TBBills Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, dave mcbride said: No, that’s not right. He is a decent (not great, but decent) throwing qb and an elite runner. He’s not a bad throwing qb, but the offensive design limits him, at least in that phase of the game. Yea an average passer isn't going to win you anything but bad draft pick position. Edited January 17, 2021 by TBBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 It's been a 3rd full year in the NFL. Lamar should be further ahead of where he is right now. IMHO that doesn't bode well for him becoming a good passer but that won't be known until his career is over. Better weapons should help, but they spending the vast majority of their resources on defense, which is what keeps them in games. I'm just glad that it's not the Bills' problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 6 minutes ago, TBBills said: Yea an average passer isn't going to win you anything but bad draft pick position. I think he simply needs more good receivers he can trust, similar to Allen. Obviously, some of his ultra-reliance on a couple of guys is on him, but he is only 24 and can still develop in that regard. Anyway, you can win a championship with him, I think. He’s such a great runner and he’s a real competitor too. I mean, he is 30-7 as a starter with a lifetime passer rating of 102.6. Give him a little credit. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 24 minutes ago, H2o said: We all know Jackson is an exceptional athlete, one of the most dynamic the game has ever seen. There is no denying that. He's won an MVP and has all kinds of accolades. If Baltimore is trying to develop Lamar as a QB their best bet may be to get away from Roman. His schemes are vanilla in the passing game and they haven't really done anything to help him grow at the position. You stop Lamar from running and you stop the Ravens. That has been the case the last 3 years in the playoffs. Chargers, Titans last year, and the Bills yesterday all pressured him, hit him continually, and stopped him from beating them running the football. Someone is going to have to be brought in who will help the young man develop mentally at the position. A person who still runs an RPO style offense, but with a more layered passing scheme so he has multiple options over one or two reads then run. He would also benefit if the Ravens got him a true #1 like we did for Josh with Diggs. Hollywood Brown is not Tyreke Hill, but more like a younger John Brown. They need to get Lamar a go-to guy. There are many questions still surrounding the Ravens. One of them is does Lamar have the mental capacity to be more than just a weapon? What are they going to do with the offense? What are they willing to do to build around him on the offensive side of the ball? We'll see how it plays out over the next couple of years, but it's obvious that the way they have handled things the last three will not get them to their ultimate goal. What Go-to-guy thinks Jackson would get him the ball? Hollywood Brown maybe a Diggs/Hopkins/ODB.... But you have a QB/offense that barely throws and when they get big plays they are usually busted plays. I like Jackson, but admit the hype bothers me and we saw another example yesterday. The weather was a huge factor yesterday and affected Buffalo more. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Billsfan1972 said: What Go-to-guy thinks Jackson would get him the ball? Hollywood Brown maybe a Diggs/Hopkins/ODB.... But you have a QB/offense that barely throws and when they get big plays they are usually busted plays. I like Jackson, but admit the hype bothers me and we saw another example yesterday. The weather was a huge factor yesterday and affected Buffalo more. This is why I said they need to bring in a different OC as well. They need to find out if Jackson is going to be a Franchise QB and not just an elite weapon. Building around him is also necessary, as we have with Allen, if they are truly trying to win a SB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Penfield45 said: Has he been given the chance ? Seems like he needs a coach to help him develop his pass game. He got smoked. You were wrong. Enough with the garbage excuses. “We need better coaches than NFL coaches” Hot one Edited January 17, 2021 by Teddy KGB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 28 minutes ago, TBBills said: Irony.... But he’s right. Which means......yup. You guessed it. You got banged on by the infamous one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 6 minutes ago, H2o said: This is why I said they need to bring in a different OC as well. They need to find out if Jackson is going to be a Franchise QB and not just an elite weapon. Building around him is also necessary, as we have with Allen, if they are truly trying to win a SB. Sort of like what I said about Allen, when the Offense had minimal weapons and a coach wanting 20-17 games predicated on defense (yes it worked yesterday). The difference is, everyone knows Jackson's athleticism and really only his most ardent supporters defend his passing. There are just so few plays Jackson makes as a traditional QB (i.e. drop back and hit a receiver in a tight window). I saw that made for TV QB challenge and Jackson was just awful. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Lamar has the worst WRs in the league. He has an offensive line that has no clue how to pass block (or an OC scheme that does a really good job of teaching them to pass block). im not saying Lamar will ever be a great passer. I do think that, given proper weapons and system, that he can b win in this league due to his otherworldly ability to run 28 minutes ago, TBBills said: Yea an average passer isn't going to win you anything but bad draft pick position. Yeah, ask Eli Manning, Trent dilfer, Doug Williams, Brad johnson....I could go on. Those guys were average passers and couldn’t run...yet won Super Bowls. It might take the perfect storm to get Lamar a title, but throwing the ball to brown, Snead and Boykin is similar to Josh throwing the ball to Foster, Zay and KB. Bums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with No Name Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 man, you are playing with fire thinking about installing a modern passing offense with him in there. maybe he figures it out and it's great. we don't know if he can read defenses, go through progressions, etc. that stuff does not happen over night. how much patience are they going to have waiting for him to possibly master those things when they know they can go with tried and true and win a lot of ball games. in any case, i would guess they need somebody better than roman to try to integrate a real offense, while still hanging on to what makes them successful right now. is andy reid available? lol Quote 5 minutes ago, NewEra said: Lamar has the worst WRs in the league. He has an offensive line that