My Off-Season Primer: Position Group: WR

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

 

I guess if we are talking about maybe $1 million guaranteed and the rest incentives then Sure, but if we are giving him a fully guaranteed contract, no way. Additionally, if he gets injured and lands on IR, his contract becomes fully guaranteed, so that is another risk...you spent the money for an oft injured player and then he goes on IR and the money is committed now.

Only does IF after season starts and he was on the roster week 1, other than that Injury Settlements will occur

[colin]

sick work MAJB!

 

given that bean was involved in AB and OBJ trade talks, i think it's clear he knows he needs a monster WR, and is willing to pay.

 

if green or cooper are available to us, i think he's 100% in the running.

 

i also think we can two or three of

top flight WR

sick TE (hoops)

top flight DE

solid/sick RT

 

in free agency, or get a top one of one of them, and decent upgrade in the other three.  

 

we could do this by front loading contracts by having first year salary guaranteed so it hits now while we have lots of cap room, clearing up room later for us to sign Tre, milano, dawkins, and then later on Edmunds and allen.

 

i could see bean trading up to get the WR he really wants (or perhaps DE, but i don't think there are any who would be available) in the draft, but im always concerned about a WR coming in and making an impact as a rookie, and that's the single position which would change our team the most.  RB and CB tend to be good out the box.

[Solomon Grundy]

5 hours ago, Ayjent said:

For those of you wanting some video of the prospects - I like these every snap videos because you can see a couple of things that the highlights won't show you - effort on every down, blocking, how they get off the LOS, the variety of places they would line up, and how teams would play against them.  I tried to put the games against the best teams they faced if it was available for realistic targets the Bills may have the chance to get if they stay put at 22 or lower rounds.

 

Tee Higgins vs South Carolina (good Defense, two nice TD catches)

Justin Jefferson vs Auburn (not going to make you a big fan of him - some inconsistent effort IMO and I like Jefferson - but the more I watch these game snap videos the less I like Jefferson and the more I like other players)

Michael Pittman Jr vs Utah (very good game for Pittman, also notice the effort on blocking - springs a TD run and several other solid efforts lead to good runs - I really like him for the Bills, his all around game and ability to adjust to throws not on target, run after catch, and blocking) -

Chase Claypool vs Georgia (nice catches at the end, but I see why he isn't in the Day 1 or 2 conversation, struggles getting off press for a big guy, not a great receiver in traffic)

Gabriel Davis vs Pitt (good size, sometimes inconsistent effort, but leading AAC receiver and ability to go after the ball)

Van Jefferson vs LSU (hard to assess Jefferson's career, played with subpar QB, but he plays a good deal against Stingley who is one of the best CBs in the country)

Freddie Swain vs Georgia (late round to UDFA slot receiver - has good speed and runs good routes, pretty decent hands as well)

Joe Reed vs FSU (late round to UDFA - very good kick returner, good size, speed and hands - a guy that could easily be a guy that could take over for both Roberts' and McKenzie's roles)

 

 

Ideally, I really like Pittman Jr and Reed - two tough WRs that are good blockers, physical, and have good body control.  I also like bringing in Swain for a back up slot WR if he is an UDFA.  Maybe these aren't elite players, but they are guys that will bring effort and skills that the Bills are a little short on.

Shenault has all of these guys attributes in one package 

Edited January 13, 2020 by the skycap

[Ayjent]

14 minutes ago, the skycap said:

Shenault has all of these guys attributes in one package 

I don't know.  I can't say I watched him much during the year, and it's one of those guys like Blaine Gabbert where you pay attention to college football all year and you watch a lot of games and then the draft comes around and some guy that made very little noise during the season is rated higher than guys that you saw balling out all year - and not for a lack of exposure being in a Power 5 conference.

 

I just watched a couple of games with all of his snaps.  Can't say I see what the fuss is from what I've watched.  He's got speed and a good build, pretty good route runner too.  Not much of a blocker, not really good at judging balls and adjusting to off target throws, and certainly not someone who makes contested catches, but I've got to watch more so I'll reserve full judgment.

 

[Putin]

2 hours ago, matter2003 said:

 

I guess if we are talking about maybe $1 million guaranteed and the rest incentives then Sure, but if we are giving him a fully guaranteed contract, no way. Additionally, if he gets injured and lands on IR, his contract becomes fully guaranteed, so that is another risk...you spent the money for an oft injured player and then he goes on IR and the money is committed now.

So what is your solution? And BTW injuries happen we took a gamble and  made him the highest paid Center in the NFL who is potentially one more concussion away from retirement , me personally I'm all about the draft if we have to move up to get our future #1 WR I'm ALL FOR IT , but I would love having EJ Green here for couple of years until the rookie develops and can take over , and IMO can you really find a better guy for  your rookie can learn from the Green ? 

