The War on Whiteness

[Motorin']

20 minutes ago, keepthefaith said:

 

Give us your top 3 white privileges and we can start there unless you're merely looking for this type of conversation.

 

 

 

1. Federally insured home loans.

 

My grandparents on both sides were able to buy houses in the 1960's with low interest, federally subsidized mortgages in "good" neighborhoods. They bought those houses for around $15,000, and passed them down to us when the combined value was about $500,000.

 

Black people were not afforded access to low interest, federally subsidized mortgages from the 1940's through the 1990's, and those who could get mortgages paid much higher interest rates and were redlined into only certain neighborhoods . The total wealth from the equity of those homes that white working and middle class families were able to pass on amounts to billions of dollars. This white privilege is one of several reasons there is an enormous wealth gap.

 

2. Property Taxes

 

For black homeowners, on average they pay far higher property taxes in cities than white homeowners in white neighborhoods. Still exists in most big cities today. So not only are black people more likely to get stuck with higher interest rates than white people of the same income, but will pay a higher property tax than their white counterparts. 

 

The "rational" reason city and county politicians throughout the country decided to over tax black people and under tax white people was this idea, black people can't flee the city, and they want to keep white people from fleeing the city... 

 

I'll just leave these two.

Edited July 10, 2020 by Motorin'

[Chandemonium]

8 minutes ago, Winston Zeddemore said:

 

Quick, someone tell these people about their white privilege, clearly they haven't been told and that's why they're living on the streets in absolute squalor in the country's second biggest (and one of the most affluent) cities. 

 

 

The guy in the bottom picture has a nicer office chair than I do at my desk at work. Must be his white privelege.

[dubs]

13 minutes ago, Kemp said:

 

What is truly shameful is that you don't understand that Trump isn't anywhere near a Conservative.

this isn’t about trump you numbskull. 

 

not everything is about trump. In fact, most of this was around before trump, will be after trump and trump has little to no bearing on now. 
 

 

[Kemp]

1 minute ago, dubs said:

this isn’t about trump you numbskull. 

 

not everything is about trump. In fact, most of this was around before trump, will be after trump and trump has little to no bearing on now. 
 

 

 

Surprised, but happy that you understand that Trump in no way resembles a Conservative.

Great Three Stooges reference, too!.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

12 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

 black people can't flee the city

 

ORLY?

 

[Capco]

4 hours ago, dubs said:

 

So minority leaders are bad for minorities. What an amazing take.

 

4 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

The very point of the meeting was to single out people by a phenotype (skin color), attribute qualities (from specific to nebulous) to the entire group based solely on that phenotype, and inform them that the qualities automatically attributed to them were offensive /detrimental to those with a different skin color.

 

By doing so, the purpose of the meeting was essentially to inform them that the very nature of their phenotype (whitness) was offensive / detrimental to others.

 

I don't know about you; however, I was raised to believe that it is wrong to paint an entire group of people with the same broad brush stroke, simply because they share the same race/ethnicity/sex/religion/etc.

 

Now it’s racist to point out the systemic racism of white privilege? It’s no different than pointing out the systemic racism that brown people have to endure other than where each group lies on the axis of power.

 

It’s impossible to talk about racism without also talking about race itself.

[billsfan1959]

3 minutes ago, Capco said:

Now it’s racist to point out the systemic racism of white privilege? It’s no different than pointing out the systemic racism that brown people have to endure other than where each group lies on the axis of power.

 

It’s impossible to talk about racism without also talking about race itself.

 

The meeting singled out one group of people and applied some vague quality of "white priviledge" to each and every person of that group without any consideration of the unique life circumstances of each individual.

 

Call it what you want.

 

I call it wrong.

[Capco]

12 hours ago, Rob's House said:

 

In the interim we will regress to a form of racial discrimination similar to that which we emerged from in the 20th century.

I’ll give you another shot since my question wasn’t worded up to your standards.

 

Do you really believe that we (who is we?) emerged from the racial discrimination of the 20th century? If so, at what point in time?

[Capco]

13 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

The meeting singled out one group of people and applied some vague quality of "white priviledge" to each and every person of that group without any consideration of the unique life circumstances of each individual.

 

Call it what you want.

 

I call it wrong.

The fact that I don’t get pulled over multiple times a year simply because of the color of my skin has nothing to do with my unique life circumstances.

