Punching Bag Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 35 minutes ago, Dan said: I would bring him back without hesitation. Perhaps the biggest problem with the team this season is the miscalculations they’ve made on both the lines. They let Phillips and Shaq walk and the replacements haven’t performed even close to their level. They did not "let them walk". They wanted more than Bills are willing to pay for a player is going to rotate in 40-60% of snaps. It is a zero sum game and the Bills cannot pay everyone as full time starters on defensive line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, dneveu said: I'm not saying you need to release brown. I'm just saying - don't gut an entire unit and elevate young players who haven't earned their time. Murphys already gone, Butler is definitely overpaid. Zimmer is already getting time, and epenesa is/was starting to (not sure on his injury in the cards game). But hughes? He's legit one of the players playing well on the defense. And while addison hasn't exactly lit it up, he's leading the team in sacks and TFLs. Jeffersons stats are relatively in line with what he's done in his career so far. You can't just "get young" if it results in getting bad. Hughes bites on play action a lot and although he may get some pressure he rarely gets sacks.. he’ll be 34 next year.. Even Andre Reed, Thurman Thomas and Bruce Smith didn’t stay in Buffalo much longer than that.. Better we move on a year early than one to late.. especially if it means we lose Feliciano or Daryl Williams.. Keep a nice OL in front of Josh.. Fans get too attached to players, it’s a business.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogham26 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 hes good and hes under contract. simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) If you don’t have someone as good as he is or better, you bring him back, it really is that simple, ya can’t let your line talent leave,... cough cough Lawson and Phillips, cough cough... that on top of Star opting out we are lacking on the D line, yes I feel it was a mistake to have let them leave. The game is won and lost in the trenches people, your lying to yourself if you think otherwise... Go Bills!!! Edited November 18, 2020 by Don Otreply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 You fix or replace what's broken. Jerry isn't what's broken. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan692 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 If we can get jerry on a honey pot deal while not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 12 minutes ago, Victory Formation said: Hughes bites on play action a lot and although he may get some pressure he rarely gets sacks.. he’ll be 34 next year.. Even Andre Reed, Thurman Thomas and Bruce Smith didn’t stay in Buffalo much longer than that.. Better we move on a year early than one to late.. especially if it means we lose Feliciano or Daryl Williams.. Keep a nice OL in front of Josh.. Fans get too attached to players, it’s a business.. Pressure is probably more important than sacks. Sacks are great, but a fair amount of the time its from coverage, the QB holding the ball etc. Hell, half of phillips sacks last year were a result of hughes and lawson more than anything phillips did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBuffalo Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 A bright spot on a bad defense isn’t necessarily a significant source of light.... The thing that drives me nuts about Jerry Hughes is the boneheaded mistakes he makes. Offside for one is just maddening. He rarely gets to the QB so that slight extra step he is trying to get most likely won’t make a difference....watch the ball Jerry and move when it moves. Don’t give free yardage EVER! The other mistakes that I see is him getting pushed inside when he should be containing the pocket. Again he doesn’t often get to the QB and it appears that he thinks he can by going inside despite being the contain guy....big plays happen when he does this and it’s usually on third and long and keeps them on the field. It is maddening to watch and it’s as plain as day when it happens. He has talent and is tough but his mental game costs him and his team quite a bit. Is it being too demanding....I’d say there is $9 million reasons for it not to be Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) Keep: Hughes - Addison - Epenesa - Johnson Keep: Oliver - Star Move on from: Murphy & Butler Toss-up: Jefferson & Harry (I would cut/trade one of them and draft a rotational DT in the middle rounds ) Edited November 18, 2020 by SCBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigPappy Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 1 hour ago, dneveu said: Are we in cap trouble? We don't even know what the cap is for next year. And if its as low as some suspect, we aren't in nearly as bad a spot as other teams. Also - if cap is super low, free agents will get massively underpaid - especially non-cap casualties since picks will be even more of a premium. If space is needed - you can release: John Brown - 8ish million savings Butler - almost 7 million savings Smith - 2 1/4 savings Losing those 3 players would save almost 20 million. Release John Brown! Are you daft or just high on cocaine? The entire offence doesn't even work without Smoke in the lineup. That's been proven already when he missed games. And as another said, Davis is not up to the challenge yet in replacing him. There are better ways in making cap space assuming we even need to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Hughes is signed