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Hapless Bills Fan

Allen's face mask penalty: You Wouldn't Like Me When I'm Angry

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I don't think ball security will ever be a thing we can relax on when it comes to Josh...

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He had Singletary on a check down to the flats. He could have just looped it to the spot where Motor was running and would have picked up 5 yards or been incomplete. 

 

1572522432_ScreenShot2020-09-28at9_09_26AM.thumb.jpg.c1195713d95d73355871f3d20da3f7f0.jpg

 

I get to call out areas where Josh can get better since I've been defending his potential against nay sayers for the last 2 years.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Good write up across the board.  I can’t recall that penalty being called but do agree that since he held the facemask for what seemed like 45 minutes the call was legit. 
 

I mentioned last night that it appeared he took a shot to the head in conjunction with the play.  On review it appeared he actually took two shots to the head on the same play.  
 

 

He was also outside the pocket and likely deemed a runner by that point, so not afforded the normal QB protections, so an incidental shot to the head is not a penalty necessarily. But he did take some shots on other plays that warranted penalties.

 

I fear Josh is starting to get the Cam Newton treatment from the refs.

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7 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I think you're on to something there.

 

:- )

 

And Hap, I didn't realize that the third guy there was Aaron Donald. How did Josh get away with straight-arming him without drawing back a bloody stump? Holy Cow.

 

Allen didn't actually try to hold him off.  He used his arm to deflect him then the extra juice Donald dialed up (to overcome the stiff arm) worked against Donald, carrying him past.  That gave Allen time to step up and throw in the face of the 4th guy. 

 

The "scary to the point of supernatural" thing is it all has to be instinctive to Allen.  He does this stuff and it works, but he can't possibly be planning it out as it goes down.

 

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24 minutes ago, DDCC said:

It was a penalty

Someone is working on getting their post count up quickly. I can only imagine the depth of untold wisdom you will soon bring to us all

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1 minute ago, MJS said:

He was also outside the pocket and likely deemed a runner by that point, so not afforded the normal QB protections, so an incidental shot to the head is not a penalty necessarily. But he did take some shots on other plays that warranted penalties.

 

I fear Josh is starting to get the Cam Newton treatment from the refs.

 

Well if he gets in their face after a strip sack and says whatever he said that drew the "unsportsmanlike", he's not going to be popular and he'll get the "Jerry Hughes" treatment.  Hopefully he apologized to the guy and today will send him a "make up note" (or a case of Josh wine, or both, whatever is allowed).

 

But the Bills need to point out to the league, as the Ravens do, that penalties are still penalties.  Just as you can throw a facemask flag on a QB, helmet-to-helmet and facemask penalties are still penalties on Josh.

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6 minutes ago, MJS said:

He was also outside the pocket and likely deemed a runner by that point, so not afforded the normal QB protections, so an incidental shot to the head is not a penalty necessarily. But he did take some shots on other plays that warranted penalties.

 

I fear Josh is starting to get the Cam Newton treatment from the refs.

Good point that I’ll have to look at it again.  I could have sworn at least the first shot happened in the pocket on the initial hit, but if you’re correct I’ll simply pack up my outrage and use it next week over some horrible call real or imagined.  

I’ll be right 50% of the time, it’s just like high school all over again. 

 

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33 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

You could tell it juiced our guys up a bit when they were pretty well exhausted there at the end of the game, too.

 

Question: can anyone else remember a QB being called for a face mask penalty, where it was well-deserved, ever?

 

 

 

 

Great recap. Clearly by the book something a QB should never do. But to be honest I love that Josh does stuff like this. That unadulterated competitiveness lifts this team. It did as you said "Juiced Up" our guys when they really needed it. Beasley sounded pretty emotional when he talked about it post game. Anyone who says that we'd win that game Allen without Allen being Allen is just wrong.

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40 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

"Mr. McGee, Don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry." - Dr Bruce Banner

 

I have never seen anything like it.  And I really don't want to see anything like it again.

