Doc Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said: Except it is not a non-issue. Sean stated that both the Saints and the Panthers were discussing compensation with the agent and a bidding war erupted. They maxed out compensation and the player and agent both felt Carolina was a better fit. The Saints were well within their rights to then trade and draft him, but both teams were illegally offering compensation. Both teams should be punished for breaking the rules. The stupidest part is the Saints already had multiple QBs on the roster and were working out Winston- so why go that far and risk your reputation on an UDFA? Especially one that now has almost no chance to make your roster. The agent is the one who should be taken to task for getting the teams into a bidding war and ultimately he cost his client money because he would have made more as an UDFA than a 7th round pick. And as the article suggests, and the NFL knows since they sent a memo, this happens all the time and every team is probably involved in doing it. Payton was just dumb to admit to it and I guess deserves to be fined for stupidity more than anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 LOL teams scrapping over 7th rounders. Let them have their fun. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 11 hours ago, Rochesterfan said: @GunnerBill you summed it up perfectly - I just do not get the Saints obsession on this. I can not see them keeping 3 QBs and Hill as a gadget guy on the roster. If they waive him for the practice squad - Carolina can pick him up for nothing and probably at a lower cost as many 7th round picks get paid less than the more coveted UDFAs. It may be the Saints just did not want the Panthers, a NFC South rival, to get him. Agent may have been using a team too to try to get more money (commission) and reported it when Saints decided to stop and he decided to tattle. Agents should be punished on this as well. I could see an AFC East front office doing same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Limeaid said: It may be the Saints just did not want the Panthers, a NFC South rival, to get him. Agent may have been using a team too to try to get more money (commission) and reported it when Saints decided to stop and he decided to tattle. Agents should be punished on this as well. I could see an AFC East front office doing same thing. Except it was Sean that told the story on a pod cast. He was being smug about how they screwed the Panthers. He is the one that stated both the Saints and the Panthers were in a bidding war. He is the one that stated the agent stopped fielding the Saints calls. Once they could no longer get the agent to talk more money - the Saints then traded back into the round to screw the Panthers. This is all on Sean trying to show how smart they are and in doing so he admitted they broke the rules. They should be punished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Is there a maximum that a team can give an UDFA in an offer? There isn't one for draft picks so they could always work out a better deal as a draft pick with the Saints then as a UDFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, apuszczalowski said: Is there a maximum that a team can give an UDFA in an offer? There isn't one for draft picks so they could always work out a better deal as a draft pick with the Saints then as a UDFA The draft picks are slotted into a salary that covers 4 years (with a 5th year option for the 1st round. There is very little flexibility or guaranteed money for the later draft picks. The UDFAs typically get a smaller GTD “signing bonus” offer to come to camp and that comes out of a pool each team has. Each team has a specified amount of Signing Bonus money for the UDFAs. The teams do have some options of guaranteeing a larger portion of the UDFAs contract meaning they theoretically could get more upfront as an UDFA than a draft pick - especially if both go to the PS. The UDFA contract is also only 3 years - meaning they can renegotiate after 2 years as an RFA and if they outperformed their contract - they can get their second contract sooner and have more guarantees. Finally as an UDFA - you can choose the best fit for your talent versus being drafted by a team that depth wise is worse. In most cases a draft pick will make more than an UDFA if both make the squad and play about 2 years in the league. After that talent and timing on contract will decide which makes more money. Many times the top UDFA will have higher guaranteed money in the initial contract and will make more if both are cut or end up on the PS. Edited May 4, 2020 by Rochesterfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBills1998 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) On 5/2/2020 at 7:00 PM, Don Otreply said: The league will throw the book at them, but won’t touch the patsies... That’s because Robert Kraft has deep pockets and probably gives the big honchos free access into his massage parlor/whorehouses. A disgusting cheating organization with no morales. Edited May 4, 2020 by BuffaloBills1998 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billl Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 5 hours ago, Limeaid said: It may be the Saints just did not want the Panthers, a NFC South rival, to get him. Agent may have been using a team too to try to get more money (commission) and reported it when Saints decided to stop and he decided to tattle. Agents should be punished on this as well. I could see an AFC East front office doing same thing. What authority does the league have to punish agents? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djp14150 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 This is known..you aren’t supposed to negotiate with UDFAs until the draft I’d done nor can you make arrangements pre draft. in theory a UDFA could get paid more than a player slotted spot in the 6th. So a player could make an arrangement with a team saying if I’m not drafted on day 1 or day 2 I will avoid all calls with teams on day 3 to sign with you after the draft. i don’t see what the saints did thst is illegal. lol it appears to me is his agent told them they had a deal with Carolina in place. So he traded into 7th to pick him. in this talking there is no direct contract negotiation but in hypotheticals. All teams do this. It hard to prove. It’s limein politics you donate to a candidate and then you expect a legislative kick back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 25 minutes ago, BuffaloBills1998 said: That’s because Robert Kraft has deep pockets and probably gives the big honchos free access into his massage parlor/whorehouses. A disgusting cheating organization with no morales. Don’t hold back tell us what you really think ? I agree, they cheat at all aspects of life not just sports, it’s an institutional point of pride for the Kraft empire to lie and cheat wherever and whenever they can. We have all witnessed it repeatedly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 On 5/2/2020 at 7:27 PM, MAJBobby said: So Moral of the story. Keep doing what ever team does. Just don’t brag about it. The first rule of fight club is..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 20 minutes ago, KD in CA said: The first rule of fight club is..... Kick the other fighter in the balls so he is not able to fight effectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 I'm sure the Patriots did too, they just have not been caught yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 19 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: I'm sure the Patriots did too, they just have not been caught yet. they all do it. They just don’t go on a Zoom meeting and talk about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 There is also no negotiating until the "legal tampering" window in FA. All the teams stick to that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 8 hours ago, Billl said: What authority does the league have to punish agents? I don’t think any. The NFLPA could fine them or revoke their license, but I doubt they’re interested in doing that over something like this. The NFL could fine or take picks away from the teams involved. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Simple solution: extend the number of rounds in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 44 minutes ago, Doc said: Simple solution: extend the number of rounds in the draft. That is what Beane suggested but doubt NFLPA will support that without compensation (higher % of cut, reducing number of offenses players can be fined with, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 7 hours ago, Limeaid said: Kick the other fighter in the balls so he is not able to fight effectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 On 5/3/2020 at 8:17 AM, Rochesterfan said: Except it is not a non-issue. Sean stated that both the Saints and the Panthers were discussing compensation with the agent and a bidding war erupted. They maxed out compensation and the player and agent both felt Carolina was a better fit. The Saints were well within their rights to then trade and draft him, but both teams were illegally offering compensation. Both teams should be punished for breaking the rules. The stupidest part is the Saints already had multiple QBs on the roster and were working out Winston- so why go that far and risk your reputation on an UDFA? Especially one that now has almost no chance to make your roster. i suspect he makes the roster. If in the taysom roll he can be a special teamer instead of carrying a guy like that, and you develop him elsewhere in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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