Lets not forget this is year 3 for Josh we need to make sure he has EVERYTHING to take another step forward , because this time there will be no more excuses this offense has to get to the middle of the pack if we want to contend for the division , we must score more points we can not expect our defense to keep opponents under 20 points every game , 

 

Edited January 13, 2020 by Putin

[ngbills]

Without WR help and/or TE help its hard to imagine this offense drastically improving. Just look at the Super Bowl favorites: KC - Solid WR's and Kelce or SF - Solid WR's and Kittle.

 

 

[Ayjent]

3 hours ago, Putin said:

So what is your solution? And BTW injuries happen we took a gamble and  made him the highest paid Center in the NFL who is potentially one more concussion away from retirement , me personally I'm all about the draft if we have to move up to get our future #1 WR I'm ALL FOR IT , but I would love having EJ Green here for couple of years until the rookie develops and can take over , and IMO can you really find a better guy for  your rookie can learn from the Green ? 

Lets not forget this is year 3 for Josh we need to make sure he has EVERYTHING to take another step forward , because this time there will be no more excuses this offense has to get to the middle of the pack if we want to contend for the division , we must score more points we can not expect our defense to keep opponents under 20 points every game , 

 

Yes, this Offense needs to get better, but I think a lot of people are lukewarm on Green because of his age, how little he has played recently and how much it would likely cost.  If we are talking a guy that comes in as a complimentary receiver Green might be a good fit, but he isn't likely to be a guy you would count on for 1200 yds as a WR1 no matter what team you are. He also doesn't have that reputation as a team guy that teaches - he may be, but I've never heard that and usually you would hear about that after a season where he was sidelined.  The Bills can be more selective and I think they want a guy that can come in for a longer stint than Green and build a relationship with Josh.  Maybe Perriman is the guy, but I'm wondering whether the Bucs might be willing to deal Evans, especially if they need ammo to move up and get their guy at QB.  A lot of people are thinking they will go with the Oregon QB, Herbert, but they may want to make a run at another QB - Licht is a terrible GM, but he knows the WR position and he'll be able to spot another one in this draft.  They have so many good receivers and I'm not sure that they aren't going to with Godwin as their No. 1 as they try to find a new option at QB.  The Jameis Winston era has come to a close based off of Arians' comment and they may be looking to put money into shoring up their D and OL.

[Putin]

2 minutes ago, Ayjent said:

Yes, this Offense needs to get better, but I think a lot of people are lukewarm on Green because of his age, how little he has played recently and how much it would likely cost.  If we are talking a guy that comes in as a complimentary receiver Green might be a good fit, but he isn't likely to be a guy you would count on for 1200 yds as a WR1 no matter what team you are. He also doesn't have that reputation as a team guy that teaches - he may be, but I've never heard that and usually you would hear about that after a season where he was sidelined.  The Bills can be more selective and I think they want a guy that can come in for a longer stint than Green and build a relationship with Josh.  Maybe Perriman is the guy, but I'm wondering whether the Bucs might be willing to deal Evans, especially if they need ammo to move up and get their guy at QB.  A lot of people are thinking they will go with the Oregon QB, Herbert, but they may want to make a run at another QB - Licht is a terrible GM, but he knows the WR position and he'll be able to spot another one in this draft.  They have so many good receivers and I'm not sure that they aren't going to with Godwin as their No. 1 as they try to find a new option at QB.  The Jameis Winston era has come to a close based off of Arians' comment and they may be looking to put money into shoring up their D and OL.

Evens ( IMO ) would definitely be a top accusation if we were some how able to pull that of , 

[billsfan89]

I think Cooper is a good player who would help the offense. But I think he is a bit too inconsistent (Has a case of the dropsies now and again along with disappearing in certain games) to justify his expected large contract (I would say he gets 17-18 million aav.) I think AJ Green is hurt too much recently, I would love to take him on a one year prove it deal (even if it is a 14 million dollar deal) but I think he is going to want to get a multi-year deal which he might get. Emmanuel Sanders isn't the type of WR the team needs and is a bit older. Larry Fitz I don't see playing outside of Arizona. 

 

As far as guys like Robby Anderson and Perriman I would love them both on a one year deal for 10ish million but I think both want that big multi-year contract. I think in the end the Bills are probably going to address WR in round 1 unless a trade that is advantageous comes along. I just don't see the team dipping into a big acquisition for Cooper or being able to get a bridge deal with any of the vets. 

[Putin]

12 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

I think Cooper is a good player who would help the offense. But I think he is a bit too inconsistent (Has a case of the dropsies now and again along with disappearing in certain games) to justify his expected large contract (I would say he gets 17-18 million aav.) I think AJ Green is hurt too much recently, I would love to take him on a one year prove it deal (even if it is a 14 million dollar deal) but I think he is going to want to get a multi-year deal which he might get. Emmanuel Sanders isn't the type of WR the team needs and is a bit older. Larry Fitz I don't see playing outside of Arizona. 