First we have Justin Hollins, #58, 6'5", 248 pounds.  Allen shifts the ball to his left hand, stiff-arms him with his throwing arm and holds him off.

image.thumb.png.0eedf061e129a1553e024d0e7a106be9.png

Then we have a second linebacker, Leonard Floyd (I think), 6'5", 240.  Allen sidesteps, ducks, and shoves Hollins into his path (by the face mask) before wrestling Hollins to the ground (by the face mask) like an old-school dog owner shoving a bad puppy's face into its mess.  Yes, that face mask penalty was entirely legit.  Allen corkscrewed the LB into the ground by the face mask, using him to take out the second LB like two bowling pins in the process.

image.thumb.png.2303ed630c904e7c31d753575b7bf1de.png

image.thumb.png.0b83f03972f75f5291f821a125c4725f.png

image.thumb.png.83f20b9716bf637ecf6db0e6797807c1.png

image.thumb.png.261f08849898b45b88f4c18a9b7eef93.png

Allen turns, and Aaron Donald is right there.  "Not this time".  Allen stiffarms and deflects him.

image.thumb.png.972ae7db7ca124988ed1aef903199a2f.png

Donald's momentum carries him past Allen.  Allen steps up while Donald is still collecting himself and throws in the face of an onrushing 4th guy.  Through the back of the endzone, fortunately - not where it could be picked off.  But you know if he'd seen a  receiver with a throwing lane at that point, Allen would have tried to make a play.
 

Here's what I don't like - while Allen is stiff arming and wrestling Hollins around with his right arm, the ball is fully extended in his left arm and waving around in the air like a chunk of tuna over the Orca tank at Seaworld.  All it would have taken at that point is for a guy Allen was unaware of (or for Floyd) to change their target and go for the ball instead of Allen.  Fumble, and that's the ball game.

 

It was exciting to watch, though.  It's like "Offensive line?  I don't need no damned offensive line, I AM a damned offensive line!" 

You could tell it juiced our guys up a bit when they were pretty well exhausted there at the end of the game, too.

 

Question: can anyone else remember a QB being called for a face mask penalty, where it was well-deserved, ever?

 

 

 

 

 

Nice frame work

 

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38 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

"Mr. McGee, Don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry." - Dr Bruce Banner

 

I have never seen anything like it.  And I really don't want to see anything like it again.

First we have Justin Hollins, #58, 6'5", 248 pounds.  Allen shifts the ball to his left hand, stiff-arms him with his throwing arm and holds him off.

image.thumb.png.0eedf061e129a1553e024d0e7a106be9.png

Then we have a second linebacker, Leonard Floyd (I think), 6'5", 240.  Allen sidesteps, ducks, and shoves Hollins into his path (by the face mask) before wrestling Hollins to the ground (by the face mask) like an old-school dog owner shoving a bad puppy's face into its mess.  Yes, that face mask penalty was entirely legit.  Allen corkscrewed the LB into the ground by the face mask, using him to take out the second LB like two bowling pins in the process.

image.thumb.png.2303ed630c904e7c31d753575b7bf1de.png

image.thumb.png.0b83f03972f75f5291f821a125c4725f.png

image.thumb.png.83f20b9716bf637ecf6db0e6797807c1.png

image.thumb.png.261f08849898b45b88f4c18a9b7eef93.png

Allen turns, and Aaron Donald is right there.  "Not this time".  Allen stiffarms and deflects him.

image.thumb.png.972ae7db7ca124988ed1aef903199a2f.png

Donald's momentum carries him past Allen.  Allen steps up while Donald is still collecting himself and throws in the face of an onrushing 4th guy.  Through the back of the endzone, fortunately - not where it could be picked off.  But you know if he'd seen a  receiver with a throwing lane at that point, Allen would have tried to make a play.
 

Here's what I don't like - while Allen is stiff arming and wrestling Hollins around with his right arm, the ball is fully extended in his left arm and waving around in the air like a chunk of tuna over the Orca tank at Seaworld.  All it would have taken at that point is for a guy Allen was unaware of (or for Floyd) to change their target and go for the ball instead of Allen.  Fumble, and that's the ball game.

 

It was exciting to watch, though.  It's like "Offensive line?  I don't need no damned offensive line, I AM a damned offensive line!" 

You could tell it juiced our guys up a bit when they were pretty well exhausted there at the end of the game, too.

 

Question: can anyone else remember a QB being called for a face mask penalty, where it was well-deserved, ever?

 

 

 

 

Thanks for this analysis.  Just watching it, it was obviously an awesome, un-quarterback-like play, but breaking it down with stills shows just how amazing it was.  

 

Allen is unique, and everyone is starting to see it.  

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The refs do not protect Allen like they do other QBs.  Some of it must be his reckless style but still, the horse collar tackle set a bad tone.  Dumb rule, but called correctly,  still he was hit in the helmet quite a bit.  Once that happened Allen reverted to street ball.   Face masks, laterals, etc.  
 

Thankfully he calmed down and made big plays on the last drive. Otherwise this looks like the Houston playoff game part 2 and we are questioning his growth.  
 

