Jim Kelly vs Josh Allen

[BillsFanSD]

Different era, different players, different skillsets.  Allen is already at least the second best QB in the history of our franchise.  I'm happy to leave it at that for now.

 

That said, I'm now of the opinion that this team is better and definitely more fun to watch than the 1992 and 1993 Bills.  I'm not sure if they're better (relative to how the game has changed) than the 1990 and 1991 Bills, but this team has to be in the conversation for best Bills team ever.  Beane has something special going here.

[Whkfc]

If JA wins a Super Bowl he could run for dictator of Buffalo and would win in a landslide.

[BillsFanSD]

Anyway, I'm a big fan of seeing threads arguing about whether Allen is better than our HOF all-time great legend QB as opposed to all the stupid threads wondering if he'll ever throw for 300 yards in a game.

[bills6969]

1 minute ago, Whkfc said:

If JA wins a Super Bowl he could run for dictator of Buffalo and would win in a landslide.

If JA wins Buffalo a Super Bowl,  those signs you see when you enter Buffalo,  that read “Buffalo,  An All-America City” will be changed to “Buffalo,  Josh Allen’s City”.

[TheBrownBear]

I was at every home game from 1986-1995.  Jim Kelly was great, but he was never this good.

[BillsToast]

Kelly is by far the better player until Allen wins a SB or goes to 5 SBs without a win. Then he's better. 

 

Until then it's a different era so you can't compare stats. Kelly threw in a league where all RB1s had 1,000 yards and QBs rarely threw 30 times a game. 

 

Stat comparisons don't match up from 1 generation to another in any sport except for golf.

 

Unless of course you believe Drew Brees was a better QB than Joe Montana. If that's the case I don't know what to tell you.

[Chaos]

Joe Montana or Steve Young.  49ers simply blessed to have both. Kelly & allen is the same question. Same answer. 

[JMF2006]

40 minutes ago, Irv said:

Thinking that Allen could be better than Kelly all-time.  But not sure.  What do you think?

 

A totally different era.

 

A lot of the hits Jimbo took would get the team 15yds and a 1st down now.

 

That said

 

If Josh stays healthy I see no reason why he can't pass for 50,000 yds and 400+ TD's

 

 

[FireChans]

39 minutes ago, Magox said:

I love Jim Kelly but he was never this good.

This is correct. Josh is already a better QB. 

[JMF2006]

12 minutes ago, Whkfc said:

If JA wins a Super Bowl he could run for dictator of Buffalo and would win in a landslide.

 

You don't need to run for dictator....you just appoint yourself

[Buftex]

Much, much different game now than it was when Kelly was playing.  Not taking anything away from Josh, but as eye-popping as his numbers are, and as great as he has been, Josh's performance this season is one of a handful of comperable QB performances this year.  It is just a passing game now.  Guys like Kirk Cousins can put up loads of yards, td's etc etc ...but you will never confuse him with Fran Tarkington.

 

From a leadership perspective (a hugely underrated factor, as far as I am concerned) I do give Josh a little bit of an edge.  Allen has been the ideal teammate on and off the field...Kelly always had that on the field...but it took him a few seasons to grow into the the off-field stuff.

 

Don't want to be the buzz-kill old guy, believe me I get all tingly watching Allen play, like everyone else...and I believe in the kid.  But managing expectations is all part of it too...so far, he is doing great...fantastic...playoffs are the next test!

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

41 minutes ago, Real McNasty said:

Just such a different era. If Josh can stay healthy for the long term I feel he will be the Bills GOAT.

 

Thread got me thinking. Can you imagine JA with Thurman?

 

Why so he can keep handing off and throw less passes or throw to Thomas instead of Diggs, Bealsey, or someone else.

 

It's the same argument people make; "If only we had a great TE"  Allen is 1.6% behind the season leader in completion percentage and that's Drew Brees.  In the 100 year history of the NFL there's only been three QB's not named Drew Brees who have ever completed more than 70% of their passes and was just a little over 70% Brees all time record is 74.4% about 5% better than Allen.  That means 5 more completed passes for every 100 passes thrown, roughly 1.5 passes per game.

 

Compare the top three receiving stats for KC and Bills, about identical, KC (including Kelce) had like 300 total yards more, but 4 less receptions.

 

All more weapons means is less catches for the existing leaders.  The only place it would help would be to improve running game if passing game wasn't working or to run out the clock.  But in that case would prefer M Lynch to churn out 1st downs.

[Buffalo ill]

Also, dbs could actually kill WRs back in the olden days.

[PromoTheRobot]

I'll say this. Kelly never had the season Allen just had.

[Big Blitz]

Allen is just 35 yards shy of 5000 total yards.  

 

46 total TDs.  

 

[TroutDog]

Having lived through both, I’ll answer this way: Jim is the best Bills QB of the 90’s and Josh is the best from the 2020’s. I don’t feel a need to crown one or the other.

 

As has been mentioned, Jim with the current rules, in a passing league that doesn’t allow QB hits and all his stats would change. Same going backwards for Josh. How does one square that?

[TwistofFate]

36 minutes ago, Beast said:

 

I think we have a long way to go.

Agree.  Allen is out of his mind this year, but let's see him in the playoffs and beyond. 

[lookylookyherecomescookie]

I've been following the Bills since Richie Lucas was the QB.  I loved the 60's and 90's Bills.    Stats , rules changes , eras don't matter.  Allen is a better QB than Kelly.  Similar competitiveness, better arm, better mobility, better leadership, better head.  I don't know what the future holds, but today, not close.

[Real McClappy]

13 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Why so he can keep handing off and throw less passes or throw to Thomas instead of Diggs, Bealsey, or someone else.

 

It's the same argument people make; "If only we had a great TE"  Allen is 1.6% behind the season leader in completion percentage and that's Drew Brees.  In the 100 year history of the NFL there's only been three QB's not named Drew Brees who have ever completed more than 70% of their passes and was just a little over 70% Brees all time record is 74.4% about 5% better than Allen.  That means 5 more completed passes for every 100 passes thrown, roughly 1.5 passes per game.

 

Compare the top three receiving stats for KC and Bills, about identical, KC (including Kelce) had like 300 total yards more, but 4 less receptions.

 

All more weapons means is less catches for the existing leaders.  The only place it would help would be to improve running game if passing game wasn't working or to run out the clock.  But in that case would prefer M Lynch to churn out 1st downs.

More weapons the better IMO for injuries alone. Having a back like Thurman catching 50-60 passes a year is def not a problem with me.  JA to TT would be like Tecmo Bowl.  

 

[machine gun kelly]

Fun conversation.  The rules were so different back then, free agency, and so on.  It like comparing Montana to Brady.  They okayed a very different game, just like in the 60’s before they counted sacks Deacon Jones would’ve had 36 sacks in a year because he could ear slap a guy, or decapitate him with a neck shot.

 

I don’t know, but beyond that Kelly was a HOFer, and Allen has a ways to go.  Nothing against Allen, as I’m hopeful he wears a gold jacket as a dream with Diggs and hopefully others.  Nothing would make me happier in my golden years to see Allen throw a pass like Kelly to Diggs with both gold jackets at Canton.  That was awesome.

 

let’s see it play out.  I think in 8-10 years we can answer that one.  My guess is a guy like Allen might even pull a Kelly and live here with his girl probably wife by then.  He’ll know he’s a lifetime hero by then just like Kelly realized this place is special.  It can’t be replicated.