Prescott for Allen

[ColoradoBills]

[machine gun kelly]

6 hours ago, whorlnut said:

People need to give up the narrative on Allen. It’s become completely ridiculous. The guy improved across the board last year (except the deep ball) and people still want to bash him. 
 

Chris Mortensen recently tweeted that the national narrative on Allen is becoming embarrassing. He’s right. The metrics and stat nerds from places like PFF are looking like complete morons because they can’t let go of their pre-draft narratives. 
 

Joe Marino from Locked-On Bills had a complete podcast devoted to Allen this past Wednesday. About 14 minutes into the podcast he basically said that if you can’t see the improvements from Allen and appreciate that he’s getting better, then you just don’t want to. He said he’s got everything you want in a qb. He’s a born leader, he works his butt off, and he’s showing marked improvements on the field. He also mentioned that if people thought he was going to be a finished product after 2 years coming out of Wyoming, then they were going to be disappointed. 
 

Bottom line...we have a guy who might have one of the highest ceilings in the league. He’s not a finished product yet. His teammates love him and would run through walls for him. 
 

Why would we trade all that for Dak Prescott?

Whorlnut, nice take brother.  I didn’t read or Hear anything about Mortensen, but I like him overall.  He’s usually fair minded and does pretty good interviews on NFLR.  I hope he brings this up again, and if I hear he’s on one of these shows, I’m going to call in to get whatever host and see if they’ll ask him about the point.

[DCOrange]

This seems like one of many cases where neither team would trade their guy for the other. 

[foreboding]

uh....no thanks.

[whorlnut]

18 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Whorlnut, nice take brother.  I didn’t read or Hear anything about Mortensen, but I like him overall.  He’s usually fair minded and does pretty good interviews on NFLR.  I hope he brings this up again, and if I hear he’s on one of these shows, I’m going to call in to get whatever host and see if they’ll ask him about the point.

Here you go my man...

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/billswire.usatoday.com/2020/05/18/espn-chris-mortensen-buffalo-bills-josh-allen/amp/

[machine gun kelly]

Good read.  Thanks Whorlnut.

[hjnick]

IMO, this will be the first season where we can get a decent comparison between Dak and Josh Allen.

 

Dak has had a very good offense around him his whole career, while this season will be the first where Josh Allen has all the pieces to create a good offense.

 

Dak still has a better OLine, RB's.  The WR's are close to a push, with the Cowboys with a slight advantage.

 

So let's see how Josh and Dak look after the first 4-6 games this year...

 

[MrSarcasm]

Interesting. What QBs would you trade Allen for...?

[WMDman]

1 hour ago, MrSarcasm said:

Interesting. What QBs would you trade Allen for...?

Mahomes and that’s about it

[without a drought]

Straight Up, what teams would trade their QB for Josh?

 

You can take age into it but not salary because they will all get paid if they're good.

[Kirby Jackson]

2 hours ago, MrSarcasm said:

Interesting. What QBs would you trade Allen for...?

Factoring in contracts, age, production, etc:

 

Yes (as of 6/1/20):

Mahomes

Watson

Wilson

Murray

Lamar

Maybe (but probably not as of 6/1/20):

Burrow

Baker

Darnold

Tua

 

I go back and forth on Russell Wilson. I think that he’s the 2nd best player in football. He will be 32 this year though. I still probably would. You’d still have 6 or so elite years from him.

[MrSarcasm]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Factoring in contracts, age, production, etc:

 

Yes (as of 6/1/20):

Mahomes

Watson

Wilson

Murray

Lamar

Maybe (but probably not as of 6/1/20):

Burrow

Baker

Darnold

Tua

 

I go back and forth on Russell Wilson. I think that he’s the 2nd best player in football. He will be 32 this year though. I still probably would. You’d still have 6 or so elite years from him.

Baker is a yes for me everyone else on the Maybe list is a definite No for me. Murray is a maybe as well. 

[Chaos]

On 5/30/2020 at 4:25 PM, Kirby Jackson said:

I don’t mind being tagged lol. 
 

Is the question, “who is the better player today?” The answer is unequivocally Dak. Josh’s story hasn’t been written yet and I’m on record as believing that he will be a star. I wouldn’t make that trade but anyone that thinks, on May 30, 2020 that Josh Allen is a better QB than Dak Prescott is INSANE.
 