 

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Continue to do what you do Josh Allen.  I love every second of it 

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He plays QB like a linebacker ;)

 

Nope never seen a QB punish defenders like Josh.

 

Now cut it out...we already know your Buffalo tough :) 

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Josh could stiff arm a T-rex.  Extending the ball away from the defender may protect it from a TJ Watt style punch out but it would be vulnerable to a 2nd defender.  It certainly takes my blood pressure to unhealthy levels.

 

That face mask does not get called if without the pulling down part and I do not remember seeing a QB do that prior.

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54 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It was exciting to watch, though.  It's like "Offensive line?  I don't need no damned offensive line, I AM a damned offensive line!" 

You could tell it juiced our guys up a bit when they were pretty well exhausted there at the end of the game, too.

 

 

 

Kyle Brandt on GMFB showed this play along with the one where he tried the crazy lateral to McKenzie and described it as" Sugar High Josh Allen", playing playground football.  He said it with all due respect and called Allen the league MEP. (most entertaining player). One thing for sure, he is fun to watch.  

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1) from an article I read yesterday, the last time a QB was called for a facemask was 2016.

 

2) Donald coming in at the end was scary. He basically was going to just smack JA in the head and face, had JA not ducked back and away. The rams were playing recklessly in going after our QB, and JA fought back. 

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25 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Here's what I don't like - while Allen is stiff arming and wrestling Hollins around with his right arm, the ball is fully extended in his left arm and waving around in the air like a chunk of tuna over the Orca tank at Seaworld.  All it would have taken at that point is for a guy Allen was unaware of (or for Floyd) to change their target and go for the ball instead of Allen.  Fumble, and that's the ball game.

 

It is a by product of the instinctive way he moves in the pocket and in traffic, which is one of his greatest strengths. Honestly, I don't believe it can be eliminated from his game without affecting the far more positive things he is able to accomplish with that intuitive style of play.

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1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

I mean Allen is like a one man wrecking crew...last week he trucks Kyle Van Noy and stiff arms him to the ground effectively putting him in time out and telling him to "think about what you are trying to do and if that is something you should be doing while you are there" and then a 315 lb DLineman wants to get in on the action after he saw what Allen did to his teammate and said "Oh hell no! Nobody does that to Kyle without answering to me!" and Allen tells him to bring it and trucks him too...

 

Is this real life anymore?? Like is our QB just the baddest Mofo on the field every week??

It's like the Jim Kelly era where the threw a pick and broke the guy's leg tackling the defensive back that had picked him off.  Check out the video on-line of Jim Kelly destroying Anthony Phillips after a pick.  That's who we have at QB now - except a much stronger and overall more athletic guy.

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6 hours ago, Motorin' said:

He had Singletary on a check down to the flats. He could have just looped it to the spot where Motor was running and would have picked up 5 yards or been incomplete. 

 

1572522432_ScreenShot2020-09-28at9_09_26AM.thumb.jpg.c1195713d95d73355871f3d20da3f7f0.jpg

 

I get to call out areas where Josh can get better since I've been defending his potential against nay sayers for the last 2 years.

 

Josh can definitely get better, but in this case I don't think he had time for the check down. 

It was either a blown protection, or a blown protection call.  So where Josh may need to improve on this call is in recognizing the D pre-snap and making the right adjustment.

 

You can tell pre-snap that #58, Hollins, is NOT going to cover the guy he's lined up across from - Beasley I think.  He's revving his engine with Allen in his sights, and he's not being subtle about it.  But Dawkins [Correction: Nsekhe] takes the next guy over, leaving Hollins is "unabated to the QB". 

 

Let's look at a bit of a zoom-in a moment after your screenshot.

At the point where Hollins is already in the pocket with Allen in his sights, neither Beas nor Singletary have even started to turn yet.

image.thumb.png.c50a614760c1a43c3409069071f3322d.png

Beas is kinda going "uh-oh" realizing there's no one covering him which means his guy is heading for the backfield.

At the point where Motor breaks and turns, Allen is literally already holding Hollins off.

image.thumb.png.3a91887be97ed0df2b5953d215ddec0c.png

 

What I think he might have, as this shot a fraction of a second earlier shows, is a play to Beasley.  That's what the QB is supposed to do, right? throw into the blitz?

But at the point where Allen and Bease turn, Hollins is right there and I believe it would be a dangerous throw.

image.thumb.png.9a517706205e637a0fc62f57f3bb261d.png

 

I think the root cause of problems on this play is either a breakdown in protection, or a wrong protection call.  Allen is not behaving as though he recognizes #58 has a free path to him.  This is the part that still needs improvement, IMO

 

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