Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 hours ago, LabattBlue said: Anyone else think that McD stepped in during the week, and told Daboll to knock it off with the play calls for Allen to run the ball, before he gets injured? Personally I thought it was the complaints from TBD that stopped the run calls! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 I would have taken away 3 carries from Moss and give them to Josh. This week maybe make it closer to 5 or 7 more carries. Donald is a beast and getting Josh outside will be wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Daboll may have adjusted the game plan when Byron Jones went out and realized they couldn't cover Diggs and Brown. I think the one designed QB run was on the first drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 I think McD was in on the plan for week 1. I think they will have different plans each week and want to show lots of things to make teams HAVE to prepare for lots of things. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 hours ago, DCOrange said: Daboll or Allen or someone specifically said they featured the QB runs so much against the Jets because they saw that they struggled with it big time last year. I don't think it necessarily means they want to lean on it every week, but it's something Allen does very well and it's something that the opponent doesn't handle very well so we took advantage. This. Daboll is from the New England school. His game plans are very opponent specific. Look at all the crossers this week as man coverage beaters. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 3 hours ago, LabattBlue said: Anyone else think that McD stepped in during the week, and told Daboll to knock it off with the play calls for Allen to run the ball, before he gets injured? no. you mix it up and keep the defenses guessing 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 3 hours ago, LabattBlue said: Anyone else think that McD stepped in during the week, and told Daboll to knock it off with the play calls for Allen to run the ball, before he gets injured? No, I think it all came within the flow of each game. Allen was picking apart the Dolphins, and so were our WR's. It just wasn't needed really, we got good pass protection and WR's were coming free regularly. And Allen was dropping dimes all day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: No, I think it all came within the flow of each game. Allen was picking apart the Dolphins, and so were our WR's. It just wasn't needed really, we got good pass protection and WR's were coming free regularly. And Allen was dropping dimes all day. Yup you play to what the defense gives you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideNine Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 3 hours ago, LabattBlue said: Anyone else think that McD stepped in during the week, and told Daboll to knock it off with the play calls for Allen to run the ball, before he gets injured? I think he probably said something or Dabs in hindsight thought that Josh getting flipped like a coin and nearly landing on his head/shoulder and fumbling the ball when we are up 3 scores should be a situation to be avoided. Those sweeps have been featured in just about every game since the midpoint of last year thru the Jets game, and against Miami there was only one adhoc Allen scramble and one designed QB draw play... not sure if I saw anything else and this was against a team that touted a strong secondary and showed considerable gaps containing Newton the prior week. May have been coincidence, but my money is that it was likely a point of discussion between the coaches. The negatives of that particular sweep play have outweighed the positives and that does not mean that Allen cannot take off when he sees real estate or use some designed option plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Smith Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 hours ago, WhoTom said: Is he building a time machine? Maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted September 21, 2020 Author Share Posted September 21, 2020 3 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: He didn’t run because the gameplan didn’t call for it. There will be other weeks when he does run quite a bit. Josh is an elite runner (when he hangs onto the ball). That’s not something that is going to go away (especially with his size). Well then, I hope for our sake as fans he doesn't get hurt when running, because everyone will suddenly do a 180 and proclaim what a bad idea it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 11 minutes ago, LabattBlue said: Well then, I hope for our sake as fans he doesn't get hurt when running, because everyone will suddenly do a 180 and proclaim what a bad idea it is. Oh, there are a lot of people waiting for that “I told you so” moment. At the end of the day it’s football and people get hurt. He is big and physical. At some point he will probably get hurt. Pretty much everyone that plays the position goes through it. I just hope that, whenever that time is, it is minimal. He can’t play scared though. He needs to remain aggressive. That’s when the Bills are at their best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted September 21, 2020 Author Share Posted September 21, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Oh, there are a lot of people waiting for that “I told you so” moment. At the end of the day it’s football and people get hurt. He is big and physical. At some point he will probably get hurt. Pretty much everyone that plays the position goes through it. I just hope that, whenever that time is, it is minimal. He can’t play scared though. He needs to remain aggressive. That’s when the Bills are at their best. I don't intend on coming here if he gets hurt with an "I told you so". I'm just keeping my fingers crossed, that he avoids the big hit as much as possible when running, whether it be getting out of bounds or sliding. The injury risk is reduced when designed runs are infrequent. Edited September 21, 2020 by LabattBlue 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 1 minute ago, LabattBlue said: I don't intend on coming here if he gets hurt with an "I told you so". I'm just keeping my fingers crossed, that he avoids the big hit as much as possible when running, whether it be getting out of bounds or sliding. The injury risk is reduced when designed runs are infrequent. Is it though? I don’t mean that to be antagonistic either but QB injuries aren’t often on designed runs. It’s when someone rolls up on your leg in the pocket or hitting a hand on a helmet or whatever. I’d like to see data supporting or dispelling that. I think it is intuitive to believe that guys are more likely to get hurt running but i just don’t know if that’s true. He just can’t play tentative or scared. That’s why Trent Edwards is my least favorite Bills player ever. He played scared and was bad because of it. The Bills need to attack (even late in games with the lead). This team is built to attack and need to keep the foot on the gas (that includes Josh running). