EDIT: Total cost to taxpayers? Bills select sports firm to represent ownership in building new open air stadium in OP, targeted for 2025

[mjd1001]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

If the stadium generates $900M over 20 years, then it's worth the investment.  The alternative is the team moves.

How would it generate 900m over 20 years.....net 900m that is after expenses and maintenance (and interest cost) that the taxpayer would have to put in?

Not being sarcastic, but i'm wondering where that figure comes from.

[LeviF]

7 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

How would it generate 900m over 20 years.....net 900m that is after expenses and maintenance (and interest cost) that the taxpayer would have to put in?

Not being sarcastic, but i'm wondering where that figure comes from.

 

Serious question: do you think "publicly funded" and "tax funded" are the same thing?

[Heitz]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

I have no idea why we wouldn’t want something like the Vikings have, but it seems everyone is dead set on open air. 

 

I'll bang the drum for a stadium like Minny - that thing is niiiiiice.  Of course I'd want that if it were going to be downtown (which it ain't, since the cost and timeline will be much greater).

 

But really, I'm down with an open air stadium in OP.  Just make it nice, none of this "we're the rust belt, we don't need nice things." - yes, we do.  It's 2021, make the thing modern so that in 5 years we're not having this conversation again!

 

Plus, if it's where the current lot is, Hammer's will be a few steps closer.  

 

 

 

[mjd1001]

1 hour ago, LeviF said:

 

Serious question: do you think "publicly funded" and "tax funded" are the same thing?

for the intents of this discussion, I am not differentiating between them.  To me a stadium is either funded by the team, or it is not.  By publicly or tax funded I am viewing that as anything not funded by the team.

[Draconator]

2 hours ago, RiotAct said:

“For just $5 a year, you can keep a Bills Mafia member’s dreams of attending a game alive!”

[Doc]

3 hours ago, BuffaloBills1998 said:

How do you know this?? The article that came out explained that the Pegulas weren’t expecting the public to front the whole cost. I expect the Pegulas will be paying a fair amount out of they’re own pocket as they should

 

I don't know.  But I'll bet it isn't anything over $400M.

 

3 hours ago, BTB said:

This is just a wild guess on your part...unless you have access to the study the Pegula’s had contracted for last year. 

 

It was the the Athletic article earlier in the week.  Take it up with them.

 

2 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

How would it generate 900m over 20 years.....net 900m that is after expenses and maintenance (and interest cost) that the taxpayer would have to put in?

Not being sarcastic, but i'm wondering where that figure comes from.

 

Based on this.  Take it up with the poster:

 

6 hours ago, loyal2dagame said:

I read somewhere that based off the taxes the Bills pay, ticket taxes,  concession taxes, and player taxes (using the NFL average salary)  for both the Bills and their opponents that are paid to NY State, that an estimated $990 million will be collected by the state over 20 years. If the numbers are correct,  i think it softens the blow of the cost.

 

Edited August 13, 2021 by Doc

[BuffaloBills1998]

17 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I don't know.  But I'll bet it isn't anything over $400M.

 

 

It was the the Athletic article earlier in the week.  Take it up with them.

 

 

Based on this.  Take it up with the poster:

 

 

Respectfully your going based off gut feeling. The Pegulas might be putting up more than 400 million or they might not. Sure the state of Erie county and us taxpayers will be paying a pretty penny but the Pegulas I’m sure will pay a fair amount. 

[LabattBlue]

29 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I don't know.  But I'll bet it isn't anything over $400M.

 

 

It was the the Athletic article earlier in the week.  Take it up with them.

 

 

Based on this.  Take it up with the poster:

 

 

Did not know you were quoting  the Athletic.  Number still seems high. Not that it matters, since the stadium appears to be destined for OP. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by BTB

[Buffalo716]

This is my opinion 

 

But it seems like most of the people who are banging the table for a dome downtown, are not Buffalonians 

 

Most of the people on the site don't live in Buffalo

 

We're all Bills fan so we can all have our opinions, and I love everyone here and I love our bills.. but besides old fans, the last thing most Buffalonians want is a dome 

 

We embrace the elements in Buffalo.. we are a rust belt Blue collar city.. we aren't a dome city

 

 

 

 

[LabattBlue]

15 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

This is my opinion 

 

But it seems like most of the people who are banging the table for a dome downtown, are not Buffalonians 

 

Most of the people on the site don't live in Buffalo

 

We're all Bills fan so we can all have our opinions, and I love everyone here and I love our bills.. but besides old fans, the last thing most Buffalonians want is a dome 

 

We embrace the elements in Buffalo.. we are a rust belt Blue collar city.. we aren't a dome city

 

 

 

 

I live here and want a dome...be it in OP or downtown. 

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, BTB said:

I live here and want a dome...be it in OP or downtown. 

