Inigo Montoya Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season. The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar. Look at the contracts and stats of those three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season. Odell Beckham Jr compensation; 2019 $17,000,000 2020 $14,250,000 2021 $15,750,000 2022 $15,000,000 2023 $ 15,000,000 OBJ 2019 production through 12 games; 57 catches 805 yards 2 TDs Cole Beasley compensation; 2019 $11,400,000 2020 $5,600,000 2021 $5,900,000 2022 $6,100,000 Beasley 2019 production through 12 games; 55 catches 635 yards 5 TDs John Brown compensation; 2019 $10,700,000 2020 $8,150,000 2021 $8,150,000 John Brown 2019 production through 12 games; 61 catches 882 yards 5 TDs OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building. It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football. I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not. Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years. It's getting hard to argue against the position that Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now. Edited December 6, 2019 by Inigo Montoya 29 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building. Early signs are encouraging though. Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley. Speaking of those two, Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there. The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them. He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone. He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) I think most of the experts would agree that the McBean combo has been great. Can't argue against it the results speak for themselves. We're 9-3 going on a 2nd playoff birth in 3 years ... yes, that's the Bills we're talking about lol. Only thing left to do is see where the ceiling is and how long they can sustain success. Edited December 6, 2019 by dayman 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveorhatembillsfan4life Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season. The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar. Lets take a look at the three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season. Odell Beckham Jr compensation; 2019 $17,000,000 2020 $14,250,000 2021 $15,750,000 2022 $15,000,000 2023 $ 15,000,000 OBJ 2019 production through 12 games; 57 catches 805 yards 2 TDs Cole Beasley compensation; 2019 $11,400,000 2020 $5,600,000 2021 $5,900,000 2022 $6,100,000 Beasley 2019 production through 12 games; 55 catches 635 yards 5 TDs John Brown compensation; 2019 $10,700,000 2020 $8,150,000 2021 $8,150,000 John Brown 2019 production through 12 games; 61 catches 882 yards 5 TDs OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building. It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football. I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not. Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years. I think Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now. I agree! And I love how Beane has structured the contracts with more Paid out in the first year. I think his goal is if his signing doesn’t pan out he has no intention of taking huge dead cap hits. Edited December 6, 2019 by loveorhatembillsfan4life 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twist_to_open Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 17 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season. The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar. Lets take a look at the three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season. Odell Beckham Jr compensation; 2019 $17,000,000 2020 $14,250,000 2021 $15,750,000 2022 $15,000,000 2023 $ 15,000,000 OBJ 2019 production through 12 games; 57 catches 805 yards 2 TDs Cole Beasley compensation; 2019 $11,400,000 2020 $5,600,000 2021 $5,900,000 2022 $6,100,000 Beasley 2019 production through 12 games; 55 catches 635 yards 5 TDs John Brown compensation; 2019 $10,700,000 2020 $8,150,000 2021 $8,150,000 John Brown 2019 production through 12 games; 61 catches 882 yards 5 TDs OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building. It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football. I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not. Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years. It's getting hard to argue against the position that Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now. Those numbers may be a tad misleading, Beasley and Brown have a better quarterback throwing them the ball. 7 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo Montoya Posted December 6, 2019 Author Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, BillsVet said: There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building. Early signs are encouraging though. Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley. Speaking of those two, Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there. The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them. He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone. He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't. All fair points BillsVet. I'm not here to argue that OBJ isn't a more talented receiver. My larger point is about how you build a competitive team. I don't know if you do need a bunch of elite players to win a championship. I think there is also something to be said for building a roster top to bottom with solid, team oriented players. I'd argue that the only elite talent on the Patriots is their head coach and Stephon Gilmore, but they are still winning. I think Brady is more of a game manager right now. Brown and Beasley are both on team friendly deals as well so if their play declines Beane and Co. can move on without hamstringing the franchise going forward. I think next year we will only be a piece or two away from contending for a Super Bowl. We have $90mm in cap space to go out and find those pieces and I trust Beane to find them. I don't think there will be as much hesitation from free agents to come to Buffalo either after this season. Edited December 6, 2019 by Inigo Montoya 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Another good outside receiver will really open up the offense more. Was hoping Foster was going to be that guy but it’s not looking like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 I was saying stay away from OBJ and AB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 16 minutes ago, BillsVet said: There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building. Early signs are encouraging though. Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley. Speaking of those two, Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there. The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them. He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone. He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't. You can take the OBJ’s of the world. He is part of what you describe as Cleveland’s “internal strife at every level”. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) I don’t think OBJ would of fit in to the culture McDermott and Beane want. OBJ looks to draw attention to himself, the Bills players look to praise each other. Edited December 6, 2019 by atlbillsfan1975 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 47 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said: Another good outside receiver will really open up the offense more. Was hoping Foster was going to be that guy but it’s not looking like it. You are right about a getting a 2nd good outside receiver, it will help the entire offense/team. Really wish Foster would reappear so to speak. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Tim Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 I would certainly rather spend 25 million on 4 WR who are good but not elite then spend 30 on 2 elite recievers and need to be cheap after that. Your 4th reciever needs to be able to make plays because almost any single reciever can removed from a game plan. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1 hour ago, dayman said: We're 9-3 going on a 2nd playoff birth in 3 years Please don't do that! 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kangaxx Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 We need to draft Tamorrion Terry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Junction Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: I don’t think OBJ would of fit in to the culture McDermott and Beane want. OBJ looks to draw attention to himself, the Bills players look to praise each other. Sometimes guys like that can fit in. You can only have so many of them before it changes the locker room though. The Browns have several paired with a few knuckleheads and a coach that doesn’t have control of the team. I’d imagine there are a few teams that OBJ would STFU on and just play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1 hour ago, twist_to_open said: Those numbers may be a tad misleading, Beasley and Brown have a better quarterback throwing them the ball. He is also taking away throws by running including for TDs but you do not hear any complaints from wide receivers that he is hurting their stats. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 The Browns didn’t just give up money/cap space. They had to trade for OBJ. Makes it even worse. They gave up 1st and 3rd round picks and Peppers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1 hour ago, Inigo Montoya said: All fair points BillsVet. I'm not here to argue that OBJ isn't a more talented receiver. My larger point is about how you build a competitive team. I don't know if you do need a bunch of elite players to win a championship. I think there is also something to be said for building a roster top to bottom with solid, team oriented players. I'd argue that the only elite talent on the Patriots is their head coach and Stephon Gilmore, but they are still winning. I think Brady is more of a game manager right now. Brown and Beasley are both on team friendly deals as well so if their play declines Beane and Co. can move on without hamstringing the franchise going forward. I think next year we will only be a piece or two away from contending for a Super Bowl. We have $90mm in cap space to go out and find those pieces and I trust Beane to find them. I don't think there will be as much hesitation from free agents to come to Buffalo either after this season. Both the Brown and Beasley deals are at their market value and I wouldn't consider them team-friendly or, for lack of a better term, unfriendly. I'm concerned with McD's overall personnel decision strategy, as evidenced by their move to take Cody Ford over D.K. Metcalf. If you've got a chance to get a skill type who can demand defensive attention, that's more important than plodding interior OL types like Ford. You can find those guys later or in UFA on team friendly contracts. You don't find top skill types there. 1 hour ago, Binghamton Beast said: You can take the OBJ’s of the world. He is part of what you describe as Cleveland’s “internal strife at every level”. Not quite. He is a guy who plays in any system, but has been used as a decoy in many respects by a HC who is not up to par for the NFL. There aren't many learned Bills fans who would say no to OBJ because he makes plays. Sometimes HC's have to learn how to manage personalities and not avoid them. High performing people in any environment make the difference and in a results oriented environment they can be the difference between winning and losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Odell pretty much sucks this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMDman Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 16 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said: Odell pretty much sucks this season. as an OBJ fantasy owner I can say he doesn't pretty much suck, he DOES suck 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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