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Big Curt

This trade is as risky as the trade for Watkins. Am I the only who feels this way?

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3 minutes ago, WotAGuy said:

I remember the arguments about whether Watkins cost 2 or 3 first round picks....

7, 7 first round picks

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Watkins was an all-or-nothing gamble to provide a weapon for EJ, who, at the time, hadn't really shown any progress. Whaley used that year's first and traded the next year's first to move up.

 

Diggs is a proven vet who's still young and has a reasonable contract, and Josh has shown himself to be a competent NFL QB, continuing to make progress through his second year, so it's not a gamble at all. Beane traded a first round pick, which he might have used on a WR who's never played an NFL down, and some lower picks that may or may not have panned out.

 

In short, the Watkins deal was high priced, high risk, high potential reward.

The Diggs deal is lower priced, lower risk, and at least as high of a potential reward.

 

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4 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

 

Honestly, you probably are pretty near alone on this comparison.  No disrespect, but the situations don't resemble each other in the least. 

 

We used a top 10 pick on an unproven rookie yet to step on the NFL field at WR (Sammy) while also giving away the following years first as well.

 

Diggs - We sent the 22nd pick (which we likely would have used on another unproven rookie WR anyway) for a young PROVEN stud top 10 WR in the NFL and sent some loose change along the way in terms of low round draft choices, 2 of which we got as gimme's for scrubs we were gonna cut anyway last year.

 

To compare the two situations is puzzling to me if I am being straight up.  

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2 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

The watkins deal was made when we were a bad team, with no real cultural direction. Watkins was an unknown commodity, although highly rated, not a proven NFL star. We’ve accumulated draft capital as well as salary cap capital, so making a move like this is feasible, unlike under Whaley who handed out horrible contracts.  There’s always risk with any trade of assets but with the division as wide open as it’s been in 20 years, now is the time. Josh Allen is also proven that he can win with less, unlike EJ.  The Bills Still come out of this trade with  draft picks in rounds 2-7 and plenty of cap.

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Posted (edited)

Risky yes? As risky as Watkins? No ***** way. Watkins was a 1st round pick plus a 4th to trade up 5 spots for a WR who never played a down in the NFL. Diggs is trading pick 22 for a prime WR without an injury history on a big but more than fair contract that is easy to get out of after two seasons. There is risk because you could have just drafted a WR at pick 22 and taken that chance. But I say who dares wins and you go for the proven WR while you have a window to win. 

Edited by billsfan89
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Posted (edited)

They didnt give up a boat load of picks, those picks are garbage.  Its basically are 1st round pick that has any real value and you get the certainty of diggs...not a what if in a rookie WR.  The 5th and 6th were extra picks and next yrs 4th has value of this year's 5th.  That's why u acquire draft capital to do things like this in FA.  Get used to it b/c if played right we will be drafting in the bottom half for a long time and these moves need to be made.  So with pick 22 we select Stephon Diggs...we still have our 2nd,3rd,4th,5th, 6th, 6th and now a 7th.  We had 9 picks entering 2020 draft now 7.  Get off how many picks we gave up.  Look at the player we got.

Edited by bkep32
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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

This trade was done to give us our best chance at winning the super bowl asap.  Period

Edited by NewEra
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Diggs is a much better WR than Watkins can ever dream of being. We needed a WR and we got one. I’m happy to have Diggs even at the cost we gave up for him

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Not sure why the silly comparisons. Both GM's over paid.

I'm beginning to question if Beane can close a good deal and not over pay, except when dealing with ex-Panthers.

I think our defense is in need of a 1st round pick which was dealt. Missing personnel will be replaced with ex-Panthers???

If Josh can step up he will have receivers that can get it done. We will need a TE and another RB for our offense to click.

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15 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  

 

No.   Think of Diggs as the Bills first round draft pick this year.

 

The fifth and sixth rounders are camp fodder, as is the sixth rounder next year....

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I don't think the OP is referring to the actual cost of the trade, but the risk that Diggs doesn't work out here. Which is not without merit.

 

Of course anyone with half a brain can acknowledge the price for Watkins was much steeper. But trading a first rounder is still a risk almost any time you do it. But the Bills feel as though they're ready to compete with the big boys and it makes more sense to make this trade at this stage than it did to make the Watkins one when they did in 2014. And isn't that what we all want?

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11 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

Are we talking about the same young QB that we reached and took midway in the first round to the shock and bemusement of the football world. The one that most people had ranked as a clear second day pick. The one whose teammates called him out for a lack of leadership. That EJ Manuel? 

 

Image result for mistake on top of mistake gif

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18 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

Per your thread title, the answer is:  Yes.

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4 minutes ago, CDogg20 said:

Josh Allen is no EJ Manuel

We don't really know that yet, but even if it turns out that he is the calculus doesn't change.  If Allen busts, then it doesn't matter what other moves are made around him because they aren't winning anything.  If he's legit, this team should be able to change the scoreboard.  

 

JA is entering his make or break season, as extension talk begins in 10 months.  To date, there is substantial disagreement around whether his lack of production has been his own fault or a reflection of the talent around him (or lack thereof).  He now has ample support.  There are no excuses anymore.  If nothing else, McBeane won't have to make a $100,000,000 decision with incomplete information.

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20 minutes ago, Big Curt said:

The Bills have just gave up a boatload of draft picks for a WR.  I admit he is an upgrade for what we currently have, however when a GM named Doug Whaley traded picks for Sammy Watkins, he never lived down that decision. Do you remember why Whaley made the trade? it was to bolster and support a young QB named EJ Manual.  This trade was done for the current young QB Josh Allen.   I hope this works out,  if not, it will be a disaster.  If it doesn't work,  will the fans criticize Beane like they did Whaley?

Is that what his name is? I didn't know

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3 minutes ago, QB Bills said:

I don't think the OP is referring to the actual cost of the trade, but the risk that Diggs doesn't work out here. Which is not without merit.

 

Of course anyone with half a brain can acknowledge the price for Watkins was much steeper. But trading a first rounder is still a risk almost any time you do it. But the Bills feel as though they're ready to compete with the big boys and it makes more sense to make this trade at this stage than it did to make the Watkins one when they did in 2014. And isn't that what we all want?

The conclusion that the risk of an established top-tier NFL wideout not working out is comparable to the risk that a rookie wideout won't IS without merit.

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Not sure what the risk is. The Bills are going for it and right now are probably the most talented team in the division. 
 

It’s year 3 of Josh Allen! Got to get the kid some players around him before you have to pay him. 
 

 

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Posted (edited)

The only risk comes by way of not doing a trade like this.  The risk of selecting a WR  22nd  that turns out to be a number one, is far greater than the risk of trading that pick and a future 4th for an established #1. The extra 5th and sixth most likely would not have made our team, thus making it moot.

Edited by TYSONKO1
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