a very reliable special teamer and McDermott covets those type of players.

 

It will be a most interesting training camp.

[eball]

45 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

I don't expect a trophy-husband like you to be smart at arithmetic so I will forgive you for being wrong about this.

 

Dude, you said it.  I quoted you.  You said Addison and Butler are now upset with Beane because he's apparently paying them more than they would get on the open market.

 

Own your words.  They're important.  But I don't expect a look-at-me blowhard like yourself to understand that.

[BADOLBILZ]

23 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Dude, you said it.  I quoted you.  You said Addison and Butler are now upset with Beane because he's apparently paying them more than they would get on the open market.

 

Own your words.  They're important.  But I don't expect a look-at-me blowhard like yourself to understand that.

 

 

I think it's reasonable to expect that they were dissatisfied with having to take a pay cut.

 

What the open market would pay is not the only consideration.........it might even be the last and least important one in their opinion.  

 

Their opinion of their effort on the field and their opinion of their own production doing what they were asked to do(in Butler's case, play a different position) factor in..........as does the idea that they signed a deal and it is being reneged upon by the people who signed you to it.

 

Would you like it if I cut your social security check by 20% because you aren't being a good consumer and buying NFL season tickets and plane tickets and hotel accommodations anymore?    I think not!   That wouldn't be fair.   It doesn't take in all the extra beverages imbibed to keep you hydrated when you are crying those tears of regret.

 

Only you can make you happy @eball!

 

Beane needs to remember that when he's tryna cut people's pay...........they don't like it........it's not a great way to to motivate, really.