GunnerBill Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 18 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Such as? (reminder: I live in St Louis and do follow the Rams, though never a fan) I mainly was thinking about the ownership situation which I was reminded of by the Carolina situation. I think Kroenke (who I have lots of experience of from my other interest) came in as the majority owner and it was known he wanted his own guys and when the team started slow there seemed to be an inevitability that crept through the organisation. I also seem to remember some suggestion that Spags wanted more vets to win quick (probably knowing that the owner's finger was already on the trigger) and the GM at the time was advocating a more patient approach. I remember Bradford getting hit a lot after they had brought FA OL in. Reminded be of the year the Bills did that with Langston Walker et al and it failed miserably. I might be getting my years mixed up but wasn't that also the year Amendola went down for the season the first or second week? He was the only decent receiver on the team. Not saying McDaniels didn't do a poor job there or that Bradford didn't regress. But when I think about that year I think organisational tire fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4BillsintheBurgh Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I think this is a terrible take. That's actually the sad irony of the Pats. They are well coached. They make good personnel decisions. They have had a legit great QB and a series of legit great TE and WR and defensive players. Their success is in no way 100% due to cheating. They could be a good to great team without it. However, the extreme sustained and enduring nature of their success is probably due to "ruthless pursuit of every competitive edge" as Sanchez said, ie, cheating in every way. I think the reason that coaches and coordinators from NE have a mixed track record elsewhere is that Belicheck is a rigid control freak who doesn't share any info he doesn't need to. "Just Do Your Job". He keeps them more than busy doing whatever it is he assigns them to do. So the assistant coaches, and especially the ones who are two steps down the food chain like Daboll, are left missing key pieces of how to make the whole car drive. And the better "team players" they are (ie putting all into doing their job) the worse for them. I think that's why we see Daboll scheme individual plays that are clever to brilliant and either work, or result in open guys, but overall as a whole the offense doesn't seem coherent and flexible. For me the reason the minions from the pats*** don't work out is the total effort of the staff it takes to run the system. You need everyone on that staff to be giving the kind of effort that is difficult to manage for a lot of folks. I don't think any of the assistants don't understand what it takes, it's just impossible to find that many folks so committed in a year or two, because if it takes longer than that you're out of a job. This also happens to be why I believe brady is the not goat at qb, he is simply the best qb of the best system ever devised. If brady goes to another team he would flounder and look nothing like "himself" just as many of these former assistant coaches have. Edited December 31, 2019 by 4BillsintheBurgh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 5 minutes ago, 4BillsintheBurgh said: For me the reason the minions from the pats*** don't work out is the total effort of the staff it takes to run the system. You need everyone on that staff to be giving the kind of effort that is difficult to manage for a lot of folks. I don't think any of the assistants don't understand what it takes, it's just impossible to find that many folks so committed in a year or two, because if it takes longer than that you're out of a job. This also happens to be why I believe brady is the not goat at qb, he is simply the best qb of the best system ever devised. If brady goes to another team he would flounder and look nothing like "himself" just as many of these former assistant coaches have. Would you say the same for Brees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 11 hours ago, Best Player Available said: Makes you wonder what that turd Patrica is up to in Detroit. Whatever it is, it isn't working. Another Belichick*** coaching tree flunky. Bill O'Brien has done pretty well, and Flores looks like the real deal. Some people in the league actually feel Flores should be in the running for coach of the year given what he did with that woeful roster. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 23 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I mainly was thinking about the ownership situation which I was reminded of by the Carolina situation. I think Kroenke (who I have lots of experience of from my other interest) came in as the majority owner and it was known he wanted his own guys and when the team started slow there seemed to be an inevitability that crept through the organisation. I also seem to remember some suggestion that Spags wanted more vets to win quick (probably knowing that the owner's finger was already on the trigger) and the GM at the time was advocating a more patient approach. I remember Bradford getting hit a lot after they had brought FA OL in. Reminded be of the year the Bills did that with Langston Walker et al and it failed miserably. I might be getting my years mixed up but wasn't that also the year Amendola went down for the season the first or second week? He was the only decent receiver on the team. Not saying McDaniels didn't do a poor job there or that Bradford didn't regress. But when I think about that year I think organisational tire fire. Amendola did go down for the season. It's true that the Rams didn't have a star corps of WR and it's true that Bradford got hit a lot, but he had people to throw to. He held onto the ball too long. A lot of it was not dissimilar to what we've seen with Allen at times - he would hold on to the ball and you could see the gears grinding as he tried to process what he was supposed to do given what he was seeing. McDaniels had a lot to do with that. He brought in a very complex offensive system and a thick complex playbook that was completely different from what they'd had the year before, and he did a lot of what Daboll tried to do initially, trying to create "surprise" for the defense by unusual use of personnel instead of just putting the best personnel in the best position to make plays. Bringing in McDaniels and Bradford's apparent regression were a big part of what sent Spagnulo out the door after 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Amendola did go down for the season. It's true that the Rams didn't have a star corps of WR and it's true that Bradford got hit a lot, but he had people to throw to. He held onto the ball too long. A lot of it was not dissimilar to what we've seen with Allen at times - he would hold on to the ball and you could see the gears grinding as he tried to process what he was supposed to do given what he was seeing. McDaniels had a lot to do with that. He brought in a very complex offensive system and a thick complex playbook that was completely different from what they'd had the year before, and he did a lot of what Daboll tried to do initially, trying to create "surprise" for the defense by unusual use of personnel instead of just putting the best personnel in the best position to make plays. Bringing in McDaniels and Bradford's apparent regression were a big part of what sent Spagnulo out the door after 2. I don't disagree but there were things happening inside the building around the ownership change that helped that season go south. I don't think McDaniels did a great job but I also think it is unfair to put a lot of it just on him. I think Spags was basically done for when they lost their first 3 and I think everyone in the building knew it. Edited January 1, 2020 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Meanwhile, early reports indicate Bill knew nothing of this most recent incident (yeah right): https://nesn.com/2020/01/nfl-rumors-no-evidence-found-linking-bill-belichick-to-patriots-video-controversy/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Doesn't matter. They're the most tainted franchise in NFL history and are treated as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 18 minutes ago, Doc said: Doesn't matter. They're the most tainted franchise in NFL history and are treated as such. Pro Hall of Fame should treat Kraft, Billicheat and Br*dy like baseball does Pete Rose. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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