Some All 22 observations on the Texans game that I’ve yet to see elsewhere

[Sundancer]

49 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Again - miss the point. Throw was not perfect. Throw was perfect we have easy catch for td. Brown catch was bad. So we have a less than perfect throw with bad work from wr. 

 

The route was taking Brown out of bounds, not to the end zone. 

 

The only way that's a TD is if Brown runs a 3 yard deeper route. That's never a TD. 

[Scott7975]

Just now, Sundancer said:

 

Yeah I noticed it after I posted. Thank you. I have no freaking clue what Brown was thinking there. Didn’t even need to leave his feet. 

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, Sundancer said:

 

That was a bad play, but you see Knox drop back and make eye contact with Josh, so it was on their minds...Josh just didn't get it out of his mind as he was spinning and went down.  

 

You don't do that at the end of a 20 yards scramble that got you to the 50 yard line with over a minute to get to FG range to tie the game.  

 

It was the same thing we were knocking him for when he was heaving passes as he was being taken down earlier in the season the resulted inn INTs.

 

It was a poor decision:  all risk, no possible reward.  The math should be very easy there...

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

6 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

Brown is a good receiver--those were just two bad plays. I'm not worried about him. Knox and Morse had no-blocks on the Allen run to the right. Williams dropped a TD. Allen fumbled when the tackler breathed on him. To quote McDermott, those plays showed they are not Championship Caliber...yet. 

worried, no. I’d feel much better if he was In Isaiah McKenzie’s spot with Donald driver and sterling Sharpe replicas ahead of him. 
 

yeah. I remember watching the hofers grow up and go from hoping to make the dance to the team to beat.  This team was fun to watch every week because they were almost never out of it. That’s really all I ask. 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

 

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

Yeah I noticed it after I posted. Thank you. I have no freaking clue what Brown was thinking there. Didn’t even need to leave his feet. 

 

Yeah, well it looks like speed isn't the only thing you can't teach....

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You don't do that at the end of a 20 yards scramble that got you to the 50 yard line with over a minute to get to FG range to tie the game.  

 

It was the same thing we were knocking him for when he was heaving passes as he was being taken down earlier in the season the resulted inn INTs.

 

It was a poor decision:  all risk, no possible reward.  The math should be very easy there...

if knox caught it and scored a game winning TD it’s on top 100 all time nfl plays. 
 

The day hero ball works we’re all gonna go nuts!!! 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

if knox caught it and scored a game winning TD it’s on top 100 all time nfl plays. 
 

The day hero ball works we’re all gonna go nuts!!! 

 

 

It would be for sure.  

[CincyBillsFan]

12 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

Brown is a good receiver--those were just two bad plays. I'm not worried about him. Knox and Morse had no-blocks on the Allen run to the right. Williams dropped a TD. Allen fumbled when the tackler breathed on him. To quote McDermott, those plays showed they are not Championship Caliber...yet. 

 

I agree that Brown is a good receiver and everyone has bad plays.  Allen had a couple in the game to.  I think what we're trying to say to those piling on Allen is that for a first playoff game he did alright.  Folks can obsess all they want about Allen's circus lateral but the reality is that with a little help from his WR's and a block on that sweep we'd be celebrating Allen leading us to a win and playing a fantastic game. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

I agree that Brown is a good receiver and everyone has bad plays.  Allen had a couple in the game to.  I think what we're trying to say to those piling on Allen is that for a first playoff game he did alright.  Folks can obsess all they want about Allen's circus lateral but the reality is that with a little help from his WR's and a block on that sweep we'd be celebrating Allen leading us to a win and playing a fantastic game. 

to me the more salient point is he did alright on average...  for each wtf are you doing moment there were some how the eff did he do that moments that you can’t help but think we will see more of as he grows. 
 

the throws he makes rolling To his right that are all arm were really awesome.  

[ngbills]

4 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

You have no point. Hit him perfectly in stride on the route he was running (corner route from a bunch formation inside the numbers, without breaking stride). If he kept his feet just running instead of that dumb hop it’s first and goal inside the 5. 
 
you see most any starting wideout make that play regularly with ease, a number of running backs and The third string qb from the saints. 

 

that wouldn’t have even been a catch in college ball. It’s a fail all on him. 

Yes - fail on him. Also not a perfect pass sorry. The throw is late and too far to the corner. Watch the entire play not just the catch on the sidelines. He throws it sooner and it is a TD. 

[ngbills]

4 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

I mean anyone that thinks this was anything other but a good throw and bad play by Brown needs to watch more football.  Plenty of room here. If I wasn’t on my phone I’d post the replay as well. Brown was complete garbage on this play...