 

5 minutes ago, Winston Zeddemore said:

 

You're framing the question poorly, respectfully, to fit your agenda. A better way to look at it is to judge the arc of history, is it bending towards equality and justice for all or the opposite? Compare the state of race relations/legal obstruction in 1960 to 1980. Compare 1980 to 1995. Compare 1995 to 2012. Compare 2012 to 2020... if you do, and do so honestly, you see there is a clear progression from oppression towards liberty for all. 

 

That's how our system was designed to self-correct. It was never designed to allow or tolerate fast corrections. Fast corrections often lead to violence, upheaval, and strife -- things the framers knew to be dangerous to the stability of the country and government itself. We have seen missteps, no question, but the overall arc of history in this country bends towards justice... which is proof the system is working. 

 

So why then do you want to line up beside people who are using this issue to advocate tearing the whole system down and replacing it with models we know do not promote equality for all? 

I completely agree with what you said in regards to the overall arc of progress. But that isn’t what Rob said. Look at his sentence.

He’s not saying we were in the process of emerging. He said we emerged.

 

For someone as careful with words as he is, that is very telling to me. That’s why I’d like a clarification.

Edited July 10, 2020 by Capco

[billsfan1959]

1 minute ago, Capco said:

The fact that I don’t get pulled over multiple times a year simply because of the color of my skin has nothing to do with my unique life circumstances.

 

The reasons people get pulled over are varied. How that translates into "real priviledge" for each and every member of one group and "oppression" for each and every member of another group in regard to opportunities for advancement/betterment requires some real intellectual gymnastics.

[keepthefaith]

26 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

1. Federally insured home loans.

 

My grandparents on both sides were able to buy houses in the 1960's with low interest, federally subsidized mortgages in "good" neighborhoods. They bought those houses for around $15,000, and passed them down to us when the combined value was about $500,000.

 

Black people were not afforded access to low interest, federally subsidized mortgages from the 1940's through the 1990's, and those who could get mortgages paid much higher interest rates and were redlined into only certain neighborhoods . The total wealth from the equity of those homes that white working and middle class families were able to pass on amounts to billions of dollars. This white privilege is one of several reasons there is an enormous wealth gap.

 

2. Property Taxes

 

For black homeowners, on average they pay far higher property taxes in cities than white homeowners in white neighborhoods. Still exists in most big cities today. So not only are black people more likely to get stuck with higher interest rates than white people of the same income, but will pay a higher property tax than their white counterparts. 

 

The "rational" reason city and county politicians throughout the country decided to over tax black people and under tax white people was this idea, black people can't flee the city, and they want to keep white people from fleeing the city... 

 

I'll just leave these two.

 

#1.  That may be historically correct but that is no longer a practice, right so it's a non-issue.  It's self correcting now? The CRA put into place in the late '70's requires banks to lend throughout their communities and in lower income neighborhoods (not by race but income based).   https://www.federalreserve.gov/consumerscommunities/cra_about.htm

 

#2.  Can't speak for all cities but believe it or not the city of Chicago has lower property tax rates than most of the surrounding burbs.  Also Rahm Emmanuel when Mayor in 2015 approved a city property tax increase but no increase for homes valued under $250K.  https://news.wttw.com/2015/09/22/emanuels-budget-includes-property-tax-hike-ride-sharing-fees

[IDBillzFan]

7 minutes ago, Capco said:

The fact that I don’t get pulled over multiple times a year simply because of the color of my skin has nothing to do with my unique life circumstances.

 

I used to get pulled over multiple times a year, and I'm an olive-skinned Italian. Am I supposed to believe there were pulling me over for skin color and not because I was a horrible effin' driver? 

[Capco]

9 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

The reasons people get pulled over are varied. How that translates into "real priviledge" for each and every member of one group and "oppression" for each and every member of another group in regard to opportunities for advancement/betterment requires some real intellectual gymnastics.

 

7 minutes ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

I used to get pulled over multiple times a year, and I'm an olive-skinned Italian. Am I supposed to believe there were pulling me over for skin color and not because I was a horrible effin' driver? 

Some context for you gentlemen.

 

https://www.wmbfnews.com/2020/06/02/myrtle-beach-homeowner-appliance-technician-share-eye-opening-discussion-about-racism/

Edited July 10, 2020 by Capco

[billsfan1959]

Just now, Capco said:

Some context for you gentlemen.

