Big Turk Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, NewEra said: What makes you so sure that the running game will get going. Daboll first year as OC, we had one of the most pathetic running games in history. I blamed it on our OL. We upgraded the OL the following year and our run game was a little better. The following year, it’s back to year 1. I hope you’re right. Without a threat of a running game, it’s going to be near impossible to pass vs some of these opposing DCs game plans. Our running game isn’t just bad. Opposing teams aren’t even paying attention to our run game and we can’t even open holes. It’s worrisome. Yeah I have no idea how teams drop 7 or 8 into coverage and the other team still has a guy in the backfield on run plays. It's comical almost how bad they are at run blocking. And it definitely is technique...there is no reason they have to be this poor at it. Edited October 23, 2020 by matter2003 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 9 minutes ago, matter2003 said: Yeah I have no idea how teams drop 7 or 8 into coverage and the other team still has a guy in the backfield on run plays. It's comical almost how bad they are at run blocking. And it definitely is technique...there is no reason they have to be this poor at it. As I said in another thread I think it’s the blocking technique and specially, in an effort to make run and pass plays look the same to the defense, he has the line look like they’re pass blocking on running plays (as opposed to the reverse in typical WCO zone stretch teams). The result is that on running plays the linemen are upright and reactive instead of low and driving. That’s my wholly uneducated guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Edit here y'all go https://theathletic.co.uk/1421086/2019/12/02/inside-the-passing-concept-thats-helped-the-josh-allen-cole-beasley-connection-come-alive/ Mitch Morse summed it up last year: "Our Identity is that Daboll is a Lunatic" (Morse referring to someone as a lunatic is apparently a compliment) If thats the case I would like to say that Mitch Morse is playing like a Lunatic. He will probably get snubbed for the Pro Bowl but he would easily be my pick this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenorthremembers Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 31 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Ex OC.... knew the run and shoot..... did he also once get punched by Rex's dad? Thats the exact guy that came to mind for me as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: As I said in another thread I think it’s the blocking technique and specially, in an effort to make run and pass plays look the same to the defense, he has the line look like they’re pass blocking on running plays (as opposed to the reverse in typical WCO zone stretch teams). The result is that on running plays the linemen are upright and reactive instead of low and driving. That’s my wholly uneducated guess. if this is the case, they need to scrap it. The league is onto it. Unless our OLmen are going to magically figure out how to become good “upright and reactive” blockers as opposed to what they’ve learned their entire life and what got them to the league. It sounds like an interesting technique that could really confuse the defenses reads.....IF the OL could pull it off. Too bad they are failing miserably Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: As I said in another thread I think it’s the blocking technique and specially, in an effort to make run and pass plays look the same to the defense, he has the line look like they’re pass blocking on running plays (as opposed to the reverse in typical WCO zone stretch teams). The result is that on running plays the linemen are upright and reactive instead of low and driving. That’s my wholly uneducated guess. Cover1 did a nice thing on what's wrong with our run blocking. It's rather more complicated than that. Bottom line we're simply losing the battle of the trenches on fundamentals. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweats Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 The run and shoot has been long dead for decades now.....let it die peacefully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 Hey OP, who are you talking to? Tom Bresnahan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QB Bills Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: That's certainly Daboll's view and it worked in New England (which is obviously where he got it). IMO it can work with a very versatile and intelligent set of players. I don't think KC wants or expects to win too many more games that way - if the Bills actually made tackles, or achieved first downs on offense, the game would've gone very differently. I do think most offenses, and certainly this one, need to have something they can fall back on as a "go to" approach. I knew the game was lost as soon as I saw Daboll run Moss out of I-formation in the critical series of the third quarter on Monday - a formation and player that have never been successful for this offense. And he does that crap all of the time - he prefers surprise over execution and it sucks. I didn't really see the game that way. If the Bills did the things you're saying they didn't do, KC would have just passed their way to a victory. The score was a lot closer than the game itself. There's been a lot of chatter about how McDermott's gameplan was to keep it close, but the better gameplan was KC's proverbial carrot dangling in front of the horse. Making the opponent think they're within striking distance when they really had no shot. They didn't pass because they were in control of the game from the outset and didn't need to. Why bother when you're getting 9 yards a clip by handing it to an undersized rookie with a decimated offensive line? Edited October 23, 2020 by QB Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Knox talked about needing to provide Josh with clearer body language (evidently the receiver's body language signals the QB what route variation he's gonna run). I have long held the opinion that this is what Ernie Adams focuses on. The minutia pre-snap of body language, stance, etc... to be used as visual cues for NE defenses to key on. He also identifies weaknesses in players or something akin to tipping pitches qbs may do. All of course imo but I think it explains why NE is always so prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 13 minutes ago, section122 said: I have long held the opinion that this is what Ernie Adams focuses on. The minutia pre-snap of body language, stance, etc... to be used as visual cues for NE defenses to key on. He also identifies weaknesses in players or something akin to tipping pitches qbs may do. All of course imo but I think it explains why NE is always so prepared. Great players like Bruce Smith have talked about pulling out these little clues from film study 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maybe Someday Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Cover1 did a nice thing on what's wrong with our run blocking. It's rather more complicated than that. Bottom line we're simply losing the battle of the trenches on fundamentals. This was an informative breakdown. It's all about execution so if we improve that we should have an improved run game. Thanks for posting. We're going to see a lot of zone so the deep middle and underneath routes will be key. That's TE territory but since we're lacking there we need to feed Beasley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Cover1 did a nice thing on what's wrong with our run blocking. It's rather more complicated than that. Bottom line we're simply losing the battle of the trenches on fundamentals. Well that was depressing. After watching that, how bad must Spain be for them to cut bait at this point in the season? Just terrible fundamentals on both sides of the ball right now, they’re not getting proper leverage, gap control, tackling, discipline on both sides of the ball. This team is a disorganized mess right now and McD needs to coach a lot harder if the season is going to stay on track. Brutal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 20 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Curtis Modkins? I'm going to guess Chris Palmer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 22 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: That's definitely cool info. My only concern about it is that I hope Daboll is going to spend time focusing on the offense's identity. Being "multiple" is fine but you also need a go-to identity, something you can always go back to, and be multiple out of. What is ours? Yeah, no. File this relic concept under ‘Yesteryear’. Pats* have been stacking Lombardi’s with different offensive styles every week, depending on **strengths & weaknesses internally and opponent specific. We also have severe weather extremes. We can light up the scoreboard or chew the clock going 75 yards. How we do it depends entirely on ** 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 Perhaps this is a case of the OL coach trying to coach up the players, who aren't talented enough to get the job done. Reminds me of Mouse McNally circa 2007 when he had almost nothing, outside of Jason Peters. Then again, I would expect that an OL made up of a a guy who just got a huge extension (Dawkins), a 2nd round pick (Ford), a high priced UFA center (Morse), and experienced veterans (Winters, D. Williams) to show better than this. It's a small sample of plays, but given how they cannot run the ball, probably representative of their issues with technique. Allen's improving and their pass blocking has been fairly good. But they can't afford to become one-dimensional without a threat running the ball. If I were Singletary I'd be ticked they are allowing plays to get blown up like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheektowaga Chad Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 Kevin Gilbride? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 On 10/23/2020 at 9:07 AM, Royale with Cheese said: I think we are going to see a decent size uptick in targets to Beasley going forward....especially since defenses are taking away the deep ball. He's always open and moves the chains....Allen needs to look his way more. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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