 

Watch the entire play not just the catch. Allen throws this ball sooner it is an easy catch for a td. Not trying to say Brown should not still make that play. But Allen would tell you himself he threw the ball a bit late and two far outside. Brown beat his man immediately and it was an easy TD. Watch closely and brown even throws his arm up - ball should have been thrown then as he passed the numbers not all the way to the sideline where he needs to even slow down and keep is feet in. 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by ngbills

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

36 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Yes - fail on him. Also not a perfect pass sorry. The throw is late and too far to the corner. Watch the entire play not just the catch on the sidelines. He throws it sooner and it is a TD. 

hit brown right where he was running in stride. That is perfect.

 

If he led brown to the end zone brown wouldn’t have adjusted and it would have sailed over his head. we have seen that all year. that was a corner route, that’s how a corner route is run, and that pass is perfect to the sideline allowing a toe tap and clock stop...  that is simply the route brown ran... 
 

say it with me PURR ....   FICT     PASS 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[LABILLBACKER]

Nothing screams go route more than our two worst offensive players Smith & Dimarco.

 

The oline coach might want to show Knox, Ford & Morse how to block 1 single player.

 

If Duke or Smoke make those catches in the first half it's a different game.

 

Still waiting to see if Beasley was ever found. And Devin had a monster game with the exception of terrible blocking.

 

Josh had a typical game where 66% he looked like Superman and 33% Dumb and Dumber.

 

Sure glad Gore was in there for Yeldon?

 

House money was money

 

I thought I'd feel better 3 days later but I don't. That one hurt.

[K-9]

Just a thought and really no basis to it, but I wonder if both Brown and Beasley weren’t a little bit rusty given they hadn’t played in two weeks. In the past we’ve seen players coming off bye weeks that look a bit flat. Anyway, just a thought like I said.

[ngbills]

11 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

hit brown right where he was running in stride. That is perfect.

 

If he led brown to the end zone brown wouldn’t have adjusted and it would have sailed over his head. we have seen that all year. that was a corner route, that’s how a corner route is run, and that pass is perfect to the sideline allowing a toe tap and clock stop...  that is simply the route brown ran... 
 

say it with me PURR ....   FICT     PASS 

 

We can agree to disagree. When a WR raises his he is usually saying get me the ball I am wide fricken open. Not wait a few more seconds and put it on the sidelines to stop the clock. 

 

I played in college and a bit post college, then coached for a number of years. I have watched enough film to know a thing or two. Like I said not an awful pass just one Josh and Brown would want back and get that ball out sooner so Brown gets in the end zone with it. 

[PolishPrince]

16 hours ago, K-9 said:

Terrible plays by Brown. Just not NFL caliber. Especially on the first pass. Josh has little margin for error as it is so it’s really frustrating when he can’t get just a little help out there. 

And we wonder why Josh occasionally feels like he "needs to do it all himself." 

[Thurman#1]

On 1/7/2020 at 2:42 PM, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Nerded out and rewatched the game.  Saw a bunch of key moments that hadn't already been noted I think. 

 

mods feel free to kill if it’s redundant. Tried to be objective. 

 

1) first half score was so close to being 21-0 or at least 17:  

- we saw brown miss that sideline ball, to me it looked like would’ve set them up on the 2, but right before that play, there was a false start, whistle, josh spiked the ball in the dirt, then two Texans hit him and knocked him to the ground. No call. Blatant PF at least offsetting the false start or maybe it was a shift, which I could not see anywhere 

2) Devin Singletary was the best offensive player by far. His vision, slipperiness, agility... he might be in the conversation this time next year as one of the best in the league. He also made clutch third down plays and really tough catches. Add an off-season of pro football everything... excited! A great screen offense would really maximize him. 
 

3) #22 Conley was holding and clutching brown at the top of his routes all game long. When the refs put the whistle away, you can not rely on ‘smurfs’ to separate. In general lots of uncalled clutching and grabbing on him, Beasley McKenzie and evening knox. 

 

4) speaking of Brown, his body control around the boundary was not very good at all. Several times losing catches to the sideline. Dukes was actually very good at the same and Duke also stood as getting consistent separation. Interested to see where this goes. 
 

5) that OT heave to Dimarco, that the leotard guy chastised him for...  turns out the Texans rushed two guys and dropped 8, and kept a spy. The two guys deep downfield were him and lee Smith. Singletary was well short of the line to gain, and the other guys were bracketed. They subbed in that package for that play then lined up 5 wide with that!!! brutal call.  I guess Daboll outsmarted himself

 

6)Josh losing his mind taking those two awful sacks was discussed thoroughly, but on the third down play, Texans rushed 3 guys, bills had 7 man protection and they stunted at lee smith who didn’t know who to block so impeded neither and Singletary wiffed too while all 5 linemen blocked watt or air. No chance for the QB. 
 

7) Dawson Knox Looks like a Timid blocker. He and Morse missed the LB in OT on that Josh sweep.  There were several running plays I noticed if it wasn’t a DB, he wasn’t hitting the block hard enough to to make a difference of just whiffing all together. 