 

Makes as much sense as most of your posts....

[Capco]

2 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

Makes as much sense as most of your posts....

 

It was a technical difficulty.  I kept copying the link on my phone but it wouldn't paste. 

 

Easy there.  

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

I'm still interested to find out why "black folks can't leave the cities."

 

[Motorin']

7 minutes ago, keepthefaith said:

 

#1.  That may be historically correct but that is no longer a practice, right so it's a non-issue.  It's self correcting now? The CRA put into place in the late '70's requires banks to lend throughout their communities and in lower income neighborhoods (not by race but income based).   https://www.federalreserve.gov/consumerscommunities/cra_about.htm

 

#2.  Can't speak for all cities but believe it or not the city of Chicago has lower property tax rates than most of the surrounding burbs.  Also Rahm Emmanuel when Mayor in 2015 approved a city property tax increase but no increase for homes valued under $250K.  https://news.wttw.com/2015/09/22/emanuels-budget-includes-property-tax-hike-ride-sharing-fees

 

The effect of the historical practice is still massive today for a number of reasons. And property taxes in Chicago are still highly regressive, with people on the South and West sides paying taxes way over assessed compared to homeowners on the Northside and corporations. Btw, property taxes are collected by Cook County, not the city of Chicago. https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-tax-divide-investigation-20180425-storygallery.html

[keepthefaith]

20 minutes ago, Capco said:

The fact that I don’t get pulled over multiple times a year simply because of the color of my skin has nothing to do with my unique life circumstances.

 

I

 

 

There are probable cause laws and have been for years.  If this is still an issue people can take it up in court.  I find it hard to believe this is a widespread problem in 2020. 

 

True story....

 

A guy who worked with me (black) called me one day and said he needed 3 days off.   He went to court for a long overdue matter that he ignored and the court sentenced him to 3 days in jail.  He went on to say he was pulled over because he was black in a certain town that is mostly white.  When I asked him to elaborate he said the cop came to his window and pulled him over because he ran the license plate and an outstanding warrant came up.  I said sorry but it sounds to me like he had a good reason to pull you over.  He then said he was sure the cop only ran his plate because he was black.  I explained to him that police cars have devices that scan plates.  He said he still thinks it was because he was black.  The problem is his attitude, not the cops in this instance. 

 

 

Edited July 10, 2020 by keepthefaith

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

2 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

The effect of the historical practice is still massive today for a number of reasons. And property taxes in Chicago are still highly regressive, with people on the South and West sides paying taxes way over assessed compared to homeowners on the Northside and corporations. Btw, property taxes are collected by Cook County, not the city of Chicago. https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-tax-divide-investigation-20180425-storygallery.html

 

And why not move out of the cities?

 

 

[Rob's House]

7 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

1. Federally insured home loans.

 

My grandparents on both sides were able to buy houses in the 1960's with low interest, federally subsidized mortgages in "good" neighborhoods. They bought those houses for around $15,000, and passed them down to us when the combined value was about $500,000.

 

Black people were not afforded access to low interest, federally subsidized mortgages from the 1940's through the 1990's, and those who could get mortgages paid much higher interest rates and were redlined into only certain neighborhoods . The total wealth from the equity of those homes that white working and middle class families were able to pass on amounts to billions of dollars. This white privilege is one of several reasons there is an enormous wealth gap.

 

2. Property Taxes

 

For black homeowners, on average they pay far higher property taxes in cities than white homeowners in white neighborhoods. Still exists in most big cities today. So not only are black people more likely to get stuck with higher interest rates than white people of the same income, but will pay a higher property tax than their white counterparts. 

 

The "rational" reason city and county politicians throughout the country decided to over tax black people and under tax white people was this idea, black people can't flee the city, and they want to keep white people from fleeing the city... 

 

I'll just leave these two.

 

You'll leave these two because they're all you could come up with and they're both bunk.

 

The first one you have to go back 60 years, the other is race neutral. Cities tend to have higher property taxes irrespective of color. Blacks can move into the suburbs just as easily as whites can. Most of those who are too poor to move to the suburbs (which are typically cheaper than all but the worst parts of the city) are usually on public assistance and aren't paying property taxes at all.