To All the People Saying They Went Into a Shell up 16-0...You're Missing the Strategy

[HardyBoy]

The only goal there is to get up by three scores, period, end of story. They were in perfect position to do that before the Watt sack and Allen got rattled after that, which happens and impacted everything that came after it...and they still almost won. Put away the pitchforks.

 

That was the biggest game of Josh Allen's life he'll learn from this. Shoot it took Lebron James getting posted up by JJ Barea and the Mavs to learn the lessons that allowed him to mentally excel in that level of stress and expectation.

[Bing Bong]

I'd trust the defense to hang on to a 16 point lead too.

 

But going into a prevent defense and giving up a 3rd and 18 late in the game is going way too far in that shell.

[HardyBoy]

Just now, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

I'd trust the defense to hang on to a 16 point lead too.

 

But going into a prevent defense and giving up a 3rd and 18 late in the game is going way too far in that shell.

 

For sure on the 3rd and 18, but we need to wait for the All-22 before we can say too much there...could have been a blown coverage or a great play call against the defense that opened the middle if the field up. The issue is he wasn't contacted 5 yards sooner, not that they were in a shell.

[Bing Bong]

2 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

For sure on the 3rd and 18, but we need to wait for the All-22 before we can say too much there...could have been a blown coverage or a great play call against the defense that opened the middle if the field up. The issue is he wasn't contacted 5 yards sooner, not that they were in a shell.

Was it not a prevent defense though? Honestly asking it looked apparent from the TV replay as a way too conservative deep friggin zone

 

Can't stand a prevent D in most any situation

Edited January 5, 2020 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P

[Real McClappy]

2 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

I'd trust the defense to hang on to a 16 point lead too.

 

But going into a prevent defense and giving up a 3rd and 18 late in the game is going way too far in that shell.

Was the 2nd half the Texans O half time adjustments or our D scheme? It's crazy how badly the D dominated the Texans the first half only giving them 91yards of total offense. Then the 2nd half happened. Not stopping them 2X on 2pt conversions alone is uncharacteristic.

 

3rd and 18 simply cannot happen.

[djp14150]

12 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

The only goal there is to get up by three scores, period, end of story. They were in perfect position to do that before the Watt sack and Allen got rattled after that, which happens and impacted everything that came after it...and they still almost won. Put away the pitchforks.

 

That was the biggest game of Josh Allen's life he'll learn from this. Shoot it took Lebron James getting posted up by JJ Barea and the Mavs to learn the lessons that allowed him to mentally excel in that level of stress and expectation.

 

 

All season they they have been soft and protective of getting FGs instead of trying to get TDS

 

with Blls of Kelly they’d get up by 3 scores which then likely changes a team play calling getting them ne dimensional.

 

[HardyBoy]

4 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

Was it not a prevent defense though? Honestly asking it looked apparent from the TV replay as a way too conservative deep friggin zone

 

They were in prevent from what I could tell, and it worked perfectly until he was able to run for a first...he caught the ball in the middle of the field 10 yards or so from a first down with the entire defense ready to swarm and tackle him short by 5 yards...they were too far away though...why is the question, I'm thinking that was on players and not coaches...again, the ball went to the exact spot you would want in that situation to force a 4th down.

Edited January 5, 2020 by HardyBoy

[eSJayDee]

It seems our strategy is to try & win games 17-13.  I was saying in the 3rd quarter we need over 20 pts to win.

Our TD on the 1st drive was largely a result of 2 plats where we had the Dee fooled.  After that drive?  Only FGs.  You're not going to win too many games against good competition in today's NFL scoring less than 20 points.

[HardyBoy]

4 minutes ago, djp14150 said:

 

 

All season they they have been soft and protective of getting FGs instead of trying to get TDS

 

with Blls of Kelly they’d get up by 3 scores which then likely changes a team play calling getting them ne dimensional.

 

 

The goal there is 3 scores...doesn't matter if it's a td of a fg...3 scores and it's basically game over.

[familykwi]

7 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

For sure on the 3rd and 18, but we need to wait for the All-22 before we can say too much there...could have been a blown coverage or a great play call against the defense that opened the middle if the field up. The issue is he wasn't contacted 5 yards sooner, not that they were in a shell.

My issue on the 3rd & 18 is that the 3 middle defenders were all set up behind the line to gain.  They should have been no deeper so they could react forward ensuring no 1st down.  That set up was poorly executed.

[Phil The Thrill]

5 minutes ago, djp14150 said:

 

 

All season they they have been soft and protective of getting FGs instead of trying to get TDS

 

with Blls of Kelly they’d get up by 3 scores which then likely changes a team play calling getting them ne dimensional.

 

 
I think that comparing Jim Kelly to Josh Allen will lead you to the answer 

[HardyBoy]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

 
I think that comparing Jim Kelly to Josh Allen will lead you to the answer 

 

Kelly in 91 or Kelly in 87?