I feel that a downtown stadium has more support than a dome ...

 

Everybody who lives here knows a downtown stadium is probably out of the question 

 

And the dome is absolutely in the minority..  I think there's a better chance of a downtown stadium than a dome 

 

A dome in Buffalo is not happening... Not in a city and a fan base that embraces weather... Pittsburgh, New England,  don't have domes, neither does Green Bay 

 

And buffalo embraces the weather as much of more than all of them

Edited August 13, 2021 by Buffalo716

[LabattBlue]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I feel that is a minority

 

Everybody who lives here knows a downtown stadium is probably out of the question 

 

And the dome is absolutely in the minority..  I think there's a better chance of a downtown stadium than a dome 

 

A dome in Buffalo is not happening... Not in a city and a fan base that embraces weather

I didn’t say it was happening.  You asked, and I told you what I preferred. 

[Simon]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

 

A dome in Buffalo is not happening... Not in a city and a fan base that embraces weather

 

I wouldn't really want to see a dome either and don't think it will happen.

But make no mistake, this decision won't be made with the fans in mind, it will be made with money in mind.

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, BTB said:

I didn’t say it was happening.  You asked, and I told you what I preferred. 

There's Definitely people that agree with you

[RiotAct]

45 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

This is my opinion 

 

But it seems like most of the people who are banging the table for a dome downtown, are not Buffalonians 

 

Most of the people on the site don't live in Buffalo

 

We're all Bills fan so we can all have our opinions, and I love everyone here and I love our bills.. but besides old fans, the last thing most Buffalonians want is a dome 

 

We embrace the elements in Buffalo.. we are a rust belt Blue collar city.. we aren't a dome city

 

 

I’d be interested to see the results of that stadium survey they sent out a couple years back (I believe not only to STHers but anyone who had purchased a ticket at all that season).

 

I have a feeling if you surveyed every Bills fan in the WNY/Southern Ontario region, it would be fairly evenly split between “keep the stadium open to the elements” and “build a dome”.

[Buffalo716]

10 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

I’d be interested to see the results of that stadium survey they sent out a couple years back (I believe not only to STHers but anyone who had purchased a ticket at all that season).

 

I have a feeling if you surveyed every Bills fan in the WNY/Southern Ontario region, it would be fairly evenly split between “keep the stadium open to the elements” and “build a dome”.

At its core.. how it effects the City of Buffalo , is the deciding factor

 

And there's dozens of studies that show that there's no economic impact, let alone the cost for a downtown stadium is astronomical 

 

And we're known for bills Mafia.. even before the term was around we were known for the most rabid fans... We rock shirts off in January

 

It's not even close between the open air and dome people with decades and decades of hardened fans in the elements 

 

Older folks , people who don't like the cold or elements want a dome... But the majority of WNY and Buffalo especially embrace the elements...a blue collar city like Buffalo and a dome don't mix

 

 

[Chaos]

What makes Buffalo a blue collar city? 

[OrtonHearsaWho]

7 hours ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

That is just the thing - I would rather see it 100% publicly financed than a significantly even split - just for my game day experience.

 

Yes - you are financially supporting a billionaire, but if you want to see what a private financed stadium deal looks like - look at the Pats.

 

He privately financed the stadium and then moved ticket prices up and up as they won - until an average price is over $255 a ticket.  He then went about renovating end zones and other areas - cutting away more cheap seats and turning it into a corporate game - it is no longer alive.

 

The higher the private financing done by the Pegula’s- the more they need to charge in either PSLs and seat costs.  People are complaining about moving downtown and losing tailgating, but if your seats cost 3 times what you pay now and you have a PSL on top - that will kill tailgating far faster - as a whole different crowd will start attending games.

 

On the other hand - if based upon the surveys - people want to keep the tailgating and the feel - then they need to keep the cost of tickets down - maybe a 1.5 times increase instead - to do that - you need to spread that cost over a bigger percentage of people and have much more public financing.

 

The stadium will not pay for itself and keeping it in OP means that even more so it will not pay for itself.  The question becomes where is the 1.4 billion coming from - is it coming from the public via taxes and other funding or is it coming from the public via higher seat prices, PSLs, and other fees?  
 

You are paying either way - just different if it is spread out across the state and the area or more impactful on the users.

if public financing is tied to some guarantee about ticket pricing then I’m much, much more okay with it but not sure that would happen. 

[LabattBlue]

https://buffalonews.com/news/local/pse-confirms-plans-for-public-private-partnership-to-finance-new-buffalo-bills-stadium/article_4a5d0200-fc58-11eb-bb95-33e8f047540b.html

[RiotAct]

A PSE executive late Friday confirmed Brown's account of his conversations over the past few days with officials "at the highest levels" of the company that indicated Bills ownership will not seek a deal totally financed with public money.

 

 

High-level meetings!