 

As far as guys like Robby Anderson and Perriman I would love them both on a one year deal for 10ish million but I think both want that big multi-year contract. I think in the end the Bills are probably going to address WR in round 1 unless a trade that is advantageous comes along. I just don't see the team dipping into a big acquisition for Cooper or being able to get a bridge deal with any of the vets. 

I don’t think we can count on a rookie to come in and take a #1 WR spot , I agree with you we should use our 1st round pick on a WR like I said before even if we have to move few spots , but I still think we need a proven vet who can come in and be a legitimate # 1 WR that we desperately NEED , even if it’s only for a year or two and don’t forget we were very lucky to go through a whole year without an injury (IMO) we have to add another WR a #3 type  unless of course Duke can show some more improvement in the TC and the preseason... 

Edited January 14, 2020 by Putin

[CEN-CAL17]

If you’re considering Tier 2, rounds 3-5.... Move up Proche, Mims and Bryan Edwards!!!

 

Also add to the Tier 2 list, Omar Bayless WR Arkansas St.... how that dude is not on your post is beyond me. YouTube his documentary, total McD guy, mature and beat all odds!

 

Also, move Aiyuk up to Tier 1.... he’s gonna be a top 60 pick.... some would argue top 5 WRs in this years Draft. I think he goes between Pick 40-50.

Edited January 14, 2020 by CEN-CAL17

[billsfan89]

1 hour ago, Putin said:

I don’t think we can count on a rookie to come in and take a #1 WR spot , I agree with you we should use our 1st round pick on a WR like I said before even if we have to move few spots , but I still think we need a proven vet who can come in and be a legitimate # 1 WR that we desperately NEED , even if it’s only for a year or two and don’t forget we were very lucky to go through a whole year without an injury (IMO) we have to add another WR a #3 type  unless of course Duke can show some more improvement in the TC and the preseason... 

 

The catch 22 is outside of Cooper (who will come at an insane cost) what vet on the market can come in and fill that need and be healthy? I agree that it would be optimal to get a WR1 who is a vet as opposed to counting on a rookie but is Robby Anderson that much better than a first round pick?

 

I like the depth argument better but I just don't see what reciever on the market makes sense for the Bills.

[njbuff]

 

[Ayjent]

34 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

That’s an impressive game. Watched a little of him but didn’t see this game. 

[CSBill]

On 1/10/2020 at 3:26 PM, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

I'd be OK with the one year AJ Green prove it deal.  But is risky to the Bills if he can't play much, then we're back in the same spot as this past season. I also agree with the tier II WR, then only other tier I I'd consider would be Robby Anderson only because I don't think he'll be obscenely expensive. 

 

I  wouldn't draft a WR in round 1, I'd prefer to wait to round 2 or even 3.  My reasoning is I'd prefer to see a pas rusher in the first round as harder to find them in FA than WR  If they want to take a second one late would be OK with that too.

 

Looking at the numbers, you have Brown, Beasly and Roberts returning.  Signing a FA and draft one, you're up to five. That leaves at most one slot left assuming they went with six which wasn't the case this past year.  That means Foster, McKenzie, and Duke are battling for maybe one spot.  Of the three I'd give the edge to McKenzie as they like him for the gimmick plays he brings and his ST play.

 

If we sign a FA, like Green, or any of the tier 2 guys MAJ Bobby identifies (or someone in a trade), we still need to draft a WR high. The FA gives the draftee time to develop, and takes the pressure off of him having to contribute in a big way early. I would definitely take Green on a one yr prove-it deal, and a corollary move of a top of the draft guy.

Edited January 14, 2020 by CSBill

[Big Turk]

15 hours ago, Putin said:

So what is your solution? And BTW injuries happen we took a gamble and  made him the highest paid Center in the NFL who is potentially one more concussion away from retirement , me personally I'm all about the draft if we have to move up to get our future #1 WR I'm ALL FOR IT , but I would love having EJ Green here for couple of years until the rookie develops and can take over , and IMO can you really find a better guy for  your rookie can learn from the Green ? 

Lets not forget this is year 3 for Josh we need to make sure he has EVERYTHING to take another step forward , because this time there will be no more excuses this offense has to get to the middle of the pack if we want to contend for the division , we must score more points we can not expect our defense to keep opponents under 20 points every game , 

 

 

Draft a rookie. Pretty sure he could learn just fine from Brown and Beasley.

 

I'm not sure what people's obsession is with guys on the wrong side of 30 who have played 1 game in 2 years and who have a very high likelihood of having a chronic injury with multiple reoccurrences over that period of time after resting for a long period of time and having multiple surgeries.

 

Yes he was a very good player. He ain't that player anymore and never will be again. Move on. Stop living in the past. The NFL is about the future and Green's future is not very great.

Edited January 14, 2020 by matter2003

[Royale with Cheese]

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