aristocrat Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 i mean any project i've ever done i've always put in a 10-20 percent buffer on the budget but 100-200 percent? How the f did they miss so much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, aristocrat said: i mean any project i've ever done i've always put in a 10-20 percent buffer on the budget but 100-200 percent? How the f did they miss so much? I think it boils down to two factors: 1. Take as much as you can get. Why would the contractors do the job for 2 billion when you can get 5-6 billion? 2. If the team(s) owner(s) want this to happen, it becomes very easy for the person/people running the project to say we can make your dream come true for 2 billion...then reality strikes..and you're 2 billion into this project, your team needs a place to play, the whole thing is a national punchline..so you just shovel money at it I'm sure whatever happens, even if the taxpayers didn't agree to fund any of this, they're going to get a big bill for this project. Edited May 14, 2020 by jeremy2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scuba guy Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 Didn't the big dig put in mass years ago have a 20 times factor with the excess expenses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twist_to_open Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 "The stadium has seen cost overruns and slower than expected personal seat license sales," seems to me the NFL has reached the point that their grand luxurious stadium plans cost more than the revenue the fans are willing to pony up to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Seasons1992 said: Considering NYS is now in a $61B hole, there are two things that will happen with any new stadium: 1. Pegula's are paying for it 100%. 2. They retrofit New Era as-is. There's no way in the next 3-5 years they would consider building a brand new place. Honestly, my thoughts are the Pegula's are going to get out of the sports business in the next 5 years. I think they realize the climate of this country and the odds of getting a new stadium are pretty much non-existant. The Sabres have just been a headache to them and the arena is getting older by the day. Too many headaches and there won't be enough revenue coming in. Edited May 14, 2020 by Binghamton Beast 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zonabb Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 First, Buffalo isn't getting a new stadium with any govt funding anytime soon, if at all. Second, Pegula's over-extended and his productions for wells far exceeds the market prices, they're losers right now. So he's not in any position to pay for one. The current lease will get extended by a minimum of 5 years, likely with "stay afloat" maintenance. The point above about costly overruns in Bflo is off base (implying surely about union costs by the tone). Unlike LA, where construction is a 24/7/365 industry with tight labor supply, driving up costs, Buffalo's market doesn't have the same level of competition for labor on large jobs taking place everywhere. Local contractors have to be competitive. In LA, contractors are driving up prices due to high demand. Only major challenge will be that the large structural component (think tower cranes) will be from outside. Many local/regional firms can do work once the shell is up and they'll be competitive the work.Also in LA, when you're project literally takes years, you are at the mercy of changes in material costs, labor costs, lead times, etc. It's what happens when you try to make a statement with a major project, the overruns are orders of magnitude higher. And both of those teams better be good, or that place will be empty. It's moot anyway. New stadium isn't happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 1 hour ago, matter2003 said: How the hell can costs go from $2.2 Billion to $5-6 Billion? Someone is bilking them... How on earth can a stadium cost this much? Do they have champagne and caviar breaks every afternoon for the workers, before they install the gold urinals? Seriously, what kind of palace is this? I get that the land ain’t cheap, but STILL! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 1 hour ago, jeremy2020 said: I'm sure whatever happens, even if the taxpayers didn't agree to fund any of this, they're going to get a big bill for this project. Nah. California voters don't help fund stadiums. This is Kroenke and the NFL's nightmare alone. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 1 hour ago, Jauronimo said: They decided they're content playing in the Dignity Health Sports Park in front of 25,000 indifferent fans. Really they should be content with moving back to SD. Hopefully there is enough of that bridge left that they can cross back over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
without a drought Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 27 minutes ago, Augie said: How on earth can a stadium cost this much? Do they have champagne and caviar breaks every afternoon for the workers, before they install the gold urinals? Seriously, what kind of palace is this? I get that the land ain’t cheap, but STILL! Urinals, how barbaric. It's gold bidets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 1 hour ago, aristocrat said: i mean any project i've ever done i've always put in a 10-20 percent buffer on the budget but 100-200 percent? How the f did they miss so much? Serious requirements creep, aside from the worst planning in the history of project management, is what comes to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 19 minutes ago, without a drought said: Urinals, how barbaric. It's gold bidets. We’ve come a long way from sharing the sinks! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticketssince61 Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 2 hours ago, Seasons1992 said: Considering NYS is now in a $61B hole, there are two things that will happen with any new stadium: 1. Pegula's are paying for it 100%. 2. They retrofit New Era as-is. There's no way in the next 3-5 years they would consider building a brand new place. Also, many owners made their fortunes in real estate and oil (i.e. Pegula) both really hard hit - so not so easy for the owners to pony up any $$$ either I don't think anybody will start building a new stadium in the next few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 I hear there is a stadium in London not used very often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 12 minutes ago, ticketssince61 said: Also, many owners made their fortunes in real estate and oil (i.e. Pegula) both really hard hit - so not so easy for the owners to pony up any $$$ either I don't think anybody will start building a new stadium in the next few years Here's a great example of procrastination paying off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 3 hours ago, boater said: Whether this "portends well" is debatable. But it is certainly meaningful in one way or another. Buffalo is susceptible to price overruns on major construction (why would be a discussion for PPP). But you know costs overruns must be clearly on the mind of major players (Pegula's, Poloncarz, Cuomo) when they are looking at all the alternatives. Even with no projected overruns the county, state and the Pegulas are not in a financial position to consider any stadium thoughts for the near and not so near future. For the foreseeable future the Pegulas are more focused on financially surviving with their teetering sports and hospitality businesses. And to compound their financial status the foundation of their wealth, the energy business, is facing a current financial calamity. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 it would be EXTREMELY tone-deaf given current events to build a brand new stadium and ask taxpayers to foot part of the bill..... but hey we ARE talking about Erie County and New York State, so I could totally see it happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinii Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Right now a new stadium is a unicorn. No one is building anything new due to money concerns, design/layout changes thanks to “distancing”, and some of the so called palaces are going to look funny when they resemble JAX. 7 hours ago, without a drought said: Urinals, how barbaric. It's gold bidets. Gold is a bit ostentatious... don’t you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 11 hours ago, Binghamton Beast said: Honestly, my thoughts are the Pegula's are going to get out of the sports business in the next 5 years. I think they realize the climate of this country and the odds of getting a new stadium are pretty much non-existant. The Sabres have just been a headache to them and the arena is getting older by the day. Too many headaches and there won't be enough revenue coming in. The Sabres have been a headache because they have no clue what they are doing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 12 hours ago, boater said: lolz... you may be closer to the truth than you realize. Why build a palace stadium when the TV contract is most of your revenue? It's nice to have the Chargers pissing off the NFL more than the Bills. Why? In a nutshell, a palace stadium creates more revenue you don’t have to share. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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