Please, please, please people don’t point to the one time that you watched Dak last year either. You need to look at the entire sample size.

Apparently I am insane 

[JetsFan20]

My concern with paying Dak is the 1/2 a season he played without Amari Cooper. 
 

 

[Doc]

18 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Factoring in contracts, age, production, etc:

 

Yes (as of 6/1/20):

Mahomes

Watson

Wilson

Murray

Lamar

Maybe (but probably not as of 6/1/20):

Burrow

Baker

Darnold

Tua

 

I go back and forth on Russell Wilson. I think that he’s the 2nd best player in football. He will be 32 this year though. I still probably would. You’d still have 6 or so elite years from him.

 

I wouldn't trade for Burrow or Tua until I see them play in the NFL first.  Darnold and Baker would be definite no's.  Mahomes and Wilson are yes's and Lamar is a maybe as is Watson until I see him without DHop.

[Kirby Jackson]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I wouldn't trade for Burrow or Tua until I see them play in the NFL first.  Darnold and Baker would be definite no's.  Mahomes and Wilson are yes's and Lamar is a maybe as is Watson until I see him without DHop.

The reason that I included the rookies is because we are projecting. I think highly of both of them. If the list is who would you want starting a game tomorrow there are a lot of guys that weren’t named that come before Josh. The hypothetical trade is more about how do you project the QB’s in the league over the next decade? I’d trade him for Trevor Lawrence and he won’t even be in the league for a year. This is all subject to change obviously but that’s where I’m at today. I think Josh has a chance to be a star. The only guys that’s I’d consider trading him for have equal (Or close to equal) upsides and more production. 

[Doc]

14 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

The reason that I included the rookies is because we are projecting. I think highly of both of them. If the list is who would you want starting a game tomorrow there are a lot of guys that weren’t named that come before Josh. The hypothetical trade is more about how do you project the QB’s in the league over the next decade? I’d trade him for Trevor Lawrence and he won’t even be in the league for a year. This is all subject to change obviously but that’s where I’m at today. I think Josh has a chance to be a star. The only guys that’s I’d consider trading him for have equal (Or close to equal) upsides and more production. 

 

Yeah I was also talking about QBs over the next decade.  Which encompasses the rookies.  They just need to play first before anyone can say anything about how good they are.  I've seen too many high 1st round QBs bust.

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Factoring in contracts, age, production, etc:

 

Yes (as of 6/1/20):

Mahomes

Watson

Wilson

Murray

Lamar

Maybe (but probably not as of 6/1/20):

Burrow

Baker

Darnold

Tua

 

I go back and forth on Russell Wilson. I think that he’s the 2nd best player in football. He will be 32 this year though. I still probably would. You’d still have 6 or so elite years from him.

I have a feeling your list will age very poorly over the course of this season.

[Kirby Jackson]

43 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I have a feeling your list will age very poorly over the course of this season.

Really? As of today I think that 90%+ objective football fans would trade for the entire “yes” list. I’d say 50%+ on the maybe list. 
 

I like Josh and think that he’s going to be really, really good. Today he is not as good as those other guys on the “yes” list. They are similar in age and experience but with more production. Josh has that “it” quality that I’m not sure all of the others do. At the same time those guys have MVPs, Super Bowls, National Championships, Heismans, etc... That is not an insult there are just a lot of really accomplished young QBs. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

3 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Factoring in contracts, age, production, etc:

 

Yes (as of 6/1/20):

Mahomes

Watson

Wilson

Murray

Lamar

Maybe (but probably not as of 6/1/20):

Burrow

Baker

Darnold

Tua

 

I go back and forth on Russell Wilson. I think that he’s the 2nd best player in football. He will be 32 this year though. I still probably would. You’d still have 6 or so elite years from him.

 

Daniel Jones could probably lead your 'maybe' list.

 

Since I am a biased Bills fan their are only two I would trade Allen for. Mahomes and Wilson. I think Wilson is one of those QB's that can play to 40 at a high level. Maybe even 41 or 42. So that's 8 or 10 years still of elite QB play.

 

I really like the other 3 on you 'yes' list. And all three might even be better than Allen now. But i don't see any of them as either substantially better or a guarantee that they will sustain their success or trajectory that I would be comfortable trading Allen. I rather just take the risk of keeping Allen and hope to hit one out of the park.