has no clue how to pass block (or an OC scheme that does a really good job of teaching them to pass block). im not saying Lamar will ever be a great passer. I do think that, given proper weapons and system, that he can b win in this league due to his otherworldly ability to run Yeah, ask Eli Manning, Trent dilfer, Doug Williams, Brad johnson....I could go on. Those guys were average passers and couldn’t run...yet won Super Bowls. It might take the perfect storm to get Lamar a title, but throwing the ball to brown, Snead and Boykin is similar to Josh throwing the ball to Foster, Zay and KB. Bums if they shift their focus to proper pass blocking, it will almost definitely cost them something in the run game. we have seen it with the bills. this will be a big riddle for them to solve, and they will need somebody special to put in the work to teach the guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, NewEra said: Yeah, ask Eli Manning, Trent dilfer, Doug Williams, Brad johnson....I could go on. Those guys were average passers and couldn’t run...yet won Super Bowls. It might take the perfect storm to get Lamar a title, but throwing the ball to brown, Snead and Boykin is similar to Josh throwing the ball to Foster, Zay and KB. Bums Good luck with that one, stuck in the old age of football. Welcome to 2021 Eli playing at elite level during those times of the wins, helped by a bad NFC East. You saying a team willr recreate the best defense in history? It really is easy to see why Lamar won't do it and makes it more clear after you listed those QBs. Edited January 17, 2021 by TBBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, Man with No Name said: man, you are playing with fire thinking about installing a modern passing offense with him in there. maybe he figures it out and it's great. we don't know if he can read defenses, go through progressions, etc. that stuff does not happen over night. how much patience are they going to have waiting for him to possibly master those things when they know they can go with tried and true and win a lot of ball games. in any case, i would guess they need somebody better than roman to try to integrate a real offense, while still hanging on to what makes them successful right now. is andy reid available? lol if they shift their focus to proper pass blocking, it will almost definitely cost them something in the run game. we have seen it with the bills. this will be a big riddle for them to solve, and they will need somebody special to put in the work to teach the guys. Or a different scheme? Could be. Idk. 2 minutes ago, TBBills said: Good luck with that one, stuck in the old age of football. Welcome to 2021 Eli playing at elite level during those times of the wins, helped by a bad NFC East. You saying a team willr recreate the best defense in history? It really is easy to see why Lamar won't do it and makes it more clear after you listed those QBs. If that’s what you got out of my post, good luck to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 17 minutes ago, NewEra said: Lamar has the worst WRs in the league. He has an offensive line that has no clue how to pass block (or an OC scheme that does a really good job of teaching them to pass block). im not saying Lamar will ever be a great passer. I do think that, given proper weapons and system, that he can b win in this league due to his otherworldly ability to run Yeah, ask Eli Manning, Trent dilfer, Doug Williams, Brad johnson....I could go on. Those guys were average passers and couldn’t run...yet won Super Bowls. It might take the perfect storm to get Lamar a title, but throwing the ball to brown, Snead and Boykin is similar to Josh throwing the ball to Foster, Zay and KB. Bums How do we know they're the worst? Seems like a chicken or egg argument. Lamar "fans" will tell you that. Others see a QB who is under average out of the pocket and can't make great reads. He is plenty elusive and often makes great plays when coverage breaks down. All qb's will hit some throws and those will be the one's his "backers" will point to. However only last week (and it was only 10-0 in the first) did Lamar come back in a game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Did anybody not notice both quarterbacks regularly left the pocket last night? You can just say Josh Allen is better than Lamar.. but not for doing the same things JA and every other athletic quarterback does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 This thread belongs in the Smithsonian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Romes Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 What top end WR free agent would want to go to a system that likes to run for over 200 a game. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Charles Romes said: What top end WR free agent would want to go to a system that likes to run for over 200 a game. Yeah. And the Ravens have never been good at drafting WRs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Lamars WR’s are going to quit on him or kill him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheektowaga Chad Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Lamar Jackson and Greg Roman will and can win many regular season games but will continue to struggle come playoff time The ravens will have a big choice coming up on resigning Jackson. Jackson had a bad game and Greg Roman does nothing to help, which compounds the problems 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: OK but the press isn't breaking it down by the half season, they are just looking at full seasons. Just "play decent" is what you want out of Allen. Given his improvement since his first start and his track record I find it hard to believe he won't at least play at a decent level. Even looking at the full seasons, the press can see the dramatic improvement in Allen. I like to break it down by half seasons because when you do that you can see that it's not as shocking that Allen made the massive leap he did this year from year 2 to 3. Heading into this season their was legitimate talk about whether Allen's 2019 season was a fluke and if his third season would be similar to Mitch Turbitzky. People thought he could be like Turbitzky or Bortles. I don't think we are worried about him regressing back to those levels. He's at minimum decent. Allen has all the skills and talent and then some of say an Aaron Rodgers who just put up a 121 passer rating season. The only thing Aaron has on Allen currently is experience. But Allen is gaining experience with every passing minute. It feels like it is only a matter of time before it truly all comes together for him and puts up a similar season to the one Rodgers just had. Rodgers was in his 4th season starting and 7th season overall when he broke out with his NFL record 122 passer rating season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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