1 minute ago, familykwi said:

My issue on the 3rd & 18 is that the 3 middle defenders were all set up behind the line to gain.  They should have been no deeper so they could react forward ensuring no 1st down.  That set up was poorly executed.

 

I think that's probably ok...I mean I'm not a football coach or player, so maybe someone could weigh in, but I would think you keep everything in front of you and swarm to get the tackle. I really think the play worked exactly as designed.

[Solomon Grundy]

24 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

The only goal there is to get up by three scores, period, end of story. They were in perfect position to do that before the Watt sack and Allen got rattled after that, which happens and impacted everything that came after it...and they still almost won. Put away the pitchforks.

 

That was the biggest game of Josh Allen's life he'll learn from this. Shoot it took Lebron James getting posted up by JJ Barea and the Mavs to learn the lessons that allowed him to mentally excel in that level of stress and expectation.

The Josh Allen fumble was the CRITICAL play of the game. Team was marching down for possible FG (at minimum)  that would've extended lead.

Edited January 5, 2020 by the skycap

[HardyBoy]

8 minutes ago, the skycap said:

The Josh Allen fumble was the CRITICAL play of the game. Team was marching down for possible FG (at minimum)  that would've extended lead.

 

Yup, huge play. Seriously, at 16-0 the strategy is to get it to 19-0 first. Bad strategy would be going for a td and taking a sack and getting out of fg range...now, I think on that Watt sack that sparked the comeback, they were trying an out and up double move with Duke, which is why Allen turned right into the sack, but need to A22 for that. In my opinion that should have been a draw or a quick hitter to get in better fg range, and I think they went for a td...which is why this they went all conservative narrative is a bit annoying, or at the very least premature.

[Mr. WEO]

An elite D doesn't give up a 3rd Q shutout.  

[Penfield45]

if you can't score more than 1 TD against the 28th ranked defense in the league you don't deserve to move on in the playoffs. STOP blaming the defense 

 

we would have been humiliated by KC or Baltimore in the next round. this offense isn't good enough for playoff football. 

[transplantbillsfan]

I told @GunnerBill this earlier in the week:

 

I don't think any of us are missing McDermott's strategy, we just think it's a bad one in today's NFL.

 

Today's NFL is built around the offense. The rules themselves favor the offense. In-game playcalling should never change unless it absolutely has to because either it's not working (clearly not the case based on our 1st half) or you've fallen seriously behind (which we didn't).

 

On top of that, it's probably a bad idea to veer away from things that have worked for your offense recently, and with that I'm talking about the no-huddle we'd been using with Daboll talking into Allen's headset about coverage and what he saw as long as he could.

 

I fear that McDermott isn't ideal for the new NFL. He's good enough that he'll keep his job I think. But his coaching mentality and approach is always going to leave open the risk of good opposing QBs doing exactly what Watson did yesterday. 

 

And by the way, I call total BS that 3 scores is the benchmark for McDermott. I think 3 scores with a half to go would be almost acceptable as a benchmark. 

 

Almost.

 

However, McDermott wasn't playing for a 3 score lead. If he were, he wouldn't have run Gore up the middle on 1st down to end the 1st half with 30 seconds left on the Texans 23 up by 10. He would have allowed Allen to use those 30 seconds to get off 5 or 6 good plays to try to score a TD and THEN be up by 3 scores.

 

Instead, he coached like a weeny, wasted 2 downs, was almost bailed out by a great pass to the EZ that Duke couldn't come down with, we kick the FG and go into the half up by just 2 scores against one of the best QB/WR combos in the NFL.

 

Honestly the more I think about this game, the more it irritates me.

 

Allen made a bunch of mistakes and has a lot to work on this offseason. But the thing about Allen is he's not stubborn. He knows he made critical mistakes and you can expect he'll grind this offseason to fix them so he comes back better for 2020.

 

I feel like McDermott is too unaware and/or stubborn to realize that he has work to do with his gameday coaching and maybe needs to reevaluate his whole approach to the game.

 

I want a perennial winner year in and year out. McDermott's coaching doesn't set us up for that because he will always leave windows open for the other team to get back into it.

 

It was almost shameful the was after the game yesterday McDermott seemed to put the onus of the loss on Josh when he said something about Josh trying to do too much--which he did, but probably because McDermott's coaching approach forced him into it--rather than holding himself personally accountable.

 

Here's to hoping everyone gets better this offseason.

[pennstate10]

31 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

Was it not a prevent defense though? Honestly asking it looked apparent from the TV replay as a way too conservative deep friggin zone

 

Can't stand a prevent D in most any situation

It wasnt a "prevent " D.  Was a conventional cover 4 zone.  

The LBs (at least 49) just dropped too deep.  A bad, bad mistake.  I hope they learn from it.

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

I told @GunnerBill this earlier in the week:

 

I don't think any of us are missing McDermott's strategy, we just think it's a bad one in today's NFL.