 

8.) McKenzie Looked to almost caused an INT, his come back route was to the sideline instead of attacking the ball, the corner actually played it better. He’s seemingly a jet sweep specialist and otherwise window dressing. Need a big upgrade here 

 

9) I am a huge TreD fan, But Hopkins owned his A$$. Beat him deep singled up, beat him on key third downs, smoked him on a two point conversion. After the forced fumble, TreD vanished and Hopkins took him back to goalie school... 
 

10) this may be redundant but it bears repeating- Gore is done. DONE. He just drops his pads and runs into walls. Time to complete the youth movement at RB. 
 

11) there was one play where josh had Brown on a deep post, 4 to 5 steps, no safety.  Seemed like he saw but then checked down to Devin for 4 yards Even though the pro held up. I feel like he took those shots last year. 
 

12) Poyer had a rough day also.  I counted him as the goat(lowercase, not acronym) on Both TDs and a two point conversion beat to the corner or simply steamrolled. 
 

13) all in all it was red zone performance that made the difference. Texans got to 19 in 3 scores. It took the Bills 5 scoring drives to get there, and then OT of course is a coin toss....  but yeah 3rd and 18, And all the other stuff too. Oh well lots to learn from I guess. 

 

14) where are the hot WRs on blitzes ? 
 

15) saw several instances of Allen throwing guys open. That one laser to Duke that was called back due to a Kroft hold or Duke catching that EZ ball would’ve put him right around 400 yards of total offense generated on the day. Not bad for a first playoff game. He’s gonna be just fine.   

 

 

fun season all and all. ... now Beane go get some shiny new toys to add to this team Also ...   have Lorax sit down with Frank and explain how you know when it’s time.... 
 

Go Bills! 

 

 

I agree with more than half of your points, but I think you missed on a bunch.

 

1) That play where Josh got knocked to the ground was a very reasonable call. Neither guy hit him hard at all. Both pulled up. The guy who knocked him down reached down and took as much of his weight as he could to save him impact. Very reasonable no-call.

 

3) When the refs put the whistle away, you can't count on anyone to separate. Anyone. And yet Buffalo had guys open all game. Height and size were not the problem here.

 

4) I saw two plays where Brown had sideline problems, one of which seemed to be a result of lost footing. Yeah, the one where he kinda hopped forward was just a mistake. This isn't a problem he's had before. I'm not worried.

 

5) On the OT long heave to DiMarco, the play design worked. Josh threw to the wrong guy. You say Singletary was short of the marker. Fair enough, but it was 2nd and 13. It wasn't 3rd or 4th down. More, the CB was literally 10 yards away. Singletary was wide open and Singletary in the open field is always a good choice. He was going to get eight or ten yards and might easily have shook loose for a long one. And while I guess you can say Brown was bracketed on the play, the bracket was quite distant. There was plenty of room for Josh to hit him, it wouldn't even have taken a very accurate throw. He would've been quickly tackled but it would have been a gain of 17 or 18 yards and a first down. The play design worked. It confused them. McKenzie was triple-covered, for Pete's sake. They were confused. The throw went to the wrong guy.

 

9) White raked a fumble out of Hopkins' hands. That was huge. I saw four completions, including the fumble, plus the two-pointer. All but one was a short completion. Looked to me like Tre came out very well, especially when you consider the fumble. And Hopkins is a great player.

 

 

Again, I agree with a lot of your post, and there was a lot to complain about in that game. The whole team deserved to share the blame.

Edited January 8, 2020 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

The route was taking Brown out of bounds, not to the end zone. 

 

The only way that's a TD is if Brown runs a 3 yard deeper route. That's never a TD. 

 

 

It really wasn't. Brown was headed to the deep corner of the end zone. He was still on the numbers at the 10 when Josh threw. The throw led him outside and shallow. 

 

It would've been better if he'd put a soft touch throw up leading him straight. Could've been a TD not within range of the boundary.

 

Still, it was a catchable ball and Brown just made a mistake by not dragging his feet.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

9 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

The route was taking Brown out of bounds, not to the end zone. 

 

The only way that's a TD is if Brown runs a 3 yard deeper route. That's never a TD. 

right and In most nfl offenses to my knowledge, corner routes aren’t arbitrary depths depending on what the WR feels like doing, they are defined.  In this case the corner route covered exactly 20 yards from the line of scrimmage, from the 22 to the sideline 2, exactly as it was run and thrown. 
 

perfect execution until the poor footwork by brown 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 hours ago, ngbills said:

We can agree to disagree. When a WR raises his he is usually saying get me the ball I am wide fricken open. Not wait a few more seconds and put it on the sidelines to stop the clock. 

 

I played in college and a bit post college, then coached for a number of years. I have watched enough film to know a thing or two. Like I said not an awful pass just one Josh and Brown would want back and get that ball out sooner so Brown gets in the end zone with it. 

just as Browns arm starts to go up, Josh has already start throwing and brown has already made his break in a line right to the 2 TD line, exactly 20 yards from the line of scrimmage. 

 

 

 

I guess you are accustomed to a run an shoot offense without defined routes? 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood