Senior Bowl week

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 1/20/2020 at 3:50 PM, H2o said:

Edwards backed out is what I read earlier. 

 

https://www.thestate.com/sports/college/university-of-south-carolina/usc-football/article239461838.html

 

Aiyuk too.  Sounded like Beane likes him some Aiyuk.

[SCBills]

I'm all in on drafting 2 WR's in the first 3 rounds (if we don't grab one in FA) - This class is just too good to not double dip, especially given our need.

 

Draft Pick

John Brown

Cole Beasley

Draft Pick

Duke Williams

Andre Roberts

 

Edited January 22, 2020 by SCBills

[Buffalo Junction]

15 hours ago, DJB said:

 

Too bad he measured in short. I usually saw him listed over 6 feet. That's disappointing. 

 

Thanks for the injury update however

I’m not as gung-ho over height as long as they’re over 5’ 10”. If they’re at that mark other traits can make up for it. If a guy is 5’ 11”, but has a giant wingspan and vertical coupled with serious speed, suddenness, and/ fluidity it’s fine. The one thing I want to see above all others is a WR who fights for the ball like it’s their god given right to catch it. 

[thenorthremembers]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

I’m not as gung-ho over height as long as they’re over 5’ 10”. If they’re at that mark other traits can make up for it. If a guy is 5’ 11”, but has a giant wingspan and vertical coupled with serious speed, suddenness, and/ fluidity it’s fine. The one thing I want to see above all others is a WR who fights for the ball like it’s their god given right to catch it. 

Not sure I like Aiyuk as much as others seem to.  He is a good route runner, offers you position flexibility, special teams, high points because of his long arms but I am not a huge fan of his hands or speed.   I can see him as a mid to high 4.4 guy but at 5'11 I'd much rather him show more speed in space.

[Buffalo Junction]

16 hours ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

What exactly is "nuanced route running"?

Head fake, eyes, setting up double moves with consistency, proper and consistent use of leverage. Van Jefferson should be good at this considering his father was a NFL WR and has been a WR coach in the NFL for over a decade (currently NYJ). My concern is that Van Jefferson is maxed out physically and close to his limit with coaching. The flipside of that is he’s probably an instant upgrade to depth and could be a value as an instant WR 3. 

[H2o]

26 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Aiyuk too.  Sounded like Beane likes him some Aiyuk.

I hope Beane loves him some Chase Claypool as well. Banging the table for this guy right here. 

 

https://fightingirishwire.usatoday.com/2020/01/21/chase-claypools-good-start-to-senior-bowl-week/

 

 

[PetermansRedemption]

18 hours ago, HappyDays said:

I can't believe I'm saying this but I'll actually be disappointed if we draft a WR in the 1st, unless someone like Ruggs somehow falls. There's ridiculous 2nd and 3rd round value at that position this year. I don't see that much of a drop off from Tee Higgins to a player like Michael Pittman. I'm back to thinking we need to draft an edge rusher in the 1st.

Why not both 

[Buffalo Junction]

17 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

Not sure I like Aiyuk as much as others seem to.  He is a good route runner, offers you position flexibility, special teams, high points because of his long arms but I am not a huge fan of his hands or speed.   I can see him as a mid to high 4.4 guy but at 5'11 I'd much rather him show more speed in space.

I view him similarly to Deebo Samuel (IIRC 40 was 4.7-8). Not quite as physical, but excellent burst right after catching the ball and the kid has excellent YAC ability. Plus, Aiyuk did the JUCO route, so there’s plenty of room to grow technique and experience wise. If he’s there at our 2nd pick I’d be rather content with the selection. I think he’d make McKenzie expendable. 

[thenorthremembers]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

I view him similarly to Deebo Samuel (IIRC 40 was 4.7-8). Not quite as physical, but excellent burst right after catching the ball and the kid has excellent YAC ability. Plus, Aiyuk did the JUCO route, so there’s plenty of room to grow technique and experience wise. If he’s there at our 2nd pick I’d be rather content with the selection. I think he’d make McKenzie expendable. 

I think thats a great comparison, Deebo was a 4.48 guy and thats exactly where I expect Aiyuk to come out.   I think Samuel was much better with the ball in his hands that Aiyuk showed over his two years at Arizona State, but I think Aiyuk is more of a threat at the second level.