 

Today's NFL is built around the offense. The rules themselves favor the offense. In-game playcalling should never change unless it absolutely has to because either it's not working (clearly not the case based on our 1st half) or you've fallen seriously behind (which we didn't).

 

On top of that, it's probably a bad idea to veer away from things that have worked for your offense recently, and with that I'm talking about the no-huddle we'd been using with Daboll talking into Allen's headset about coverage and what he saw as long as he could.

 

I fear that McDermott isn't ideal for the new NFL. He's good enough that he'll keep his job I think. But his coaching mentality and approach is always going to leave open the risk of good opposing QBs doing exactly what Watson did yesterday. 

 

And by the way, I call total BS that 3 scores is the benchmark for McDermott. I think 3 scores with a half to go would be almost acceptable as a benchmark. 

 

Almost.

 

However, McDermott wasn't playing for a 3 score lead. If he were, he wouldn't have run Gore up the middle on 1st down to end the 1st half with 30 seconds left on the Texans 23 up by 10. He would have allowed Allen to use those 30 seconds to get off 5 or 6 good plays to try to score a TD and THEN be up by 3 scores.

 

Instead, he coached like a weeny, wasted 2 downs, was almost bailed out by a great pass to the EZ that Duke couldn't come down with, we kick the FG and go into the half up by just 2 scores against one of the best QB/WR combos in the NFL.

 

Honestly the more I think about this game, the more it irritates me.

 

Allen made a bunch of mistakes and has a lot to work on this offseason. But the thing about Allen is he's not stubborn. He knows he made critical mistakes and you can expect he'll grind this offseason to fix them so he comes back better for 2020.

 

I feel like McDermott is too unaware and/or stubborn to realize that he has work to do with his gameday coaching and maybe needs to reevaluate his whole approach to the game.

 

I want a perennial winner year in and year out. McDermott's coaching doesn't set us up for that because he will always leave windows open for the other team to get back into it.

 

It was almost shameful the was after the game yesterday McDermott seemed to put the onus of the loss on Josh when he said something about Josh trying to do too much--which he did, but probably because McDermott's coaching approach forced him into it--rather than holding himself personally accountable.

 

Here's to hoping everyone gets better this offseason.

 

 

Well put.  A very subtle shove of his QB under the bus.  Meanwhile he's clapping away when he sees his ancient TE dumpster pickup and the 6th toe of a FB going long on a pass play.

 

If McD can watch that game today or whenever he does, and concludes he has the future of his Offense safe in his current OC's hands.....then there's not much one can say..

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

I told @GunnerBill this earlier in the week:

 

I don't think any of us are missing McDermott's strategy, we just think it's a bad one in today's NFL.

 

Today's NFL is built around the offense. The rules themselves favor the offense. In-game playcalling should never change unless it absolutely has to because either it's not working (clearly not the case based on our 1st half) or you've fallen seriously behind (which we didn't).

 

On top of that, it's probably a bad idea to veer away from things that have worked for your offense recently, and with that I'm talking about the no-huddle we'd been using with Daboll talking into Allen's headset about coverage and what he saw as long as he could.

 

I fear that McDermott isn't ideal for the new NFL. He's good enough that he'll keep his job I think. But his coaching mentality and approach is always going to leave open the risk of good opposing QBs doing exactly what Watson did yesterday. 

 

And by the way, I call total BS that 3 scores is the benchmark for McDermott. I think 3 scores with a half to go would be almost acceptable as a benchmark. 

 

Almost.

 

However, McDermott wasn't playing for a 3 score lead. If he were, he wouldn't have run Gore up the middle on 1st down to end the 1st half with 30 seconds left on the Texans 23 up by 10. He would have allowed Allen to use those 30 seconds to get off 5 or 6 good plays to try to score a TD and THEN be up by 3 scores.

 

Instead, he coached like a weeny, wasted 2 downs, was almost bailed out by a great pass to the EZ that Duke couldn't come down with, we kick the FG and go into the half up by just 2 scores against one of the best QB/WR combos in the NFL.

 

Honestly the more I think about this game, the more it irritates me.

 

Allen made a bunch of mistakes and has a lot to work on this offseason. But the thing about Allen is he's not stubborn. He knows he made critical mistakes and you can expect he'll grind this offseason to fix them so he comes back better for 2020.

 

I feel like McDermott is too unaware and/or stubborn to realize that he has work to do with his gameday coaching and maybe needs to reevaluate his whole approach to the game.

 

I want a perennial winner year in and year out. McDermott's coaching doesn't set us up for that because he will always leave windows open for the other team to get back into it.

 

It was almost shameful the was after the game yesterday McDermott seemed to put the onus of the loss on Josh when he said something about Josh trying to do too much--which he did, but probably because McDermott's coaching approach forced him into it--rather than holding himself personally accountable.

 

Here's to hoping everyone gets better this offseason.

 

And I still say the problems on offense are 75% talent and 25% scheme / coaching.