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideNine Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 12 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Oh, there are a lot of people waiting for that “I told you so” moment. At the end of the day it’s football and people get hurt. He is big and physical. At some point he will probably get hurt. Pretty much everyone that plays the position goes through it. I just hope that, whenever that time is, it is minimal. He can’t play scared though. He needs to remain aggressive. That’s when the Bills are at their best. Not sure if a lot of folks are waiting to say I told you so, just that those Josh Allen designed sweep runs have not been working. Not only have they not worked since the first few games last year when they caught teams off guard, they too often result in negative plays and turnovers. On top of that Allen has been rocked trying to run behind a bunch of pulling linemen. I don't mind Allen running and there are some designed option runs that fit, but there are some designed running plays where the risk/reward math is not working and the Bills have to be smarter. Seems like we did not lose a lot of productivity by not leaning on those in Miami so not sure how much we lose jettisoning a few of those that are poorly conceived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, WideNine said: Not sure if a lot of folks are waiting to say I told you so, just that those Josh Allen designed sweep runs have not been working. Not only have they not worked since the first few games last year when they caught teams off guard, they too often result in negative plays and turnovers. On top of that Allen has been rocked trying to run behind a bunch of pulling linemen. I don't mind Allen running and there are some designed option runs that fit, but there are some designed running plays where the risk/reward math is not working and the Bills have to be smarter. Seems like we did not lose a lot of productivity by not leaning on those in Miami so not sure how much we lose jettisoning a few of those that are poorly conceived. Now, Josh’s runs not working is a different argument. I think in general they are effective but if you feel differently, understood. The Bills shouldn’t run anything that isn’t working. I think that the crux of this conversation though is people are worried Josh will get hurt running too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideNine Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Now, Josh’s runs not working is a different argument. I think in general they are effective but if you feel differently, understood. The Bills shouldn’t run anything that isn’t working. I think that the crux of this conversation though is people are worried Josh will get hurt running too much. Folks keep saying "RUNS" lumping them all together. There are different kinds of QB runs - that is the distinction I am trying to make. The sweeps with pulling linemen force Josh to slow down, and both follow behind and wait for blocks to develop. He is not a tiny RB that can get lost behind linemen and he is getting rocked and turning the ball over on those sweeps. The read option runs and QB draws, or just scrambling when the defense leaves a lot of green in front of him are quick and just require Allen to beat a man or two to make yards and decide whether to head for the sidelines, or slide, or lower his horns and drive for more yards. Those appear to be more productive runs for him IMO. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Just now, WideNine said: Folks keep saying "RUNS" lumping them all together. There are different kinds of QB runs - that is the distinction I am trying to make. The sweeps with pulling linemen force Josh to slow down, and both follow behind and wait for blocks to develop. He is not a tiny RB that can get lost behind linemen and he is getting rocked and turning the ball over on those sweeps. The read option runs and QB draws, or just scrambling when the defense leaves a lot of green in front of him are quick and just require Allen to beat a man or two to make yards and decide whether to head for the sidelines, or slide, or lower his horns and drive for more yards. Those appear to be more productive runs for him IMO. I haven’t seen the exact breakdown by type of run I’m not comfortable commenting on that personally. It would be a “gut feeling” to say that the sweeps aren’t working but the read option is for me. That’s why I lumped them together. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franco_92 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 4 hours ago, MJS said: QB's are injured far less on designed runs (injuries per plays called) than on sacks, scrambles, and knockdowns. It's like 1 in every 200 plays called. Sacks and scrambles are like 1 in 90. Knockdowns are like 1 in 70. So actually the safest thing a QB can do is a designed run. But yeah, turnovers are bad. The QBs that create the first dataset slide a lot more, and look for contact a lot less, than Josh, fwiw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 5 hours ago, LabattBlue said: Anyone else think that McD stepped in during the week, and told Daboll to knock it off with the play calls for Allen to run the ball, before he gets injured? Good question. So in his presser, someone asked McD about Josh's two runs and how he felt about seeing his QB take on a LB, especially given how well the team is playing. It's at 6:45 in, if you don't want to watch the whole thing. https://www.buffalobills.com/video/press-conferences He grinned and then actually laughed during the question. He said he was proud of Josh and how he handled the first situation. He said the second situation, Josh was trying to get the first down and we've got to protect the ball, plain and simple." The question of how he feels to see his QB take off and flatten a linebacker then shake off another defensive player was left to the imagination of those watching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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