 

Arizona State tried to get Aiyuk in space on screens and flats but it just didnt seem to take.   He isnt slow by any means, he just seems to be more of a build up fast guy than sudden.

30 minutes ago, H2o said:

I hope Beane loves him some Chase Claypool as well. Banging the table for this guy right here. 

 

https://fightingirishwire.usatoday.com/2020/01/21/chase-claypools-good-start-to-senior-bowl-week/

 

 

I am a big Notre Dame guy, and love some of the highlight reel catches Claypool made while there, but I just dont think he has enough speed to be a full time NFL wideout.   Way too big of a guy to struggle with contested catches, and his release at the LOS may be an issue.   If he was a better blocker I'd say move him to off the ball tight end.   I think he will be a project.  

 

If you want a big wideout you have to go Pittman Jr. over Claypool.

[H2o]

7 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

I am a big Notre Dame guy, and love some of the highlight reel catches Claypool made while there, but I just dont think he has enough speed to be a full time NFL wideout.   Way too big of a guy to struggle with contested catches, and his release at the LOS may be an issue.   If he was a better blocker I'd say move him to off the ball tight end.   I think he will be a project.  

 

If you want a big wideout you have to go Pittman Jr. over Claypool.

I like Pittman, but Claypool has a gear and hops that Pittman doesn't have. He also excels with the contested catches. He runs a solid route tree and you could see him gain separation from any defender. Book missed him in many instances, not seeing the field well. People saying he should switch to TE are going to be disappointed when he becomes a really good, if not great, WR in the NFL. Watch the combine. I've been telling people for a long time he's Mike Evans 2.0 and the numbers will tell you the same. 

[Buffalo Junction]

5 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

I think thats a great comparison, Deebo was a 4.48 guy and thats exactly where I expect Aiyuk to come out.   I think Samuel was much better with the ball in his hands that Aiyuk showed over his two years at Arizona State, but I think Aiyuk is more of a threat at the second level.

 

Arizona State tried to get Aiyuk in space on screens and flats but it just didnt seem to take.   He isnt slow by any means, he just seems to be more of a build up fast guy than sudden.

Aiyuk doesn’t seem to have the same lateral agility as Samuel. That said, I love the kids ability to read the open field and weave through defenders... dangerous on slants; sudden on a 45, but not so much on a 90. Aiyuk goes from 2nd gear to 3rd in a hurry. Samuel on the other hand has RB moves and size. I’ve only seen a few of Aiyuk games though, so I’m giving a bit of a hollow opinion. Samuel I watched for years since I was living in Carolina at the time. 

[thenorthremembers]

34 minutes ago, H2o said:

I like Pittman, but Claypool has a gear and hops that Pittman doesn't have. He also excels with the contested catches. He runs a solid route tree and you could see him gain separation from any defender. Book missed him in many instances, not seeing the field well. People saying he should switch to TE are going to be disappointed when he becomes a really good, if not great, WR in the NFL. Watch the combine. I've been telling people for a long time he's Mike Evans 2.0 and the numbers will tell you the same. 

Totally agree on the Book thing, he under threw him a lot on 9 routes, it was kind of frustrating.    I also agree he is faster than Pittman, just not by a lot.  

 

Where I disagree is on the contested catch thing.  He was inconsistent there.   When I compare him with Pittman I just think Jr. is more of a nuanced player.    Finds the zone better, runs better routes near the line of scrimmage, blocks better and those are the things I'd look for in a pure X wideout.

 

We will see though, and as a Notre Dame guy I am hoping you're right.

[H2o]

33 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Aiyuk doesn’t seem to have the same lateral agility as Samuel. That said, I love the kids ability to read the open field and weave through defenders... dangerous on slants; sudden on a 45, but not so much on a 90. Aiyuk goes from 2nd gear to 3rd in a hurry. Samuel on the other hand has RB moves and size. I’ve only seen a few of Aiyuk games though, so I’m giving a bit of a hollow opinion. Samuel I watched for years since I was living in Carolina at the time. 

Deebo reminds me a lot of Eric Moulds when I watch him on the field

[Formerly Allan in MD]

49 minutes ago, H2o said:

I like Pittman, but Claypool has a gear and hops that Pittman doesn't have. He also excels with the contested catches. He runs a solid route tree and you could see him gain separation from any defender. Book missed him in many instances, not seeing the field well. People saying he should switch to TE are going to be disappointed when he becomes a really good, if not great, WR in the NFL. Watch the combine. I've been telling people for a long time he's Mike Evans 2.0 and the numbers will tell you the same. 

Mike Evans 2.0 works for me.

[Buffalo Junction]

1 hour ago, H2o said:

Deebo reminds me a lot of Eric Moulds when I watch him on the field

I can’t make the leap. There are some stunning similarities. Particularly with how they can both play(ed) physical, maintain concentration on the ball and their body control. However, Moulds was often the best athlete on the field. Just bigger, stronger, and faster than any of the secondary players, so it’s difficult to compare Deebo to that for me... Almost unfair... As a proper modern comparison might be to stick Deebos skill set DK Metcalfs body. Wouldn’t be fair to compare Metcalf either since Moulds had more agility and flexibility which is obvious when you watch them sink their hips. DK has that Moulds stiff arm though. Moulds was just a freak

[thenorthremembers]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

I can’t make the leap. There are some stunning similarities. Particularly with how they can both play(ed) physical, maintain concentration on the ball and their body control. However, Moulds was often the best athlete on the field. Just bigger, stronger, and faster than any of the secondary players, so it’s difficult to compare Deebo to that for me... Almost unfair... As a proper modern comparison might be to stick Deebos skill set DK Metcalfs body. Wouldn’t be fair to compare Metcalf either since Moulds had more agility and flexibility which is obvious when you watch them sink their hips. DK has that Moulds stiff arm though. Moulds was just a freak

A.J. Brown from the Titans reminds me a lot of Moulds.   A

[Ayjent]

20 hours ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Van Jefferson looks uncoverable. Impressed. 

He was abusing that kid from LSU Stingley who is an absolute beast of a CB.  I'm biased as a UF fan and alum, but he played with a lot of inaccurate QBs, and then when they finally had a QB who didn't suck throwing the ball, he had more production, but Trask has a water gun for an arm.  Jefferson and Pittman would be a great combo and could definitely happen in rounds 2 and 3 if the Bills were so inclined.  I think the Bills need OL and DE as top priorities too.  But giving Josh weapons is necessary to help him progress - Jefferson and Pittman are both great blockers too (Pittman is by far the best of the class - he actually looks like he loves blocking).  Jefferson is just excellent at creating separation out of his break, but does have a tendency to maneuver too much when trying to create separation to start off deep routes, but would be a beast in the intermediate passing game, but he also knows how to set up defenders for back shoulder throws.  Pittman is actually way better on deep routes than his speed would suggest, too.

[Chicken Boo]

Keeping an eye on Collin Johnson out of TX.  6'6" 220.

Edited January 22, 2020 by Chicken Boo

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 1/20/2020 at 1:55 PM, Canadian Bills Fan said:

 

I would love to have Hooper, Knox, and Sweeney

that sounds pretty lovable 

[Buffalo Junction]

15 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

A.J. Brown from the Titans reminds me a lot of Moulds.   A

AJ Brown might be the closest physical comparison to Moulds. I haven’t watched much of him in in Tenn aside from when we played them. 
 

5 minutes ago, Ayjent said:

He was abusing that kid from LSU Stingley who is an absolute beast of a CB.  I'm biased as a UF fan and alum, but he played with a lot of inaccurate QBs, and then when they finally had a QB who didn't suck throwing the ball, he had more production, but Trask has a water gun for an arm.  Jefferson and Pittman would be a great combo and could definitely happen in rounds 2 and 3 if the Bills were so inclined.  I think the Bills need OL and DE as top priorities too.  But giving Josh weapons is necessary to help him progress - Jefferson and Pittman are both great blockers too (Pittman is by far the best of the class - he actually looks like he loves blocking).  Jefferson is just excellent at creating separation out of his break, but does have a tendency to maneuver too much when trying to create separation to start off deep routes, but would be a beast in the intermediate passing game, but he also knows how to set up defenders for back shoulder throws.  Pittman is actually way better on deep routes than his speed would suggest, too.

Nice breakdown. My Jefferson concerns are that he can get outmuscled by physical press corners, and that he’s a high-floor low-ceiling prospect. The latter isn’t necessarily a bad thing if he’s available in rounds 3-5. I’d be pretty happy if Beane spent a 3rd to draft a rookie that is better than all our depth WRs by game 1 of the regular season. Plus he grew up in an NFL household, so he’s not going to be shocked by the schedule and work demands.