through next season with an under $10,000,000 cap hit. He has played well and is arguably the leader of the defense. You keep him and revisit this next year at some point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 46 minutes ago, Limeaid said: They did not "let them walk". They wanted more than Bills are willing to pay for a player is going to rotate in 40-60% of snaps. It is a zero sum game and the Bills cannot pay everyone as full time starters on defensive line. They both signed 3yr/$30M contracts. Let's say the Bills would have had to come in a little higher and give them $11M or $12M/year instead of $10M.So an annual investment of $22M-24M. We paid Addison $10M/yr, Butler $5M/yr, and Jefferson $7M/yr. So $22M/yr. The only one I can argue was worth bringing in is Addison. And I'd also argue that the Defense is sorely missing the fire, attitude, and swagger that JP and Shaq brought. So yeah, Beane let them walk to bring in other rotational guys at the same total expense who (mostly) aren't producing as well as the guys they replaced. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dkollidas Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Extend him out for another couple years and save a couple million on 2021 cap space. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puckman5 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 1 hour ago, dneveu said: Are we trying to make the defense bad? Did you mean to say “trying to make the defense worse”? They’re struggling and in need of changes. The bigger problem is that our recent picks at linebacker and D line are not producing at a high level. I won’t call them busts yet, but they’re not playing at a level you’d like your higher draft picks to be playing at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Keep and it shouldn’t even be a question 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: They both signed 3yr/$30M contracts. Let's say the Bills would have had to come in a little higher and give them $11M or $12M/year instead of $10M.So an annual investment of $22M-24M. We paid Addison $10M/yr, Butler $5M/yr, and Jefferson $7M/yr. So $22M/yr. The only one I can argue was worth bringing in is Addison. And I'd also argue that the Defense is sorely missing the fire, attitude, and swagger that JP and Shaq brought. So yeah, Beane let them walk to bring in other rotational guys at the same total expense who (mostly) aren't producing as well as the guys they replaced. Yes, but we're not locked into their contracts like we would have been Phillips and Shaq. We can easily walk away from Butler and Jefferson this offseason... even Addison if we want, although, I personally think he and Hughes are both playing well enough to bring back given the relative inexperience from Epenesa and Johnson behind them once Murphy walks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Victory Formation said: Think we need a youth movement on defense.. I’d keep Epenesa and Daryl Johnson.. Addison, Hughes, Butler and Jefferson I’d move on from.. take that money and extend Daryl Williams and Jon Feliciano.. Trade down in the draft a few times, reload... This is the way I feel. Love what Jerry has brought to this team but I think it's time. Draft another DE to compete with AJ. Not a Daryl Johnson fan but resigning Williams & Feliciano is imperative. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinTheMagician Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 I don't think we are in cap trouble really. There are ample restructuring opportunities for a down cap year. I think Beane has this in hand. We will keep Hughes, Brown, Milano, none of those players need to be going anyplace next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, SCBills said: Yes, but we're not locked into their contracts like we would have been Phillips and Shaq. We can easily walk away from Butler and Jefferson this offseason... even Addison if we want, although, I personally think he and Hughes are both playing well enough to bring back given the relative inexperience from Epenesa and Johnson behind them once Murphy walks. I hear what you are saying, but that isnt a great selling point for why it was better to sign those 3 guys over our own guys who were producing. The new guys are easily cuttable... I'd rather have guys I dont want to cut. edit: Additionally, both Shaq and JP's contracts have outs after year 2. We'd just be "stuck" with them for an extra year. Still worth it, imo. Edited November 18, 2020 by DrDawkinstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 1 hour ago, T master said: Although Jerry has been a constant for those here complaining how he's not that good and he's getting old yet he still continues to apply pressure in every game add to it his leadership on the D then given the fact his age and isn't this the last year of his current contract ? 🤔 I would like to see him finish his career as a Bills for one there aren't nearly as many players that spend their career for the most part with 1 team . I know we got Jerry from Indy but the best of his career has happened here and he has given the Bills and the fans all he can when he's on the field so do you bring him back or do you let him walk ??? If this subject has been posted recently my apologies !! Not sure I am following your reasons for cutting him. We need to add a dominating DE. Will Epenesa grow up to be one ? Not sure yet and before next season, we should add another draft/FA. But, I want Hughes to retire a Bill. Fantastic trade that got him here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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